We're having 2-3 teachers a day catching CV19 DFE You're not keeping us safe

[Anon12345678910]

Look at the image from www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3223
I've circled where we fall in classrooms. It's time for face coverings in classrooms. I don't want to loose any colleagues or my own life.

So, 2m isn’t enough. 4.6 metres may still be risky. Good to know
However unlike you, I know that children can and do spread coronavirus in schools, especially teenagers.*

Likewise, I know that teachers can and do spread coronavirus in schools - hopefully all staffrooms are closed to staff not wearing masks.

@Clavinova - and all adults should eat their lunch and drink outside or in their car, of course, as they spread covid 19, but children don’t.

and all adults should eat their lunch and drink outside or in their car

Very sensible advice.

And restaurants and pubs should all close, too.

If you don't drive to work?

Teenagers can still eat indoors, of course.

@timeforanewstart

Can anyone show evidence that masks stop spread in schools ? Are countries with a high outbreak showing less cases in schools? I would have no real issue of my ds secondary age wearing a mask but only of they will have an effect I know we wear them in a shop but that is fleeting passing , in a classroom for an hr a time and longer will they have the same affect ? Poster on this thread or another whose school had implemented masks and all time who had a large outbreak ? My ds school had a couple teachers during half term but I don't think it will stay like that? Just not sure that masks is the answer to fix it

They’re still controversial, there are many infection control experts who don’t support their use. The reason is that the outside of the mask collects virus particles. if it gets wet or you touch it and then rub your eyes or touch your face you can transfer larger number of virus particles to the site of infection than would happen if you weren’t wearing it. If not used correctly they can increase the chance of infection. Some of the other measures have no down side and the evidence is very much in favour e.g. thorough ventilation. I believe Germany has ploughed money into new ventilation systems. We aren’t doing enough in schools, however precisely what needs to be done needs thorough assessment and may well vary according to the school set up. Some people are saying they don’t have windows which open fully which is a scandal really when you look at the evidence of how this thing spreads

Clav you clearly believe that adults are spreading the virus in schools rather than children. Is that correct?

If so, can you explain how a class full of 6ft 16 year olds with size 12 feet aren't a risk factor when it comes to spreading the virus in schools, including to the adults that work with them?

[quote notevenat20]**@notevenat20 - well, if the data is being buried, you actually do have to guess.

This is starting to sound all a bit Giuliani. I do not believe there is a global conspiracy to hide and/or fake data about the risk of covid to school teachers.[/quote]
It isn't a global conspiracy, the UK is almost unique in having secondary schools fully open, in other countries they've embraced virtual or blended learning. The TES article linked does support a theory that data on teacher infection is being suppressed in the UK, presumably to support the government's policy of all schools staying open to all pupils regardless of community infection levels.

Clavinova I have reported various 'teacher-bashing' threads, although MNHQ have always taken the 'it's debate' line.

That's obviously their prerogative, but there's something about watching you have go after go at a teacher who was very ill with covid and has experienced multiple bereavements in her family during the pandemic that is really, really distasteful.

As were the snide comments you made about state education in general over the weekend.

I haven't asked you to stop posting. I've suggested that you engage with the evidence being presented and take on board the experiences of teachers currently working in state secondaries.

It's sort of what people usually do when they're debating/having a discussion, rather than post the same inaccurate thing over and over again.

I cannot understand why they are not getting teachers and secondary pupils to wear masks when there are so many cases in schools.
I'm in France where tbh the situation isn't great either but at least here teachers and all pupils over 6 are wearing masks. Not sure about primary school wearing them although honestly most of them don't seem bothered but I feel like year 7 and up should wear them.

@Isthatitnow

Clav you clearly believe that adults are spreading the virus in schools rather than children. Is that correct?

If so, can you explain how a class full of 6ft 16 year olds with size 12 feet aren't a risk factor when it comes to spreading the virus in schools, including to the adults that work with them?

No, she can't because there isn't an explanation.

Clav either really believes that it's adult to adult transmission in secondary schools and that the million or so children positive with covid or SI in the UK are, what, doing it for shit and giggles? Or she knows full well that the evidence indicates extremely clearly that asymptomatic children are spreading the virus in schools and is enjoying being goady.

Could be either. Or a bit of both I suppose.

And restaurants and pubs should all close, too

Going to a pub or a restaurant is a leisure activity - you don't have to eat in one - but yes, they should close if infections are rising in the area.

If you don't drive to work?

Classroom/outside.

Teenagers can still eat indoors, of course.

I thought teachers were worried about their safety - it seems sensible to avoid mixing with other adults in the staffroom if you are not wearing a mask.

marmitepasta that's exactly what is so frustrating about the UK's situation. There are mitigation measures that could have been brought in very easily, mandatory mask wearing being the obvious one, that weren't.

Whatever was mandated, it's likely that like most of northern Europe, it would have been a rough winter, but the awareness that it didn't need to be so bad is soul destroying.

What Clavinova seems to believe is that teachers are 100% responsible for all school acquired covid 19 cases; that they should not even have access to a clean, well ventilated space with a strict limit on numbers in which to eat and drink; and provided they wear masks 100% of the time, they are safe in an enclosed space without adequate ventilation if it only has 30 children in it and no other adults.

@Clavinova - eat in the classroom?!?! Where do you think the kids are eating?!

I genuinely don't know a school with an open staff room though. I've just eaten my flask of soup whilst stood outside, because we either eat outside or in our room. As my room is a lab, and my office is being used as a quarantine room.

I do feel the need to point out.... Kids are spreading covid. We print out seating plans when we have a case and over the next week you can tick off new positive cases who have been with them.

I'm not going to ask Clavinova to stop posting but I am going to stop replying to her faux informative posts, they are toxic.

It isn't a global conspiracy, the UK is almost unique in having secondary schools fully open, in other countries they've embraced virtual or blended learning.

I don't believe this is true. My friend in France has had her primary and secondary aged children in school full time for months. I am sure the situation is the same in many other countries with a covid crisis.

Not all countries have our class sizes, so can have more spacing within classes. The teacher I know in france wears a mask and has done throughout, so do her pupils (these are teens).

christinarossetti19
there's something about watching you have go after go at a teacher who was very ill with covid

I called out several untruthful statements - the poster has been very vocal on these threads.

As were the snide comments you made about state education in general over the weekend.

I think I made one off-hand comment about state schools - on the topic of remote learning.

Clav either really believes that it's adult to adult transmission in secondary schools

It's clearly part of the problem;

Ireland 20 Nov - "Staff rooms a key risk for spread of Covid-19 in schools, health officials warn."

www.irishtimes.com/news/education/staff-rooms-a-key-risk-for-spread-of-covid-19-in-schools-health-officials-warn-1.4414623

I'm not going to ask Clavinova to stop posting

I'm going out now in any case.

Sure, let’s talk about France instead of the cover-up of data relating directly to teachers in England.

@Possums4evr

I'm not going to ask Clavinova to stop posting but I am going to stop replying to her faux informative posts, they are toxic.

Teacher boycott.

Gets my vote.

Not all countries have our class sizes, so can have more spacing within classes. The teacher I know in france wears a mask and has done throughout, so do her pupils (these are teens).

Yes they wear masks in secondary schools in France.