Schools to open as planned in Jan, says Michael Gove.

[DonLewis]

Breaking news.

I can't help but think this is madness.

My prediction:

Secondary schools go back as planned on the 4th (i.e. only Y11/12/13 in school). Testing all the other years can't be done in the space of a week, so the return of those other year groups is delayed but the government can blame schools for messing up the testing.

Schools limp on for a bit, but in current tier 4 areas, a lot will shut quite quickly due to staff shortages. Some parents will also keep their children home out of fear.

Eventually, as in March, mass school closures will force the government to take some kind of action.

It will all be an unplanned mess, as before, whereas with some decent planning, at least part time school could probably be maintained throughout the spring term.

This is a handy tool to check for local covid rates per school:

schoolcovidmap.org.uk/

That link doesn't provide cases in the school, just cases in the area the school is in. Our local primary has had zero cases, but the info on link says over 200 cases. So whilst a good idea, the link doesn't actually provide the data

Sorry my bad on phrasing it incorrectly. I should have said: it provides information about area covid rates searchable by schools.

It really is another type of visualization only, but handy imo.

Our local primary has had zero cases, but the info on link says over 200 cases. So whilst a good idea, the link doesn't actually provide the data

How do you know this for sure? Covid cases in schools weren't widely advertised and often only close contacts were notified. In the last week before the Christmas break, there was a Covid case in my son's class - because the child had last been in school on Friday and started symptoms on Monday, the class were notified, but no one had to self isolate. No other class in the school was told about this case and the same applied to other cases within the school.
At my dc's secondary school there have been loads of cases, but we haven't been notified of all of them - only some of those in our year groups bubble.

[quote TheSunIsStillShining]This is a handy tool to check for local covid rates per school:

schoolcovidmap.org.uk/[/quote]
In England and Wales

Bloody relieved they are keeping primaries open. The fetishisation of schools shutting on this forum is ridiculous.

I just think they don't care or get it - he actually said

Headteachers and teachers have been working hard during the Christmas holiday to prepare for January.

Yes they have! Working hard through their Christmas break. Having worked through Easter and bank holidays.

It actually doesn't dawn on them that they are leaving everything last minute and to chance and working heads into the ground. Alongside education staff.

Then what? The more someone is run down the worse their physical health.

Can they actually not correlate that they are placing education staff at greater risk of complications from covid by overworking them beyond their already heavy workload - and that's before they Chuck them into a room with 30 people.

That's 30 people in a room together for 6 hours a day. When we cannot mix with any household inside or a private outdoor space due to how transmissible this virus is.

And that as 50% of transmission is apparently in households if that's 30 households at risk per student - even more if that student has siblings who attend different schools.

I am all for education being a priority and having some face to face education where safe and possible.

But I cannot equate their plans with the science they keep telling us means I cannot meet anybody else.

@notevenat20

I really hope schools reopen as usual. But I also really hope it doesn't turn out that the new variant is particularly transmissible between children and adults.

The huge rise in cases since schools broke up at least implies to me that it's not schools causing the current crisis.

It's too early to tell.

It's only now 10 days past the last day of term and so all those who caught it last week of term are only just coming out of isolation.

@wizzbangfizz

Bloody relieved they are keeping primaries open. The fetishisation of schools shutting on this forum is ridiculous.

Imagine that, parents wanting their children to receive an education

@DumplingsAndStew
Imagine people wanting to get through this without having life long consequences.

[quote TheSunIsStillShining]@DumplingsAndStew
Imagine people wanting to get through this without having life long consequences.[/quote]
I don't need to imagine that, I want that

At this point I think opening schools as they are AND wanting to be safe are mutually exclusive :(

So annoying how what Gove said is all over the media as 'news', unless I am missing something all he did was reiterate the current plan, which could change at any point.

He also said a scotch egg was a substantial meal.

@wizzbangfizz

Bloody relieved they are keeping primaries open. The fetishisation of schools shutting on this forum is ridiculous.

This morning, in advance of a meeting about schools, Gove repeated the policy that has been in place since 17th December - ie before Tier 4 and announcements about the new variant.

I would in no way expect this to be a definitive statement of what the policy will be by 8.30 am on January 4th, in the same way as the announcement that the Christmas relaxation was going ahead just a week before it was dramatically altered turned out to be a definitive statement.

I would also point out that whatever the policy, the new variant will mean a much larger number of cases in primaries and thus a huge increase in the number of children attending supposedly 'open' primaries but actually self-isolating at home.

There were 700-800,000 children at home each day due to self-isolation in the weeks running up to Christmas, despite the policy being that all schools should be open. I would expect that number will quite rapidly escalate to over a million, and possibly way beyond.

@moomin11

So annoying how what Gove said is all over the media as 'news', unless I am missing something all he did was reiterate the current plan, which could change at any point.

Agreed. Was even quoted as 'Breaking News' when in fact it's just old news and schools and parents have already planned for the staggered return from 4th of Jan. I suspect there will be yet another massive U turn and the full return will be delayed for weeks.

Kids won’t be sent home tho as contacts will be tested daily and won’t have to isolate so all kids staying in unless positive

Kids won’t be sent home tho as contacts will be tested daily and won’t have to isolate so all kids staying in unless positive

With tests that are only 48% accurate.
And who will be doing these tests, teachers? Many on here have already said they won't. Volunteers? Can't see many parents stepping forward in my area.

Also there is no plan for mass (rubbish) testing in primary schools whose numbers are rising at the same rate as secondary schools.

All schools need to close.

There are 2 new strains, 1 which spreads more easily in children (Kent) and one which is more severe in young people (South Africa)

@Pastanred

Kids won’t be sent home tho as contacts will be tested daily and won’t have to isolate so all kids staying in unless positive

This is not the plan for primaries.

Equally, I know of no secondaries with this in place and fully resourced yet - mainly because the government has not yet released detailed plans nor indicated how many tests each school will get, nor confirmed any funding details.

In fact, I entirely expect the bonkers 'test rather than sending home, using a test that is less than 50% accurate when identifying positive cases, using a procedure which takes 5 minutes per test per tester, meaning a year group of 240 would take 20 person hours to test, and this would have to happen every day' to die a quiet death. For one thing, we don't have enough tests, and schools don't have enough staff.

Just back of the envelope stuff - if, say, a million children would usually isolate, so have to be tested daily. that is 7 million tests in a week, and each day over 80,000 person-hours are needed to test them....

You need to read between the lines, he said “we hope”. This is a weakening of the pre existing stance and they are paving the way for an announcement of school closures.

@Bluewavescrashing

As an infant school teacher and parent this is causing me a lot of anxiety. I want my class to return next week but I also want us all to be safe.

Those two just are not compatible considering the new mutant. Maybe blended learning to ensure SD and the use of masks and ventilated classes. That is the only other way.

Just back of the envelope stuff - if, say, a million children would usually isolate, so have to be tested daily. that is 7 million tests in a week, and each day over 80,000 person-hours are needed to test them....

Yep it's a great idea until you actually think about the practicalities. Makes you wonder why the Gov bothered to announce it, when it's such a non-starter.

[There is also the point that schools aren't open at weekends, so this idea of 'daily testing for X days', using school premises and school staff, doesn't really work ... especially for pupils who e.g. travel by school bus to school....]

Bonkers. How it got past any kind of scrutiny to get into the public domain, I have absolutely no idea.

@Pastanred

Kids won’t be sent home tho as contacts will be tested daily and won’t have to isolate so all kids staying in unless positive

This is the bit I don't get.

Again it goes against all the science.

We are told you can be asymptomatic and also can spread it for 48 hours before symptoms appear.

So all those close contacts at high risk due to nature of close contact in school could be spreading it for 2 days up until they themselves test positive.

And that's with a test is that is only accurate half the time.

I cannot help but wonder if the government are going for herd immunity in school aged kids because there's no plan to vaccinate them?