Nurseries staying open

[meow1989]

To coin a mn phrase: is Boris on glue?!

So now I will have to pay to keep my toddler off to keep him (and us) safe?!

@Roughasabadgersbum

So school staff are at risk but nursery staff are super immune

No. Nurseries are lower risk; smaller groups, fewer parents at one time, less mixing. Easier to bubble. Under 5s also spread COVID less - there have been no major outbreaks attributed to nurseries, where as there have been several with school. One of the fastest growing groups for infections and hospitalisations is secondary age children.

Nursery presents fewer risks.

Absolutely spot on.

I absolutely sympathies with nursery staff who are worried. And I don’t think they have ever been adequately recognised or paid well enough. I just don’t agree with characterising as selfish arseholes those parents who are sending their children to nurseries that are open - it’s unnecessary and inaccurate

@Hardbackwriter

I think it's quite bizarre that this thread is so full of nursery workers arguing that nursery has no value for children and that SAHPs - or, it would seem, parents who work at home - are just being lazy if they use one. Do you really want people to agree with this and so just stop using your nursery? Or are you hoping for some sort of scenario where people indefinitely pay hundreds of pounds a month to not send their child to nursery?

This!!! I would hate to think that this is what the people looking after my children think. I dont send my child for "childcare" I send him for all the many benefits we are told it has for a childs development, I mean I have read studies that say children who do a year-18months of nursery/pre-school do better at school than kids that dont. There is also a reason that the government pay for the children of parents who dont work to attend nursery, its not for childcare is it.

So a bunch of nursery workers calling us selfish and lazy parents is beyond shocking!! I hope staff at my childs nursery dont just think they are "babysitting" (i dont believe they do!)

The evidence we have available to us shows us that spread within nursery is much lower than in primary school, which is lower still than senior school. But heaven forbid we consider that when taking into account what is best for our children who had had a hell of a year.

I work in an early years setting and at 44 am the youngest staff member.
I shall not be sending my child to nursery as I think why should I risk the health of her, the staff and bringing anything home.
Partner works all over the country so again safer for all at home. 7 yr old is home too

Ok Tiquismisquis you’ll be right! 18 years of experience, one BA, one post grad degree in early childhood development, an HNC and HND in early years and parent of 4. What do I know?🤷‍♀️

I never said they don’t enjoy being with other children, but they play alongside them. Yes there are benefit to this but Is NOT essential to their development at this early stage and won’t have a lasting effect, especially when it’s for such a short period of time.

I work in an early years setting and am happy that we are open to support children and their families.

I'm aware completely that they are less.likely to spread ..it's my personal opinion that's all. Parents are the ones who know their children and what's best for them and their situation.
Early years is very important and vital to.learning and growth .
No parent should be made to feel like crap for their decision ..I also don't think that parents should pay retainers for children who are funded. The LA need to support nursery and pay the funding ...

“ I never said they don’t enjoy being with other children, but they play alongside them. Yes there are benefit to this but Is NOT essential to their development at this early stage and won’t have a lasting effect, especially when it’s for such a short period of time.”

This is fine, but can we stop with the “parents who can’t be arsed to spend time with their toddler” thing (which I know you haven’t said yourself) because it is not helpful when people are making decisions while they are stressed and desperate

@LollyBeebee123

Ok Tiquismisquis you’ll be right! 18 years of experience, one BA, one post grad degree in early childhood development, an HNC and HND in early years and parent of 4. What do I know?🤷‍♀️

I never said they don’t enjoy being with other children, but they play alongside them. Yes there are benefit to this but Is NOT essential to their development at this early stage and won’t have a lasting effect, especially when it’s for such a short period of time.

You really must tell the writers of the early years framework that peer socialisation is irrelevant to under 4s as they seem to think it's quite a big deal, the poor misguided fools. A lot of other child development experts also think that parallel play is an important developmental stage, the idiots!

I think it’s worth people remembering that parents and nursery workers are largely operating from the same position.

Parents who are sending their kids to nursery are largely doing so because they don’t want to or can’t afford to lose their jobs. And for many, that’s what another loss of childcare would amount too. Very few - especially those with less flexible jobs or less flexible employers - will have much leave or flexibility left to call on. Childcare bubbles are not an available option for everyone. Not all jobs (and not all toddlers) can be done while an under 5 careens around the house under-supervised.

Nursery workers who are worried and afraid for their health are going to work largely because they don’t want to or can’t afford to lose their jobs too.

Everyone has a beef here with the government - for ‘encouraging’ rather than requiring employers to act decently, for providing inadequate financial support for nursery businesses, for not enforcing and funding the implementing of safety guidance for nurseries, for not providing for the more vulnerable workers to be properly protected while infection rates are so high, or in other ways finding a better way to balance the needs of working parents and nursery workers.

I have sympathy with everyone here. In the first lockdown I had one school aged and one nursery aged child. Now I have two school aged children and while having to teach reception is a ball ache my five year old’s maturity and ability to do things without input or supervision is streets ahead of where it was in March. I was fortunate then to have a flexible employer but the first months of lockdown nearly broke me. I wish all of you all the best - there are no winners here.

Hardbackwriter wow you are just awful! Good luck early years sector in England. Looks like you need it!🍀

What, because I pointed out you were wrong? I have actually said repeatedly that I have a lot of sympathy for early years workers, that I feel conflicted about sending my own child to nursery and that I am considering not sending him once I start maternity leave and so don't need to work. I am just angry at people accusing parents of being selfish for using a service that remains open, I also have sympathy for parents who will be unable to work effectively or, perhaps more importantly, care well for their children if nurseries close, and I think it's upsetting to see childcare professionals insist that nursery is an indulgence with no value and that parents should voluntarily pay money to not use them or be labelled as terrible people. I have a really good relationship with my child's nursery, have always complied with all of their Covid measures and try generally to be as considerate towards them as I can be. One of the reasons I would rather they didn't shut is that I don't think they'll survive if they shut again, they barely did last time, and I'd be devastated both that we would lose something we value so much but also that the staff would then lose their jobs.

You have expressed my feelings very well hardbackwriter. I am at the opposite end as I am just about to finish maternity leave but still have a few more weeks to go before I have to go back to work

Haven’t read the thread. I am a nursery worker terrified to go to work. We can’t bubble because of the nature of our setting and the building we are in. I feel like we’ve been thrown under a bus and would love the option to stay at home with my 3 year old instead I have to take him with me.

Not sure if this has been posted earlier, but explains why the DofE pushed to keep nurseries etc open during this lockdown

www.eyalliance.org.uk/news/2021/01/dfe-provides-update-rationale-behind-decision-keep-early-years-providers-open

@JassyRadlett

Very well said!

I think a lot of posters on this thread...and Mumsnet in general...forget that these are not just words on a screen. We are all parents trying to navigate the best way that they can through this shitty storm, but we are all in different boats, so to speak.

I fully appreciate parent's struggles to work from home and it is not them that I am upset with for sending their children in - it works for them and their family and under normal circumstances would be happy to welcome all children into our setting. It is the government who have placed our sector at the bottom of the public health pile, against SAGE advice and individuals who do not appreciate that we are...you know...human as well, with our own circumstances and families to worry about.

Not sure I trust the DFE’s rationale when they insisted the exact same thing about schools.

Look where that got us.

If nurseries are not spreading it why are half the workforce in my nursery of with covid? Your child may not get sick with it, or even show symptoms but they can spread it and make someone very sick with it.

As my DH says that’s why I’ll never be a millionaire.

I wish we were in smaller groups almostslim . Our nursery school is in a village hall, some days we have up to 35 children aged 2-4 and 8 members of staff. During the first lockdown small groups were created and the room was properly divided. Now it's everyone in together.

[quote Oopsiedaisy1]@Remmy123

Perhaps some more public appreciation for a start. To feel valued.

To be more protected. The windows in my nursery don’t even open.

To dare ask that I ought to be paid a bit more... we know that will never happen, our frontline NHS didn’t get more than a bloody clap.[/quote]
Yep there's no ventilation at our nursery school and no small groups either ( I can't remember who said that was the difference between nurseries and schools). Our nursery school is in a village hall, some days up to 35 children and 8 members of staff

@Ilovegreentomatoes

If nurseries are not spreading it why are half the workforce in my nursery of with covid? Your child may not get sick with it, or even show symptoms but they can spread it and make someone very sick with it.

Think this is a bit unfair. Are your workforce only having contact with the kids ? So no family / going out after nursery / no shopping / no interacting between each other ? That would be the only way you could assume kids are the ones spreading it in nursery.

@CateJW There is also a reason that the government pay for the children of parents who dont work to attend nursery, its not for childcare is it

Actually yes it is for childcare, part of the government’s strategy to get parents off of universal credits and into jobs. Still, it is important that vulnerable young children have access to childcare and early years education.

Even though nursery’s have been told that they can stay open for all children, parents should be choosing not to send their child into nursery and keep them at home if they can do so. We are in a national pandemic Crisis.

@dumbledory
Excellent post. You have my support - everyone deserves a safe working environment - and I hope this anomaly is addressed soon.