Email from Head - primary school will be open on Monday

[CloseSchoolsProtecttheNHS]

Just had an email from our head teacher 'reassuring' us that the (primary) school will be open as usual to all pupils on Monday morning. Personally, I find this far from reassuring in the middle of the worst part of a pandemic. We are in a county that borders London and rates are over 600 per 100,000.

I'm assuming the staff are either non NEU or have agreed to go in anyway? How can the Head be SO sure they'll open, as to actually write an email on a Saturday night saying so?

@Esse321

But it is safe and that's why the scientists and government advisors are saying schools back on Monday.

Sage have said it isn't and have urged a further 2 weeks of them being closed.

Union have said open to keyworker and vulnerable and remote for rest.

@Theotherrudolph

Every year reception teachers complain kids can’t do up their own coats or shoes, can’t use cutlery properly, wet themselves, pick their nose, lose their jumpers and put on each other’s, fidget with things etc etc. You think those same four and five year old kids can wash their hands, put on a clean mask (which they haven’t already lost/eaten/dropped in a puddle), fit it properly around their face, not touch or fiddle with it for several hours, carefully remove it and dispose of it safely then wash their hands again? With a 1:15 ratio? They’ll end up wearing each other’s, half wearing them, touching them, chewing them and generally spreading virus around that way instead. Just close school.

But they could do it if we had higher expectations of children.

Children in other countries can and do so biologically it is a possibility.

Nothing from our school so far. Fingers crossed for opening as planned.

Work in a school. My union has advised it's unsafe to return to school. Our school would normally check with staff to ensure they have sufficient numbers in before confirming whether school fully open or not. This needs to be done first before informing parents of the situation. Luckily we don't go back tomorrow so have time to assess.

Nothing from our school either but we have an inset day which I imagine the head is extremely grateful for as it gives her some breathing room.

I am surprised though at people saying schools won't know how many keyworker kids they need to cater for - our school asked parents to confirm their keyworker status in the autumn term so that they could make these kinds of plans. They have also got firm plans for home learning which can be put in place at short notice either for bubble closures or a full closure. I thought all schools were supposed to have this?

Slight diversion from thread based in PP (Sorry) I am aware of how unpopular this view is on MN but still I feel it strongly - No, I don't want my children to be forced to wear face coverings at school. They hate it (they tolerate it if we need to travel or shop, but they still hate it) and I think it's barbaric to force children to do something so uncomfortable all day long when they have no choice to refuse and to make them miss education and social interaction if they do. No one is forcing adults to do this (and if they did I think there would be a much bigger push back). Age is a bit relevant but not the only factor (DC are Y7 so if they'd just been born a few months earlier would not be subject to mask wearing or testing) it just rages me all the parents of primary aged children on here saying secondary pupils should 'just' wear masks every day. My DCs are just a few months older than the precious little cherubs at primary school who don't have to and it isn't a small thing at all**

My 'precious little cherubs' at primary school would wear a mask all day if I, or a teacher, asked them to because they understand that they sometimes need to wear a mask to protect other people. Same way they wear a mask all day when going out to the zoo, visiting a grandparent (support bubble) or have to come to the shop with me or had to go on a train.

So please don't brand other people's children as 'precious little cherubs' just because your (older) children are indeed precious little cherubs.

Kids can wear face coverings. It's hardly 'barbaric'

(I know some kids have issues and can't, they are not who I'm referring to here, there are obviously going to be exceptions.)

@CloseSchoolsProtecttheNHS

Really interesting discussion. I didn't say straight away as I didn't want to sway the thread or be jumped on, but I won't be sending my children to school on Monday no matter what. I refuse to participate in this.

I think your name might have given it away a bit

I'm not opposed in theory to primary children wearing masks but I really don't think I could get my 5 year old to do it any useful way. She'd fiddle with it constantly.

"And what happens when little ones cough and sneeze in their mask during the day and keep touching their masks throughout the day"

They are sent straight home at the first sign of illness. Our current advice is that even teething is no longer an excuse.

My point earlier is not that Early Years and infant children should be expected to wear masks, but that older Primary children can surely cope if little ones can manage with them.

My youngest children take off their socks at every opportunity: by the age of 7 or 8, they're expected to wear them.

Shutting schools is unpopular. Johnson and Starmer do not want to be unpopular.

They also have data and guidance from CMO / paediatrician on harm. Closing schools is not harm free.

Oyster - my DSil teaches kindergarten in the US. Everyone has to wear a mask all day. The children have lanyards they have made from beads with their names on to stop the masks getting dropped. They have to bring a separate bag to keep them in and have several to change throughout the day.
They aren’t having any problems with the masks and it is compulsory. Schools are kept open although it’s not the same in every state.
Masks wearing from kindergarten upwards is compulsory in many European countries. Why are British children unable to manage?

@CloseSchoolsProtecttheNHS

Really interesting discussion. I didn't say straight away as I didn't want to sway the thread or be jumped on, but I won't be sending my children to school on Monday no matter what. I refuse to participate in this.

As with pp your username gives a clue ;

I know why they can’t but it would be good to give people the option. If fifty percent didn’t want it schools would be half full. The other issue is what would percentage be.

Hard to gauge on here as you get the impression many would choose not to. Not sure how representative it is.

@CoveHid . It wasn’t obvious, eh?!

Even if DC all fuck about with masks, drop them, some take them off etc. If it means that say 20% of the class were wearing them correctly for the whole day then that's a big reduction in risk.

It's STILL about reduction not eliminating risk so masks should be worn, where possible, in primaries.

Just because some kids won't do it, it's childish to say we won't even bother to try at all.

Unions previously told members not to teach online, have they unturned on this?

Hardly a U-turn if online learning has ironed out the initial safeguarding issues that caused the original advice.

Ah how clever of them to find a way to universally remove the concerns which were worrying them to the extent that they told teachers not to participate.

Phew.

Necessity is the mother of invention.

It's amazing how in professions where job security relies on doing a good job / achieving turnover / keeping customers happy people have found a way to make things work.

I can, therefore I do......

'Give local councils and headteachers the decision over whether primary schools should reopen', Mayor says (Andy Burnham)

^'Give local councils and headteachers the decision over whether primary schools should reopen', Mayor says
'What I'm saying is let localise this', Andy Burnham says.^

He said the government had taken a 'top down' approach and councils and headteachers should be given the ultimate say.

But he says if the government is unwilling to take that course of action - or if it was too late to do so - they should delay reopening the primaries and do so in a similar way to the staggered secondary school reopenings over the next few weeks.

He said it's important to build confidence amongst parents and teachers and 'that confidence isn't there at the moment'.

Andy Burnham says GM is seeing a sharp rise in all 10 boroughs and that a quarter of new cases were of the new variant.

He said the region hadn't seen the spread of the new variant in the same way as the rest of the country, but that 'we will see it' if we don't take action.

He said that's why the school reopening has to be done in a 'very, very careful way'.

Government are insane to reopen Primarys in Greater Manchester if its already up to a quarter of new cases being the new variant.

It will be a disaster if they do.

But yes Burnham has got in before Johnson on Marr and laid down the gauntlet.

Your move next Johnson.

Then over to the local authorities and teachers themselves.

Some headteachers will be in denial - they seem to think it's a competition - I have seen several online boasting about how they have had so few cases, or that they are the only ones in their county with no bubble burst. Then a couple of weeks later they go quiet because they have had outbreaks and had to close down some year groups.

The truth is it is not down to a school succeeding or failing. Covid is brought into the school - by staff or by pupils or by both - once it is in the local community there is little chance the school will not be affected.

Yet we still have the competitive, bullish HTs. Some no doubt will be putting pressure on their staff to come into despite the unions advice, and in spite of very real health and safety concerns. They will be emailing with confidence that their school is open - but in truth they will not know that yet. Unless all of their staff are non union, or are going to ignore their union advice, then they do not yet know how many staff they will have in. They may well find that they run out of options if their staff are off ill or isolating anyway. these HTs are also ignoring advice from their own union.

With apologies to the many, many fine HTs in the UK who have had a hellish time these past months, had to work ridiculous hours dealing with last minute decisions and U turns from the DfE. Most do a remarkable jb supporting children and staff and the families in their school community.

The decision should be devolved to local councils, to make the best decisions for schools in their areas based on local data.
Masks... Definitely encouraged in secondary. And probably Juniors (not sure on infants, theymay be more of a hindrance). I know my 9yo would struggle... Sensory issues.
Fines... Nonsense at the moment.

It is true that there is no inherent reason English, UK or British children cannot wear masks in school. Genetically, as a group, those children are not a sufficiently distinct group from other children around the world who are currently wearing them, as PPs (eg. @Parker231) have testified.

I echo @Itsgettingweird about adults having higher expectations of our children.
For decades in most of our MAT's primary schools, parents have brought their Reception and often their Y1 children right into the school, either into the cloakroom or even settled them into the classrooms. With the September return to school, this had to stop and children (with a couple of pre-planned exceptions for only a very, very few pupils with particular relevant special/additional needs) had to bring themselves into school from the gate or from behind a line in the playground.
Teachers and TAs had steeled themselves for tears, traumas and a morning or day taken up consoling the distressed children.
Literally without exception, every Reception and Y1 child walked in on their own with no fuss. We had the least crying and distress we have ever had. Just no problems at all. Such a calm, hassle-free start to the day for everyone(apart from the logistics of hand washing, of course).

We all said then that we should have higher expectations of what our children can do. Our new coming into school systems are something we won't be changing after the pandemic.

It may be time to apply those same principles to mask wearing if the science supports it.

Anyone watching Marr should note what Johnson has said.

Schools in areas with low levels of the new strain should open whilst they establish how the tier system works with the new strain. Until the new strain reaches problematic levels.

Schools are safe for children (nothing about staff) and should stay open whilst they work out how much schools spread the new strain.

So schools may pose threats to the wider community but the government aren't concerned about that, nor are they concerned about the spread of the new strain despite the problems its causing in the SE.

I hope you are all feeling reassured because i sure as hell am not.

Johnson also didn't say whether the government would take Brighton and Hove to court for going against the government - so something there to watch too.

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