Deaths and those under 50

[Sallygoround631]

Was just perusing the 'collective insanity' thread on here, with many people in agreement that the measures outweigh the risks.

I am on the fence personally, and can appreciate the concerns on both sides of the argument, but my post isn't about that.

Im curious about when people on here argue over the severity of covid in the population, many protest that it is a bad flu and that those in real danger are only the vulnerable and very elderly population.

However, in response to this, there's always a ton of posters who claim most of the people they knew who died of covid were in their 30's and 40' with NO health conditions.

I tend not to come across this particular argument much outside of MN, so would like to hear your thoughts on it and perhaps some info about where I can find stats. ONS perhaps?

yikes, when I say 'ONLY the vulnerable' I don't mean that dismissively, my wording is poor!

I find it odd - on most threads I read someone saying they have 5 friends under 40 who are in hospital, severely ill etc or died with no underlying health conditions. I do wonder if any of these statements are true.

In my small world, I've known lots of people to have had covid, not one has been even moderately ill.

Having said that, people can die from pneumonia without underlying health conditions, though it's rare I imagine.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsregisteredweeklyinenglandandwalesprovisional/weekending11december2020

You are likely to get those same people on this thread to say that their brother, sister, cousins and best friend all died of Covid and they were only 30 . This won’t give an accurate representation at all

It's not just about deaths. Without restrictions, millions of young people would be left permanently disabled by Long COVID.

That is why restrictions will remain in place for many years even after a vaccine is in place.

We can all wave goodbye to large family gatherings and concerts on a permanent basis or at least until we have a vaccine that prevents transmission.

Well, the one person I know who died from covid was over 50...53 to be precise. No underlying health conditions.

I think 53 is still pretty young to die, personally.

I doubt you can tell from here, like you can't tell how much people earn and stuff like that.

40 year old neighbour died. Tragic she left behind 3 boys.
She had an underlying condition. It was mild asthma that hadn’t bothered her for decades.
I know so many asthmatics who had childhood asthma. Never bothered by it in adulthood. Also some have never even used inhalers for decades, yet if they were to die it would be recorded as an underlying issue.
Tbh I don’t know any under 50s who have died with covid, however I do know people in their 30s and 40s get severely ill and survive. Now these people had no underlying health issues. One was in intensive care, but made it.
More than anything that is what scares me. Healthy young people having to be hospitalised.

Thank you for the link and opinions.

Personally I only know my mum to have had covid.
She was in a hospice and passed away from something unrelated, had no covid symptoms, she was 82.
It still went on her death certificate though.

I am in cumbria, and north west. Even when rates get very high here ive not met anyone who has had it, but do hear of them through others. I think my social and family circle is really small so I might be unusual.

I am also not too well up on virology in general so have never compared it to the typical annual flu.
I wonder if younger people are dying of covid more so than the annual flu?

20% of people in ICU are under 50. That’s pretty significant to me. And then there’s long covid.

It's all about the sheer volumes of infections isn't it?

No it's not a severe disease for the vast majority of people, even those who are most vulnerable.

But with no restrictions and exponential growth the millions upon millions of infections will lead to vast numbers of badly impacted individuals.

Hospitals will be full so then more people die of both Covid and also other things simply due to lack of medical care.

While all this is happening life does not continue as normal because people get terrified and they lock down voluntarily.

All the restrictions are terrible but the alternative is worse

Even if a lot of younger folk are not dying there is a real risk of long COVID. And if we don’t take measures now that there is this new variant numbers of people affected will skyrocket. And even if only a small percentage o& them end up in hospital there comes a time when all beds are full. Then people cant get care for other medical and surgical problems and it’s a perfect storm. So how can anyone say that the measures outweigh the risks

@Em777

20% of people in ICU are under 50. That’s pretty significant to me. And then there’s long covid.

I'm willing to bet most are either obese or with existing health problems.

And what's the percentage of the population who are obese these days? You make it sound like a reasonable outcome

I'm a teacher and so know lots of people who've had it and, sadly, four people who have died. Two in their 50s, one in their 70s and one in their 80s. I also know plenty who had it weeks ago and are still ill.

Until this week, I thought the numbers of under 40s was small. I didn’t know anyone who had it that bad to be more than some time in bed. Not belittling how long they suffered more it was all okay home to recover from.

Now 5 of my friends are in hospital in the last week and not in good shape. All under 40 and healthy.

I read somewhere there was some evidence that it rips through those with a better immune system. I can’t find the link but IF true then tbh we are fooked because who do you shield?

Well, people are more likely to mention the extreme cases on threads so you probably see it mentioned more.

Saying that, as others say above, if infection rates go up then by default more people will be getting seriously ill and dying. The long term effects are also so significant for many younger people. There was someone on TV the other day who had been very athletic (running marathons etc.) and can now barely walk, she's in her 30s... Of course there are lots of other illnesses that could cause this too but few are spreading as quickly and easily as covid does.

@RunnerDown

Even if a lot of younger folk are not dying there is a real risk of long COVID. And if we don’t take measures now that there is this new variant numbers of people affected will skyrocket. And even if only a small percentage o& them end up in hospital there comes a time when all beds are full. Then people cant get care for other medical and surgical problems and it’s a perfect storm. So how can anyone say that the measures outweigh the risks

I only visit MN sporadically, so not followed opinion on her all through pandemic, but I do recall early on in March/April most seemed to be very pro-lockdown. It seems rather different now! (although I could have a skewed opinion as ive been reading the 'insanity' thread this afternoon!)

It's interesting how opinions shift. Then again a lot has happened since March. I can absolutely sympathise with both sides of the argument, so many have valid concerns. I couldn't have predicted how polarising a subject it has become.

You’d be better going to the source OP. Yes, ONS, or if you find that hard to wade through, Travelling Tabby does very easy to read visualisations of all the ONS etc stats:

www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/deaths

ONS have a couple of publications specifically comparing Covid and flu. Covid deaths outstrip flu and pneumonia deaths by a long way

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsduetocoronaviruscovid19comparedwithdeathsfrominfluenzaandpneumoniaenglandandwales/deathsoccurringbetween1januaryand31august2020#age-standardised-and-age-specific-rates-for-deaths-due-to-influenza-and-pneumonia-and-covid-19

[quote Callybrid]You’d be better going to the source OP. Yes, ONS, or if you find that hard to wade through, Travelling Tabby does very easy to read visualisations of all the ONS etc stats:

www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/deaths

ONS have a couple of publications specifically comparing Covid and flu. Covid deaths outstrip flu and pneumonia deaths by a long way

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsduetocoronaviruscovid19comparedwithdeathsfrominfluenzaandpneumoniaenglandandwales/deathsoccurringbetween1januaryand31august2020#age-standardised-and-age-specific-rates-for-deaths-due-to-influenza-and-pneumonia-and-covid-19[/quote]
Thank you so much this is exactly the type of stuff I was looking for :)

@Sallygoround631

Was just perusing the 'collective insanity' thread on here, with many people in agreement that the measures outweigh the risks.

I am on the fence personally, and can appreciate the concerns on both sides of the argument, but my post isn't about that.

Im curious about when people on here argue over the severity of covid in the population, many protest that it is a bad flu and that those in real danger are only the vulnerable and very elderly population.

However, in response to this, there's always a ton of posters who claim most of the people they knew who died of covid were in their 30's and 40' with NO health conditions.

I tend not to come across this particular argument much outside of MN, so would like to hear your thoughts on it and perhaps some info about where I can find stats. ONS perhaps?

You won’t find stats OP because the majority of it ilIs B.S.

You will get the odd healthy 35 year old with no knows health problems, bmi in te normal range etc and they will die - but it’s more like a freak accident/terrible luck, rather than a reflection of reality

If it was properly looked in to, there would likely be an underlying condition that would otherwise be undiagnosed.

And the 37 year old that dies of it with no underlying health conditions..... other than having a body mass idea way above the recommended.

It’s not to say it couldn’t happen to a otherwise healthy, average weight person, but it’s about a million to one!

So 8 children aged 14 or under have died from covid so far in total?

We know that there are around 315 people under 60 with no health conditions who have died of COVID.

That is 315 people leaving behind DC and partners.

These people are collateral damage in the far-right prioritisation of the economy over lives.

If the government had implemented a strict lockdown all year where no-one leaves home unless a key worker (enforced by the army and £5000 fines), 315 healthy parents and grandparents would have survived.

I know quite a few people who have had it. One in his 40's, he was hospitalised, his wife - not hospitalised. Friends mum died of it and various couples. Another friends daughter, barely knew she had it. A few now have ongoing complications.