It's best for children to be in school

[Billie18]

I'm shocked that the consensus here appears to be that schools should close. I believe that it's best for children to be in school. Also that they should not be forced to wear masks or perform any social distancing as this is a damaging for their mental and social development. A thread for parents and teachers who share this view and have concerns about the threat of school closures and forced isolation of children who are not ill.

I saw an UFT poster once express disbelief that the person carrying out their Covid test was masked - why get a job at a testing centre if you're not prepared to get Covid was her question.
I shit you not.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'Happy mixing with those secondary kids at Christmas to you all.'

What do you suggest we do with them, keep them in the shed?

Keep them at home with you, with your household - and isolated from anyone vulnerable.

Then make sure that their contacts are kept to the minimum before they return to school, so that the risk of them carrying infection back into school is as small as it can be.

What do you suggest we do with them, keep them in the shed?

I’d certainly suggest keeping them away from grandma.

So if the virus had affected only children
Would you have wanted
children to be able to stay home fine free?
Distancing
Teachers in masks?

@user1471588124, So tell us what you would like to change about your situation in order that you feel safer at work and I for one would support you.
It shouldn't be a race to the bottom.

"I work all day supporting people in the community (who dont wear masks or socially distance), in and out of houses, dont get tested and am earning minimum wage. Do you think i shouldnt work until I'm safe? Or do you accept that somethings have to keep running even at a big risk to workers?"

I would fully support your right to H&S by having permission to wear a mask, have ventilation, ask anyone you are getting close to to also wear a mask, and regular testing.
Everyone is entitled to adequate H&S at work

@Possums4evr

OP, you want schools to stay open AND you want pupils not to wear masks or try to distance in any way. You need to pick one: you can't have both.

YES schools should stay open AND children should not be forced to wear masks or perform any social distancing.

Also healthy children shouldn't be forced to isolate. This is also important.

It's good that some here agree with me.

And I want an Xbox series x AND to keep my £500. It ain't gonna happen though.

Who do you want to teach my classes when I'm off because contacts don't isolate and teenagers aren't in masks? I taught a child who became a positive case recently, both of us in masks, I didn't get ill. Would it have been the same without?
Basically OP you don't believe that Covid is a risk, do you?

Also healthy children shouldn't be forced to isolate. This is also important.

Up to 90% of people infected with Covid are asymptomatic - apparently 'healthy', but infectious.

I completely agree that the current isolation rules are crude, but the way to resolve this is NOT to allow asymptomatic carriers to remain in school infecting others.

The way to resolve this is to test all contacts of a confirmed positive case, then all contacts of anyone who tests positive, and so on. All those testing positive should isolate.

That way, all GENUINELY healthy individuals do not need to isolate. Those who are likely to infect others do need to isolate, and can be properly identified.

@Aragog why would you of been in contact with all 270 pupils are you not at least in bubbles
At my ds school secondary no cases yet from students but couple teachers in holidays , and rpund here whole year groups including teachers being sent home close contact

@noblegiraffe

Do you think i shouldnt work until I'm safe?

Thing is, if your job definitely is essential and definitely can’t be made any safer then that’s one thing (if that’s the case then vaccine priority and regular testing should be on the cards), but if your job is unsafe and could easily be made safer, then obviously it should be. Some people disagree. Which is weird.

It could be made safer but people just don't care about support workers (or our clients). Community carers dont get regular testing like staff in care homes as its too logistically 'difficult' to roll out. We dont have a continuity in supporting the same people regularly so meet multiple people a day/week in a home (for several hours at a time), even though that could be regulated by the government. We support people who are self isolating or covid positive with just an apron, gloves and a mask and get paid the minimum to live on (though we do get a badge).

It's just galling that no one cares about the risks we undertake and we're supposed to just get on with it, while also trying to homeschool, or take unpaid time of work for self isolating children and recieve the measly SSP the government provides.

I'm curious about the logic of this. I'm presuming you are saying this because you believe children's education is the top priority?

And that schools should look as normal as possible?

Do you also believe that children/teens can spread it to adults they are in contact with?

If you therefore value your children's education, why would you want to risk having their teachers potentially off ill for weeks?
There is one local school to me where they have so many supply teachers and cover supervisors in that the kids may only see an actual teacher 3 times a week. The other 22 lessons are all cover. .

@WhyNotMe40

"I work all day supporting people in the community (who dont wear masks or socially distance), in and out of houses, dont get tested and am earning minimum wage. Do you think i shouldnt work until I'm safe? Or do you accept that somethings have to keep running even at a big risk to workers?"

I would fully support your right to H&S by having permission to wear a mask, have ventilation, ask anyone you are getting close to to also wear a mask, and regular testing.
Everyone is entitled to adequate H&S at work

Its just not possible for some of the people i support (various LDs) to wear a mask, keep windows open or even get a covid test. They still need support even if it isn't possible for ideal health and safety measure to be followed so we have to go with risk reduction. In an ideal world i agree with you, but in the real world some risks have ti be taken, in order to prevent much greater harm.

I do think schools should be open but obviously not when cases ate high and do think its right teAchers and pupils isolate if in a bubble or alternative would be regular testing
Also think maybe teAchers should be in the top few to get vaccination as that may be way to get schools more back to normal as such
Open yes but still si rules strictly followed

@user1471588124 I care about that, that is shit and I didn't realise you would have so little additional protection. Is your workforce unionised? Wouldn't they be better off protecting you more so fewer of you need to isolate/go off sick?

In my school I have taught 4 students who have gone off ill and then subsequently tested positive. 3 were just tired with a headache, but then parents got symptoms that were testable, so they got tested at the same time. A couple of parents have been really quite ill.
I currently have a headache and an itchy rash. I don't go anywhere other than work, home, and socially distanced walks/runs. All shopping is delivered to the garage so it is well ventilated. My DH works from home and likewise does nothing.
If I get ill from this it will be from my school or from my kids school. (They are too young to socialise independently)

They still need support even if it isn't possible for ideal health and safety measure to be followed so we have to go with risk reduction. In an ideal world i agree with you, but in the real world some risks have ti be taken, in order to prevent much greater harm.

I think that is exactly the same position as in schools - we know that risk reduction is the only way forward and understand that school staff have to take some risks.

We would just like the really, really obvious risk reduction measures to be taken, rather than actively blocked.

@Billie18

I’ve asked before and I’ll ask again.

When it’s more likely that children are asymptomatic, how do you know if they are perfectly healthy?

They may be carrying a various serious virus that could make someone else extremely unhealthy.

Or are you suggesting that teachers and other parents are simply collateral damage?

"Its just not possible for some of the people i support (various LDs) to wear a mask, keep windows open or even get a covid test. They still need support even if it isn't possible for ideal health and safety measure to be followed so we have to go with risk reduction. In an ideal world i agree with you, but in the real world some risks have ti be taken, in order to prevent much greater harm."

Hopefully the ones with severe LD are not out wildly socialising though, which should reduce your risk a bit?

@timeforanewstart secondary teacher will see hundreds of students, depending to some extent on their subjects - I teacher over a 100 on a Monday, for example.

@WhyNotMe40

I'm curious about the logic of this. I'm presuming you are saying this because you believe children's education is the top priority?

And that schools should look as normal as possible?

Do you also believe that children/teens can spread it to adults they are in contact with?

If you therefore value your children's education, why would you want to risk having their teachers potentially off ill for weeks?
There is one local school to me where they have so many supply teachers and cover supervisors in that the kids may only see an actual teacher 3 times a week. The other 22 lessons are all cover. .

Yes, i believe schools should be open as normal as much as possible in terms of overall risk reduction, even though children can infect adults (just as the people i support could infect me).

We have major staffing issues in the care sector, so i understand that it's very difficult (though i think a self isolation reduction to 7 days would help in both sectors). Of course its not ideal to have teachers off ill, but a situation you describe with 90% of teachers absent (if 22/25 lessons are taught by supply teachers) seems very unusual, even with Covid.

Honestly? The amount of parents really concerned about their child’s education amd need to be in school right now and the amount of parents who pay any real interest/hear their kid read/support their learning just doesn’t correlate.

@Billie18
Now that you came back....

1. Please explain why are masks and SD damaging for their mental and social development?

1. Why should children not isolate?

Proof, logical arguments welcome.

@WhyNotMe40

"Its just not possible for some of the people i support (various LDs) to wear a mask, keep windows open or even get a covid test. They still need support even if it isn't possible for ideal health and safety measure to be followed so we have to go with risk reduction. In an ideal world i agree with you, but in the real world some risks have ti be taken, in order to prevent much greater harm."

Hopefully the ones with severe LD are not out wildly socialising though, which should reduce your risk a bit?

They get support from multiple, different people every week so the risk is actually high.