To have to accept that many in this country just don’t give a shit about others?

[Fortheweekend]

I live in Essex which, like many areas has been heavily hit by Covid.
Just heard on the news that Essex Police have had to issue many, many fines last night to people having New Years Eve parties.
I really deeply saddens me that so many people just don’t give a toss about other people.
They can not see past their own noses. Can they not see or do they not give a shit about the long term costs of their actions? That this goes beyond the virus, that because the NHS is overwhelmed people with potential life threatening conditions such as cancer will be overlooked or diagnosis/treatments delayed as they will not be able to get appointments or appointments cancelled because of too many Covid cases in their hospitals.
That people such as those I work with who suffer from disabilities or people like my poor mum who has Alzheimer’s have been isolated for many, many months and many more to come because support groups open and they and their carers will and are suffering from terrible depression and mental health issues which cut deep and will probably never heal.
Do they not care that people like my 90 year old neighbour who is all alone is shit scared every single day because she feels that she will never be able to live out her last months/years with the freedom she had been used to and genuinely believes she will die alone, without help and never having the freedom to just pop to the shops for she fears she will get the virus.
It truly leaves me feeling nothing but despair as I don’t think we will ever control this virus if people don’t do as asked for the short while it would take.

That’s why I don’t get it when statistics apparently state 95% of people are complying with the rules. That’s absolutely rubbish. I see people breaking the rules constantly. I would be surprised if the figure was more than 70% tbh. Other countries accuse the British of being arrogant, and sadly I have to agree, as a hell of a lot of people just don’t think rules or advice apply to them, and they dont like being told what to do.

Ah the old British won't follow rules and that's why it's rising, not taking any notice of rises in other country's. And only agreeing with statistics you want to.

And to see all these people not following rules you must be out and about more necessary.

Since all this started I’ve come to realise that a fair number of people only believe what they physically see and experience. No amount of public information from health professionals, scientists, etc will persuade them that the pandemic is a threat to our society. It’s not just selfishness. Unless their partner or relative dies from Covid they can’t comprehend the situation. Whether that is a lack of education or some cognitive ability that is lacking I don’t know.

There are a lot of selfish twats around it’s true, but some people just don’t seem to have the ability to process what is happening until they experience it for themselves.

Ok. Let’s imagine the opposite scenario then. We ‘lock’ up the vulnerable! And the ‘rest’ of us carry on the normal. A huge percentage, yes will contract the virus with no or minimal symptoms. But what about the others who will get the virus and end up with complications which result in hospital stays on a Covid ward or ICU. The hospitals all over the country become even more overwhelmed than they currently are. Because so many NHS staff will be off sick with the virus themselves or have been redirected to Covid wards more and more ‘other’ services will be suspended or abandoned. Those ‘non-vulnerable’ people who have a lump, or blood coming from somewhere or some other red flag symptom have to wait way beyond the current 2 week pathway that if they can even get to talk to a gp in the first place (I made an appointment yesterday for 4 weeks time for a telephone consultation!) How are those ‘non vulnerable’ people not going to be affected by this virus? How are the medical staff who have worked themselves to the bone going to fare well mentally in the long run? Many will end up leaving the NHS with mental health issues and PTSD. Then where will the NHS be for us? It won’t. Yes we are all fucked atm. Yes we are losing money and businesses and our children are missing out on an education atm but what choice do we have? I personally don’t think the answer is just to carry on as normal, surely it doesn’t work you only have to look at the countries which have been doing so, including the U.K. we have not handled this as well as the countries which were a little more hardcore in their control of it.
Really, what choice do we have?

Honestly, the rules change so often I think a lot of people have given up.

I think its a bit rich to say people dont care others only now when we literially voted in a tory goverment whose cutbacks have made life misserable for millions for a decade. Of course we dont care about others, how can anyone be suprised?

@Againstmachine

Ah the old British won't follow rules and that's why it's rising, not taking any notice of rises in other country's. And only agreeing with statistics you want to.

And to see all these people not following rules you must be out and about more necessary.

It’s not about being out and about. It’s listening to friends and relatives who are doing their jobs ie nurses, hospital staff, police. Or do you think they are all part of the ‘plan’ and being paid to say these things!?

@NowellSingWe

Goodness, I didn't realise it was such a crime to live in Essex

People are selfish, OP. The majority act only in their own self interests. I have no idea how we change this.

You can't change human nature. There's a reason ideologies like socialism simply don't work in practice. Or for that matter why unregulated and checked Capitalism spectacularly collapses.

Humans are mostly greedy and selfish

@Fortheweekend we have a choice. there is a debate to be had here about evidence, proportionality, balance, effectiveness of the measures, public health policy, social values etc etc etc. This is not about who is selfish and who is not. As with all complex problems, with such far reaching consenqueNces, There are many different ways of looking at this situation, unfortunately the majority of people have been sold the idea that there is only one. That is not healthy in a democracy. Nor is all this curtain twitching, hurling accusations at your neighbours, community policing of the ‘rules’. Let’s all do a bit of self reflection , instead of pointing the finger at others.

Actually the vast majority of people have given up an awful lot to protect others for nine months now.
If you choose to ignore all that sacrifice and concentrate on a few rule breakers then I don’t know what to say to you.

@HelloMissus

Actually the vast majority of people have given up an awful lot to protect others for nine months now. If you choose to ignore all that sacrifice and concentrate on a few rule breakers then I don’t know what to say to you.

This is also true and a very good point.

Where are all these people? Maybe you all need to choose better friends. Clearly something about you attracts the selfish.

All my friends stayed home for NYE, played board games, did puzzles, watched movies.

66 million people in this country, the vast majority have given up their social lives and activities for 9 months and are being told it could be for at least another 4 months and yet that's not good enough for the covid nuts on here. No, a virus doing what viruses do is cause to call people selfish and blame them for some randoms granny dying (never grandads though, weird).

My life is a shadow of what it used to be, do I care about your Granny? No, not one little bit.

Or do you think they are all part of the ‘plan’ and being paid to say these things!?

Where did I mention such things because you don't agree with me I am a conspiracy theorists apparently. That's problem you can't have a proper conversation about it as they accuse you of breaking rules when you haven't.

Loads of people are quoting ancedotal evidence and not real facts.

But you only like the facts that support your beliefs.

@GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER

I don’t think it’s entirely down to selfishness - though IMO ignorance - sometimes wilful ignorance - and stupidity are often involved.

One factor not often mentioned, is that in a good many other countries, including some European ones, people are are lot more wary of the police. How many people here are actually afraid of penalties beyond a mild telling off, if they break the rules? And very likely not even that.
Let alone being afraid of being roughed up or locked up!

It's a lot more pronounced here (selfishness, rukebreakers etc), because the enforcement has been so poor.

Half the people doing what they want here wouldn't dare if they were in a country with high enforcement where the police don't fuck about.

Bu the same token people complying in other countries would take the piss here because they could.

@HelloMissus

Actually the vast majority of people have given up an awful lot to protect others for nine months now. If you choose to ignore all that sacrifice and concentrate on a few rule breakers then I don’t know what to say to you.

Exactly. We have bankrupted people, made the country poorer, given up time with our loved ones, damaged our children’s education, given our health service priority over everything and so much more. I don’t want a medal or even thanks but I’m so fed up of the finger pointing and accusations when everyone I know has had life reduced to a fraction of what it was.

The vast majority do not give a toss about anyone but themselves. They never have and they never will. Accept and move on.

No, I would suggest that people out partying don’t give a shit about your mum or 90 year old neighbour. Most people don’t really care about old people they don’t know, sad but true.

It’s not really a “short time” though is it it’s been 9 months and getting worse.

@cushioncovers

Blackberry what I was suggesting was people who aren't vulnerable go back to work those who are vulnerable get the vaccines first including all key workers and those like my vulnerable parents will have to continue to isolate until such time as the vaccine has worked. Didn't say it was a perfect solution.

I agree with you. Sorry if I misunderstood your original post. Most of us have no employment protection though as there have been no allowances for the cv and ecv have also had to return. I’m a teacher and really felt like I was being sent into an impossible situation. I’m a lone parent and would have a high chance of hospitalisation if ( when) I got the virus. The chance of a worse outcome was unacceptably high for any job. There could have been better decision making at the outset bit I really felt the working age cv and ecv groups have not been properly protected.

"Why? Why would anyone agree with this? Apart from the deeply offensive othering of ‘the vulnerable’, how can anyone with a functioning brain cell fail to comprehend the impact on the fabric of society if ‘the rest of us get on with life’?

What does that even mean? Everything open? Travel? How can people have failed to grasp the maths, quite apart from the impossibility of the practical implementation of such a strategy? It’s so fucking stupid as a concept it honestly doesn’t warrant acknowledgment, but it’s trotted out repeatedly on here. Idiots."

You realise this was the plan all along to gain herd immunity and the only reason we have had lockdowns us due to the public support for them. The only reason we have locked down is to improve the governments chances of winning the next election.

Hi @draughtycatflap

No amount of public information from health professionals, scientists, etc will persuade them that the pandemic is a threat to our society.

I'd count myself as one of the deniers. No amount of available information will persuade me of that because I'm not aware that any has been produced! Covid is not a threat to our society. It's a threat to individual lives, but not to our way of life. The threat to our society is the disproportionate response which is putting at risk our way life.

War-based analogies have been quite popular in this context. In war people are asked to risk their lives to save our way of life.

@MyPersona amongst all your bluster you haven’t actually provided a counter argument - how ironic that you’re calling me an idiot.
🤥🤥

@FelicityMingington

Hi *@draughtycatflap*

No amount of public information from health professionals, scientists, etc will persuade them that the pandemic is a threat to our society.

I'd count myself as one of the deniers. No amount of available information will persuade me of that because I'm not aware that any has been produced! Covid is not a threat to our society. It's a threat to individual lives, but not to our way of life. The threat to our society is the disproportionate response which is putting at risk our way life.

War-based analogies have been quite popular in this context. In war people are asked to risk their lives to save our way of life.

I’m not talking about deniers. I did not use that word in my post. I’m talking more about the people that go about their daily lives with a very low engagement outside of their need to be fed watered and entertained. I think there is a lot more people like that than we realise. Until someone in their family actually dies they won’t take onboard any preventative measures. It is like the outside world doesn’t touch them until they experience it.