Is a change beginning to happen regarding schools? (PART 2) The thread that the DfE felt they needed to comment on

[Covidfears]

Link to previous thread with the gaslighting by the DfE

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4082589-Is-a-change-beginning-to-happen-regarding-schools?msgid=102075920#102075920

Such lies from the DfE. Fudged data. There is NO DOUBT that teachers are at higher risk than any other profession and the data would show this if presented properly rather than that ridiculous primary/secondary/other stuff. Teachers are not being given the same protection that every other profession has. I hope to God that every teacher, parent and child that catches Covid at school takes legal action and makes the government’s life as difficult as possible.

I’m a vulnerable parent. Both my husband and I work from home. We have the food shop delivered once a week which is antibacced and then quarantined. If Covid comes into this house it will 100% be from school and I will be taking legal action for being forced to send my child to school with the threat of fines when the risk to my health is documented.

Councils are pleading to be allowed to implement blended learning or to close early for Christmas and are being told no. It seems this is the hill the government have chosen to die on....and die they will. No one will ever forgive the Torys for treating people so despicably. For knowingly endangering the lives of families and teachers whilst closing businesses in order to do that.

Then there’s the amount of children who have missed weeks of school who have to face important exams...and no information on how this unfairness will be addressed.

And where the fuck is Gavin Williamson?

Shame on you DfE.

Let’s hope some more mainstream media pick up on the fact that the DfE are resorting to posting lies on Mumsnet. Private Eye for example.

Let’s hope. Feeling the need to post propaganda on a Mumsnet thread must be a new low for our education system, and it’s had many.

Judging by Prof Whitty's comments on Tiers I am even more convinced that they are truly to get young people infected.
He was saying that Tier 2 would not reduce number of weekly cases, but those areas were at a level the NHS could cope with. Tier 1 would increase, Tier 3 will reduce.
This shows the intention to keep infections to the maximum that they judge the NHS will cope with.
Maximum.
This is still herd immunity strategy.
Therefore they want to get the group least likely to get a poor outcome infected as quickly as possible aka school kids.
Teachers and clinically vulnerable families are acceptable collateral.
Otherwise we would have better mitigations in schools - masks, ventilation, reduced class sizes, genuine bubbling (not 400 students per bubble like my school).

Truly intending

Teachers in this house (secondary) with primary aged kids in London’s (current) worst hit borough. No doubt in our minds or those of our colleagues and friends that teachers and students are being viewed as collateral damage by this useless government. Unions need to start shutting this nonsense down and I’m another one who hopes that legal action is taken by teachers who fall ill as a result of the lack of protection afforded them.

As others have said, the government have chosen to die on the hill of schools being kept open no matter what. Only they’re not the ones who’ll die, of course.

I posted this on another thread from my local news yesterday:

www.expressandstar.com/news/education/2020/11/26/schools-are-safe-places-say-leaders/

IRL my school closed for a week due to staff absence levels and we are reviewing weekly how to keep the school open by sending year groups home according to how many teachers are needed in school.

I feel most sorry for the exam students - Yr 12 and Yr 13 have had 5 periods of isolation since Sept. That’s 10 weeks out of school and they will be sitting the same exams as pupils who have little disruption, just because they had the ‘bad luck’ of attending school in an inner city area.

Others years have also faced disruption - Yr 7, 8 and 9 have had positive cases. Only the class bubble isolated but those years have been sent home due to staff levels. Yr 10 have had 4 periods of isolation and Yr 11 have had 2.

Each day I go into work wondering which classes I’ll be teaching face to face and which I’ll be teaching remotely. Each day I take all my resources home in case we have a call to say school will be closed. There is constantly a tense atmosphere - how can this be good for pupil’s well being?

I think it is intentional. If anything happens to my teacher daughter I'll be on the front page of every newspaper kicking up an almighty fuss.

Teachers are being treated like shit. Zero workplace protection.

Tbh I'm also frustrated with schools. My kids are at primary, their school has chosen bubbles of 90/120. Not only does this increase the risk of closure, it is putting staff, children and parents at increased risk.

Friends who have kids in primaries where they are bubbling by class dont have this issue. Why aren't schools being made to bubble as 30? Big bubbles mean constant closures, clearly the school leadership dont care

@Cherryade8

Tbh I'm also frustrated with schools. My kids are at primary, their school has chosen bubbles of 90/120. Not only does this increase the risk of closure, it is putting staff, children and parents at increased risk.

Friends who have kids in primaries where they are bubbling by class dont have this issue. Why aren't schools being made to bubble as 30? Big bubbles mean constant closures, clearly the school leadership dont care

Actually, that’s not the schools fault. Where I work we bubble as classes BUT we’ve just had a building extension a few years ago. We have been able to split every class into its own toilet area. My children’s school cannot. They don’t have enough toilets and they don’t have the staff to clean them every time a child has been. They haven’t provided schools with the necessary staff, funding, space of anything else stop make schools ‘safe’. The DfE know this which is why they are desperately trying to cover it up.

Cherryade8 my kids are the same, they are in huge year group 'bubbles', so a closure impacts on masses of working parents instead of just the class. I think the reason is down to staffing and lack of rooms though, so can't really blame the school.

Can anyone please share here what the dfe comments were? I haven't been able to keep up with the previous thread and didn't see them. Thanks.

@OverTheRainbowLiesOz

I think it is intentional. If anything happens to my teacher daughter I'll be on the front page of every newspaper kicking up an almighty fuss.

Teachers are being treated like shit. Zero workplace protection.

Oh I will be as well, if Covid comes into our home. My DH is a conservative local councillor and he is utterly ashamed of what his party is doing regarding schools and teachers so will have no qualms about speaking up against them. Next year he will be standing as an independent.

My brother is also a human rights lawyer so I will be utilising him as well.

@Cherryade8

Tbh I'm also frustrated with schools. My kids are at primary, their school has chosen bubbles of 90/120. Not only does this increase the risk of closure, it is putting staff, children and parents at increased risk.

Friends who have kids in primaries where they are bubbling by class dont have this issue. Why aren't schools being made to bubble as 30? Big bubbles mean constant closures, clearly the school leadership dont care

My primary school cannot bubble by class. We don't have enough toilets firstly. The classes have to share and we don't have enough staff to clean the toilets and sinks each time a child goes. We also don't have enough staff for staff to remain with one class. Support staff including dinner staff are shared between classes. We do what we can. We give up our breaks and lunchtimes so we don't mix bubbles with other year groups. We clean and sanitise as best we can. We care massively about the children and staff, many of whom have CEV family members at home.

It is fundamentally not that we don't care.

This is still herd immunity strategy.

I don’t think this is necessarily true.

Lockdown is so damaging to people’s lives that the only way it can be justified is that the demands on the NHS would be literally overwhelming if it wasn’t done. The same goes for tier 3 and tier 2 restrictions. It has never been the case that the government were aiming for elimination of COVID, they were always aiming for “manageable” levels - ie numbers that mean healthcare can still be offered to every patient. That doesn’t mean that they are aiming for naturally-acquired herd immunity. They will be, of course, be aiming for vaccine-acquired herd immunity in the very near future.

So what are the unions doing? Hopefully compiling a tonne of evidence and keeping kicking off?

Sorry, I’ve just come from another thread where I learnt that teachers aren’t allowed to isolate if children they are in close contact with test positive.

It also sounds commonplace they aren’t even TOLD if a child they have been teaching tests positive.

@ChloeCrocodile, allowing blended learning where possible, for example, is not damaging to people's lives. Why is this not happening?
Why is "covid safe" different for schools than offices?

"Healthcare offered to every patient" is great if you're not CV and being forced into unsafe conditions.

All the "impossible" safety measures for staff and children are in place and working in other countries.

We are an island, going for Brexit and at the top of covid death rates...the irony.

Sayitasitis2020, I completely agree with all of that. I'm a teacher and thing the risks we are expected to take are ridiculous. Plus the additional (and often unpredictable) workload that covid brings is starting to increase staff absence among my colleagues. With blended learning, the risks would be lower, lockdowns would be shorter / less strict and the workload would still be bigger than a normal year but it would be predictable.

I don't think the government are pursuing naturally-acquired herd immunity tho, nor that they are deliberately infecting children. I think they are indifferent to children being infected, don't care about teachers (who, as a group, don't tend to vote tory) and have decided that "schools will not close" is the single policy they won't u-turn on.

"This is still herd immunity strategy.

I don’t think this is necessarily true."

Yes it is. Look at the spread in schools. It is being ignored, covered up and Gavin is nowhere to be seen.

The government are also wrong to not be trying for suppression.
All the countries that have recovered best economically have gone for suppression.

DfE, you are gaslighting parents.
10% of my child's secondary currently have Covid, about 20% in total now have had it.

My one son, 14 has now spent 10 weeks total in isolation since Sept due to Mass cases at school, unable to even leave his house. My other son in secondary has had four weeks of this.

It's carnage - I also work with a number of schools, all with year groups or classes out, short on staffing.

You insult us as parents. My child caught Covid at school. It started to pass through that class. You have the audacity to say nothing to see here and continue to put, children, staff and families at risk. Worse, lie about it and shift the blame onto schools.

The unions are doing sweet fuck all apart from uttering the occasional murmur of discontent when they get enough angry tweets. Gavin is ‘busy’ poncing around an FE college. What a joke....apart from the fact the people are dying so it’s not very funny.

10% of his secondary school form

My secondary school teacher wife was hospitalised with Covid in October and is still recovering. At home now with long Covid. It's ruined her. How do I go about suing? What chance does a case have of succeeding?

Her school now has 3 year groups out, majority of staff being covered by supply teachers.

The primary school down the road has now closed.

I'm in Bromley (Kent but a London Borough so tier 2)

Schools Week piece
schoolsweek.co.uk/the-governments-covid-response-has-gone-from-shameful-to-shameless/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

'The government’s Covid response has gone from shameful to shameless'

Re bubbles -

This is not the gov fault but schools

You don’t need bubbles in secondary full stop - you just have to track

So what if they share toilets?! That’s not the guidance - it’s 2m for 15 mins end of. It’s nothing to do with passing in corridors, having picked something up in toilets, having been sat in a chair that so and so may have touched in passing - that’s ridiculous. Schools just need a seating plan end of

Same in workplaces - if your desks are 2m apart then no one else is a contact

Many schools can manage it and all should be doing it - they’ve been told to do it!!

Phe act on the info schools give them so if they can’t say who’s been with who then whole year goes home! That’s the schools fault, I know I’m a teacher, sixth form but we have to work in same way.

My dds have been in same class as postive covid on the day they were tested and not sent home as on opposite sides of
room - you may not agree with it but they are over 2m away so phe say not a contact. Without this tracking phe would send them all home

So many schools are sending year groups based on contacts of contacts - just making their own rules up.

Eg It doesn’t matter to Sam if he hangs out with Bob and Bobs mate tests positive - Bob goes home not Sam.

All this disruption is caused by schools not tracking or being too ive cautious. They’re not allowed to send kids home who haven’t had contact with a positive case. As such near me most kids have had none or at most 1 isolation period

Dd is in year 10, has 10 classes inc 4 GCSEs. She moves around all day everyday with different kids in each class. But school arranges kids to sit with those kids they share classes with eg dd is in 4 of those classes with xxxx so she has to sit with her in all 4 classes to minimise her contacts. She has no choice as it’s an arranged seating pla , she’s not even in her social circle but it reduces the number of different people sat around her

It works - my other dd in year 7 was sent home the other day as her mate tested positive - my dd sits next to her in 6/10 classes so only 8 kids total (out of year) sent home

Bubbles are not simply not needed if you track

When it comes to social contact at lunch and on the bus etc the kids are simply asked who are you with - it’s not policed - no one runs round like headless chickens watching cctv

Workplaces don’t do this - they track - schools need to take some responsibility and employ methods to reduce contacts

If your kida randomly go to lessons sitting next to anyone they like you need to be asking questions why