There’s no point with primary schools open

[Agoodbriskwalk]

Whatever you think of them being open, the fact is that with thousands of group gatherings of non mask wearing, non socially distanced, non personal distanced, non handwashing people for hours and hours every day in poorly ventilated building, this thing will continue to spread

On top of that, sleepovers and parties and play dates will continue to happen because ‘they’re in school together anyway’. Do you know how often parents say ‘They're in the same bubble’ like it’s a magical force field?

Families with a mix of primary and secondary kids will allow the secondary kids to meet up even if they’re not in school because what’s the point stopping them when the younger kid is exposed to hundreds of families a day anyway? How can they justify its ‘not safe’ to their teens?

Parents will meet up at the school gates twice a day and stand and chat. Some will also meet in their houses, as their kids are friends and sitting together all day anyway so they know that any Covid family 1 has is most likely going to be spread to family 2 anyway.

Parents will do more things, go more places and take more risks because ‘If we’re going to get it from anywhere it will most likely be from school anyway’.

Ditto teachers. And who can blame them? Teachers should have full access to all of society even under lockdown IMO as they’re not being granted safety in any shape or form so should at least be allowed to have their lives.

Employers will expect employees in in a way that they wouldn’t be able to if primaries were off. But schools are open so there will be an expectation of presenteeism in many many workplaces.

Roads will continue to be busy with schools in so people will get a general feeling of ‘business as usual’ and they will carry on cramming themselves into unnecessary shops.

You might disagree with some of the above. I do. But that’s what is going to happen and there will be many deaths as a result.

Ditto teachers. And who can blame them? Teachers should have full access to all of society even under lockdown IMO as they’re not being granted safety in any shape or form so should at least be allowed to have their lives.*
Neither I or any of my colleagues are breaking any rules, as much as we think it's crazy we can be surrounded by small children but not mix with our families we've all stuck to the rules rigidly. Unfortunately listening to the children we know not everyone is being as careful and many of us are concerned how the next few weeks will go....

@covetingthepreciousthings

Do you know how often parents say ‘They're in the same bubble’ like it’s a magical force field?

Exactly this, already seen posts on local groups about how it's fine for kids to have birthday parties at their house with however many kids because of this.

Yes ! This ! The language around covid has really been cleverly thought out .. ‘Bubble’ seems to now be a magical forcefield and ‘covid secure’ which means nothing more than businesses opening some windows and putting Perspex up but people will say covid secure like it means they are 100% not going to catch it 🤦‍♀️

It's not a very dangerous virus for the majority of people. It kills some people, mostly elderly or vulnerable people, but occasionally some healthy people. JUST LIKE FLU, which we have a spike of every year, and kills thousands.

Fine that’s your opinion but the government believe differently. They’re not sending schools back as they think the virus is just like flu! If that was the case they could just open up the country and crack on. You think they should but that’s not where we’re at so had no bearing on this argument.

@Agoodbriskwalk

I'm a key worker, and I want my children to go to school as normal, with the other children in their class.

That’s pretty selfish. It’s not enough that your kids are catered for you want all the kids back in as part of their ‘school experience’.

The school provision for 'key workers' children during the last lockdown was appalling, basically just shit childcare by people who wanted to be sat at home on a laptop drinking tea

Sorry your children’s teachers are so rubbish. It’s not my experience of teachers at all. You do sound very bitter that some people can work from home though so maybe think about a career change?

That's very goady.

So I'll admit to reading your other posts, and noting you have a teacher in your household, which you have failed to mention.

Its not selfish to want ALL children to get an education

And no career change for me, I love my job! Which is why I'm keen for everyone to get back to normal, I'd be so embarrassed to be agitating for time sat on my arse at home.

@Agoodbriskwalk

It's not a very dangerous virus for the majority of people. It kills some people, mostly elderly or vulnerable people, but occasionally some healthy people. JUST LIKE FLU, which we have a spike of every year, and kills thousands.

Fine that’s your opinion but the government believe differently. They’re not sending schools back as they think the virus is just like flu! If that was the case they could just open up the country and crack on. You think they should but that’s not where we’re at so had no bearing on this argument.

The government are completely incompetent.

@Flippingnightmare Your DH’s experience of lockdown teaching is enormously different to mine. I had to teach the same amount as I would in class but had to replan pretty much everything as I knew the children wouldn’t have resources that we have in school. And yes, I am primary.

So I'll admit to reading your other posts, and noting you have a teacher in your household, which you have failed to mention.

Failed to mention!!!

I’m sorry I wasn’t aware that I was obliged to disclose the occupations of all my living relatives in order to post here. Good job you checked up!

That's very goady.

Wow just wow

@Agoodbriskwalk

So I'll admit to reading your other posts, and noting you have a teacher in your household, which you have failed to mention.

Failed to mention!!!

I’m sorry I wasn’t aware that I was obliged to disclose the occupations of all my living relatives in order to post here. Good job you checked up!

Gotta sniff out those hidden agendas

I don’t think I’ve seen a socially distanced classroom yet.

I've seen loads on the news! Every time they show a story about schools, there's accompanying footage of children seated singly at desks 2m apart. Not seen one in real life though

[quote Letsleepingdogslie8]@Flippingnightmare Your DH’s experience of lockdown teaching is enormously different to mine. I had to teach the same amount as I would in class but had to replan pretty much everything as I knew the children wouldn’t have resources that we have in school. And yes, I am primary.[/quote]
Maybe it depends on schools, the more forms the less work?

DH did less than half of what he usually would.

I always agreed to keep schools open. However, with the huge increase in cases I do now think they should close at least for January. I know it's hard, it's not easy for us as a family either, I work in school and feel safe there BUT there won't be a sense of this being an emergency UNTIL they've closed the schools. People will think 'well schools are open, it can't be that bad'.

I'm not sending ds2 while ds1 is home. I'll see what the numbers are like in a couple of weeks.

I am a secondary teacher and my DCs in secondary too so whatever happens to primary schools it has no direct impact on me however I feel so angry for primary staff right now!

Yes it is important for the economy that people continue to work but it is unfair that these staff members are being put at more risk simply due to childcare!

The school provision for 'key workers' children during the last lockdown was appalling, basically just shit childcare by people who wanted to be sat at home on a laptop drinking tea

Yes the school provision last lockdown was simply childcare. They were there to supervise whilst the children did their work exactly like the other children at home had to do.

Did you seriously think that the children going into school were going to get special one to one tutoring and extra education whilst those who aren’t vulnerable or whose parents aren’t KW had a basic education and got left behind?

What interests me is that the demographic breakdown of cases is no longer expressed in multiple age ranges. It's just '0-59' and '60 +' now. It used to be something like '0-19, 20-39, 40-59, 60-79, 80+'

Are they trying to avoid saying that the biggest spike is in the 'under 20' group? It's a contentious issue closing secondary schools but perhaps necessary to keep infection rates down?

As a vulnerable teacher a few weeks from 50 of primary in a tier 4 area which is still open despite a rise of over 150% last week, I would say there comes a point when I have to stop caring about other people's children so much and care more about my own possibly being left alone. And about my CV mum with dementia who lives with us. That point has been reached now.

The blatant disregard shown to me means that I am now working to the minimum I can getting in 5 mins before the start of the day and leaving at 3.30. I'm not marking 96 books a day and touching those anymore. I'm not reading side by side with kids or touching them at all if I can help it. I have to eat lunch with them and wipe tables but then i'm taking my 20 minute break outside away from them with my fingers ctossed.

Jesus christ - I love teaching and my class and I will slap on a smile for them on Monday and be happy to see them but I am shit scared and I haven't even got a fucking mask. Nor do they.

@toocold54

The school provision for 'key workers' children during the last lockdown was appalling, basically just shit childcare by people who wanted to be sat at home on a laptop drinking tea

Yes the school provision last lockdown was simply childcare. They were there to supervise whilst the children did their work exactly like the other children at home had to do.

Did you seriously think that the children going into school were going to get special one to one tutoring and extra education whilst those who aren’t vulnerable or whose parents aren’t KW had a basic education and got left behind?

Yes parents did think their child would get special treatment. We had parents clamouring for their child to be back at school because they were a ‘key worker’. Children told to lie by their parents as to what their occupation was because they’d said they were key workers (no one checked their employment).

We were told anything we did had to be equitable to those children at home. Having said that I made sure my (all years) bubble of 15 worked and had fun in the afternoon, so perhaps they did get special treatment.

Newyeary- it’s terrible NHS workers don’t get proper PPE, absolutely unforgiveable.

Yes parents did think their child would get special treatment. We had parents clamouring for their child to be back at school because they were a ‘key worker’. Children told to lie by their parents as to what their occupation was because they’d said they were key workers (no one checked their employment).

That is ridiculous! And it explains why some people are bitter that their children didn’t get special treatment due to being key workers!

My DCs school (secondary) has already said they won’t be taking places for KW children as they can only cater for vulnerable kids so I wonder if they had too many attending.

@toocold54

Yes parents did think their child would get special treatment. We had parents clamouring for their child to be back at school because they were a ‘key worker’. Children told to lie by their parents as to what their occupation was because they’d said they were key workers (no one checked their employment).

That is ridiculous! And it explains why some people are bitter that their children didn’t get special treatment due to being key workers!

My DCs school (secondary) has already said they won’t be taking places for KW children as they can only cater for vulnerable kids so I wonder if they had too many attending.

So the children of the NHS 'heroes' that everyone was clapping for and grateful for had no right to expect to be taught by teachers in school?

The point I’m making is that many employers were happy to write letters with very tenuous links to being a key worker. Of course genuine key workers were entitled to take up a place for their child. Not those parents who lied about their employment just because it’s a bit tough having them at home. I also have kids and yeah, it was rubbish homeschooling but we muddled through. They didn’t get the education they should have but it couldn’t be helped.

And whatever schools provided had to be equitable. So we couldn’t actually teach as such. Because those parents at home who weren’t entitled to a key worker place actually called and complained that key workers’ children were being taught and their children weren’t.

I think children are better off in school than not. But I’m entitled to be worried about myself and my family in the light of the new variant.
At the moment, all I want is for those parents asking for schools to be open at all costs, actually step up and help those people in primary education - who can’t wear ppe or distance from children - by wearing masks, not mixing outside school, socially distancing, stopping random pick ups of other children and sleepovers. In my school they even complain about having to go the long way round the one way system.

It is what it is, primaries will open. Just help the staff that unfortunately have to work there by following the rules.

Can someone in favour of closing schools tell me how long you want them closed for? January? What's the point? Cases will increase again as soon as they reopen!

So the children of the NHS 'heroes' that everyone was clapping for and grateful for had no right to expect to be taught by teachers in school?

They should get no preferential treatment over a child whose parent is a lawyer or lifeguard or on benefits.

Why do you think children of NHS staff are more important than other children?

@toocold54

So the children of the NHS 'heroes' that everyone was clapping for and grateful for had no right to expect to be taught by teachers in school?

They should get no preferential treatment over a child whose parent is a lawyer or lifeguard or on benefits.

Why do you think children of NHS staff are more important than other children?

I think that if these children's parents are unable to sit with them and do their work, and they are going into school they should be given the best teaching available. It's sadistic to just ignore them because not all children are there, they are innocent children!

Some parents will have been teaching all day, doing extra languages, music etc, should they be not allowed to do that as not all children will get it?

Should my children not be allowed to go swimming or to ballet because not all children can? Should I not give them breakfast because not all children get it?

I'm appalled at your callousness.

So the children of the NHS 'heroes' that everyone was clapping for and grateful for had no right to expect to be taught by teachers in school?

Correct. They had a right to be looked after so their parents could work. That’s all.