AIBU to stand up for children and parents...

[alwaysraining123]

... and say that closing schools is not an option. Some observations.

(1) millions of children will suffer poorer mental health, educational deficits and be at risk of physical harm.
(2) if schools close now the government will struggle to get them back open.
(3) the unions are playing a highly political game preying shamelessly on people’s fears.
(4) online learning is of no use for most of the primary school years. Parents basically need to be available all day to support children.
(5) more parents are going to find themselves unable to work causing more financial hardship. This won’t affect your middle class sahps or people who can work from home as much- there are people who actually have to go out of their house to earn a living.
(6) if you’re parent and you’re worried you can keep your child at home.
(7) educational transmission of the virus is low and infection control standards can be escalated where needed.

Whatever is done we need to place maintaining educational provision for children at the heart of it. We need to make it work...there’s no other option.

We’ve had two cases since September and both were when we were in school holidays so not actually in schools. No class closures either. Mass school closures is not warranted.

You do realise yours isn’t the only school? DD’s primary school has had 7 classes had to isolate over the past 3 months.

YABU

If you want to stand up for parents and children, write to your MP and ask why this government has made such a mess of the pandemic. Ask why other countries have taken measures to protect children and teachers (masks for all over the age of 6, CEV teachers working from home supporting vulnerable students, support to ensure proper ventilation, funds for supply, rotas etc) and UK schools have nothing.

I am desperate for school sot stay open as I have a year 11 and a year 13, so both doing exams, and a year 8 who went to peices during lockdown #1.

But I am realistic. Schools need to close, whole country needs to lockdown, probably for 8 weeks. All available people trained up to give vaccines and focus everything on that.

My kids schools are ready, they go live online teaching on Monday. My kids are ready, they know that we will not be doing a repeat, we will all be up and eating breakfast and appearing live on school teams lessons. I am ready, I have dropped everything that I can to be the ringmaster of this home schooling performance. I hope we can get through.
I am so conscious of the kids who do not have what mine have ion terms of school's readiness, access to wi-fi, access to devices, access to one parent who can supervise, access to warm safe calm workspaces etc etc etc.
My kids will be fine if they go online for a couple of months. Not happy, not brilliant, but OK. many kids own't be, many safeguarding issues will go unnoticed. I fear for them.

@MintyMabel

We’ve had two cases since September and both were when we were in school holidays so not actually in schools. No class closures either. Mass school closures is not warranted.

You do realise yours isn’t the only school? DD’s primary school has had 7 classes had to isolate over the past 3 months.

I live in the SE and know of 2 teachers that have died.

Opp are you Gavin his wife or family member

@Seasaltyhair

YANBU

I agree with you but as you can see from this thread you’ll be shouted down.

It’s going to be shocking the amount of women that were pushed out of work this year.

This is a really good point. Many of the women I know have had to take on the homeschooling and still maintain their jobs. Their partners work out of the home as key workers/vital trades, so it is just them on their own dealing with it. If we are closing schools there needs to be some policy that deals with this. Employers are very indifferent to employees taking on this extra burden and the effect it has on them and don't see it as their problem.

(1) millions of children will suffer poorer mental health, educational deficits and be at risk of physical harm

• what if their parents get sick or worse, terminally sick with Covid? What if the school stays open but children will need to isolate multiple times due to contact with a positive case (and it WILL happen due to high number of cases in the community) (2) if schools close now the government will struggle to get them back open.

• why? What do you mean exactly?

(3) the unions are playing a highly political game preying shamelessly on people’s fears.

• unions? So it’s not the fact that we’ve got the record numbers of cases?

(4) online learning is of no use for most of the primary school years. Parents basically need to be available all day to support children.

• that’s what parents do! (Shock horror I know!)

(5) more parents are going to find themselves unable to work causing more financial hardship.

• same will happen if they are unable to work due to repeated isolations or after getting sick with Covid!

This won’t affect your middle class sahps or people who can work from home as much- there are people who actually have to go out of their house to earn a living.

• true that!

(6) if you’re parent and you’re worried you can keep your child at home.

• what about teachers who are worried they will die and leave their own children orphans? What can they do?

(7) educational transmission of the virus is low and infection control standards can be escalated where needed.

• what do you suggest? “Educational transmission”? What’s that supposed to mean?

YABU and unrealistic at the point we are currently at - which could and should have been avoided.

Look at the end of the day this new virus is spreading like shit. The children are spreading it. Opp might not give a shit about other people and is in the fuck everyone else I’m all right Jack

Thank you for this thread, @alwaysraining123

I've been on another very depressing thread about why school closures are the "only" proper thing to do.

I think it's fine if you don't want to teach but you shouldn't get paid for not going to work. You could be killed in the car on your way to work. Are you going to risk it? You can't catch a car crash but it is still a risk. There is a risk in everything you do. If you don't want to take the risk that's fine but I want to get on with things. I think education and the mental health of my kids is important. They need (not a want) stimulation, to play with other kids. You can't just keep people locked up for random amounts of time. To save who?

I can't go to work as I can't afford childcare but I'd bite the hand off any teacher that doesn't want to take the risk with covid. Swap!

@LaurieFairyCake

In December a teacher in my dh's school died (50's, no health conditions)

Apparently you can't come back from death but you can from online learning

Doctors and nurses have died too so shall we shut hospitals? Perhaps we could do them online?

Ummm, no.

@MintyMabel

Given you are only talking about parents of primary school children who will need childcare, the numbers are actually quite small.

We can all stamp our feet and say schools need to be open, and accept more people will get Covid, more deaths will happen, and we’ll all be locked down longer, or we can accept that extraordinary times need extraordinary measures. Arguing that some parents will struggle financially isn’t an argument to keep schools open, it is an argument to support parents better.

Eh? I very much doubt a small number of people have primary aged children and need to work what a stupid comment

My friend died 2 days before Christmas after one of his children contracted it in school!

1. millions of children will suffer poorer mental health, educational deficits and be at risk of physical harm. Millions of children will not suffer poor mental health , some will. Many children have poor mental health caused by schools. Many children’s mental health will be adversely affected forever of a parent dies. Do you really believe there are millions of abused children not already classed as vulnerable?

(2) if schools close now the government will struggle to get them back open.
And they should not be open any time soon other than for vulnerable/key workers

(3) the unions are playing a highly political game preying shamelessly on people’s fears.
The unions would like their members to stay healthy and alive - how very dare they.

(4) online learning is of no use for most of the primary school years. Parents basically need to be available all day to support children.
Two hours learning is more than enough for primary age children. Those two hours do not need to be 9-5 Mon- Fri

(5) more parents are going to find themselves unable to work causing more financial hardship. This won’t affect your middle class sahps or people who can work from home as much- there are people who actually have to go out of their house to earn a living.
This only affects some primary age parents , if a parent dies their family income will always be affected.

(6) if you’re parent and you’re worried you can keep your child at home.
Not if you want to risk your child’s place in a school or can’t afford £60 child per parent minimum ( remember you are so concerned about the financial well being of working class parents)

(7) educational transmission of the virus is low and infection control standards can be escalated where needed.
Well there is your post pandemic career sorted- Comedy Club will snap you up

I have been pro schools opening the whole time. I sent my primary school child back in June when I could and was happy to work on a rota and to go back in September.
But my view has changed. Around 10 staff members at my school have had it since September (all seemingly caught from school) and every year group has had to isolate more than once.
School is not a safe environment for anyone at the moment.
Unless they have classes only in once a week or so it is impossible to social distance.
It is unfair to teachers to put them at risk in this way.

Good luck OP hope you have your hard hat to hand. YANBU.

I dont think anyone is gleeful or relishing the idea of schools partially teaching remotely (...not closed, because they won't be fully closed). It would obviously be better for them to stay open safely, and for there to be an end to this bloody nightmare....
...but we are in a pandemic, and the situation is worsening, with cases, hospitalisations and deaths rising, with a new variant that we don't have a full picture of and schools, inevitably, contributing to the rise in infection spread.....
What do you suggest we do?

@chocolatesweets
Go to work to school or nursery and check it all out how they “don’t” work during the school closures and pandemics. You will change their mind very quickly. Hours/term time only will suit you too, it can work out!

Your mind, not their

We need to see more data on how the new variant affects the course of illness in children. As far as I know, there is some evidence to suggest that children are no longer at an advantage as the new variant has adapted to treat them as adults. Given there will not be an NHS to treat children effectively if they fall ill in larger numbers, we clearly need more data before sending them into a situation where they are highly likely (given the higher transmission rate of the virus) to get Covid.

1. The new variant has leveled the playing field with how infectious this is in an educational setting so they cannot say is low risk.

And what mitigating measures so you think can be increased without affecting how schools are open? Unions are literally arguing that they classrooms aren't safe BECAUSE we've been expected to crack on with no other measures apart from keeping classes separate where we can and a bit of hand washing. All kids in all the time. Mine sit shoulder to shoulder and my windows (2 of them) open 15 cm. I can't even keep me 2m away from the pupils as we are supposed to.

As sad and difficult as that is.

educational transmission of the virus is low and infection control standards can be escalated where needed.

Why not give them all some cake while you're at it.