Coronavirus and care homes

[WinnieHarlow]

Having just read the awful situation where 15 residents in a care home have died, surely allowing loved ones to visit could exacerbate this situation? Its a dreadful situation. Is a solution to seek alternative accommodation for the loved one in care, until Covid is over?

@WinnieHarlow

I think you are describing extreme needs - and many people in homes are not as you describe. Many cultures would not even consider care homes as an option, and support within the family.

The vast majority of people in care home have needs like this because most others stay in their own homes until they can't manage

Even people with dementia can often live well on their own home until the latter stages. When they can't is if they are particularly anxious, at high risk of falls or have risky or challenging behaviours. At that point is usually when a care home is considered. That is very hard work for any relatives as it usually means they need 24/7 supervision.

What you've done for your mum is a lovely thing but honestly she does not represent most of the people in care homes (I have patients in across 6 care homes and have a role in assessment for when people need to move into care).

Also bear in mind that for most people of that generation they had their own children in their 20s, so these older people, now in their 80s, 90s, plus, their children are typically in their 60s or 70s themselves and may not be fit enough themselves to take care of their parents. For some people who've lived into their late 90s or early 100s they've outlived their children due to illness etc.

Knowing a few people or having a couple of examples about some people who can do it doesn't negate the fact that the majority can't. Hence why the person is in a care home.

Not everyone is able to, financially, physically or mentally care for an elderly relative.
I don’t judge them, I wish you wouldn’t OP just because you have been able to.

[quote WinnieHarlow]@CherryPavlova my mother has recently had a major operation for cancer, and is living with a stoma. I made the decision not to return to work and look after her with my 1 year old, and 9 year old. I gave up work, and we are scrimping as a family - as if I’d returned to work, she would have put herself in a care home. So I do have recent experience, not naive.[/quote]
That is for a sort time until she can manage again. My MIL was bedbound for 5 years, 2 of those at home, 3 in a care home. .

My mother needed nursing home level of care for nearly 3 years. Before that my sister and I cared for her at home for 4 years.

@WinnieHarlow please stop with the not so subtle digs at people who make the difficult decision to move a family member to a care home. It's great that you were able to give up work to look after your mum but not everybody is in a position to do that. Believe me, we feel sufficient guilt already. We don't need you to keep implying we're selfish.

I think many people confuse housing complexes for older people with care homes so don't understand the level of care the later require.

I don’t want to get involved in the general debate but I do want to say a huge thank you to tattoedmummy1 and all the carers out there. My mum was a carer for decades, only retiring in her seventies when I practically forced her due to her own ill health.

As with all professions, there is a minority of poor staff but the vast majority of carers do an amazing job for a pittance. They are a hugely undervalued and overworked workforce, carrying out tasks that sadly some others look down on them for. My mum would literally run between clients in her care home, where they had only 15 minutes to get people up, wash them, dress them, feed them and give them medication. For barely minimum wage (paid the same as the home’s cleaners) she was responsible for giving out controlled drugs and dressing open wounds, dealing with people with severe dementia who would bite, hit, spit etc.

My mum is incredible and has burnt herself out caring for others - I’m hugely proud of her. She would regularly do extra things (unpaid) for people (shopping etc), go back to visit lonely residents and buy things to cheer them up. She treated clients like family members and, as a society, we are so lucky to have people like her.

[quote WinnieHarlow]@CherryPavlova my mother has recently had a major operation for cancer, and is living with a stoma. I made the decision not to return to work and look after her with my 1 year old, and 9 year old. I gave up work, and we are scrimping as a family - as if I’d returned to work, she would have put herself in a care home. So I do have recent experience, not naive.[/quote]
That’s very nice of you but one anecdote doesn’t stop the naivety about who most residents in care homes are. It’s not generally sweet grey haired grannies with capacity knitting in the corner. It’s not just nursing home residents who have complex needs.
Living with a stoma is something most people don’t need care support with, assuming capacity and no other physical limitations. It’s not advanced dementia, paper thin skin and double incontinence.

It’s lovely your mother is getting family support. Many can’t have this or don’t want it. Many families can’t provide it for a multitude of problems.

@Beccatheboo

I don’t want to get involved in the general debate but I do want to say a huge thank you to tattoedmummy1 and all the carers out there. My mum was a carer for decades, only retiring in her seventies when I practically forced her due to her own ill health.

As with all professions, there is a minority of poor staff but the vast majority of carers do an amazing job for a pittance. They are a hugely undervalued and overworked workforce, carrying out tasks that sadly some others look down on them for. My mum would literally run between clients in her care home, where they had only 15 minutes to get people up, wash them, dress them, feed them and give them medication. For barely minimum wage (paid the same as the home’s cleaners) she was responsible for giving out controlled drugs and dressing open wounds, dealing with people with severe dementia who would bite, hit, spit etc.

My mum is incredible and has burnt herself out caring for others - I’m hugely proud of her. She would regularly do extra things (unpaid) for people (shopping etc), go back to visit lonely residents and buy things to cheer them up. She treated clients like family members and, as a society, we are so lucky to have people like her.

This made me unexpectedly teary, thank you

Your mum is amazing

Even in residential homes, there are people with needs who cannot easily be met at home. You sound incredibly naive.

Thanks tattoedmummy1, she’s also the best mum in the world! Keep up your incredible work and hold your head high. We need more people like you xx

@WinnieHarlow

Newborns require 24/7 care - I would argue that it could be achievable in private homes, and perhaps this option should be supported /funded - eg carers allowance.

Carers Allowance? £67 a week for providing 24/7 care?

Care of a newborn is not at all comparable to care of a vulnerable adult.

"Home care (also known as domiciliary care) is the ‘front line’ of social care delivery. In 2015, more than 350,000 older people in England were estimated to use home care services, 257,000 of whom had their care paid for by their local authority. A further 76,300 younger people with learning disabilities, physical disabilities or mental health problems were also estimated to be using publicly funded home care (Wittenberg and Hu 2015).... around 249 million hours of home care are delivered in England each year (Holmes 2016)."
Kings Fund.

Works out as 584 paid hours/person, per year. 10 hours/week (avg).
Those are the vulnerable adults whose needs can be met in private homes with "some" support. Many of those people in private residences will also be getting some regular care from family members. There are huge numbers already being cared for on an unpaid basis by their family (there are 6.5 million carers in England alone says Google).

Most people who can be cared for in private home by family members, are already there.

You’re in a very fortunate position if you can afford to give up your job and get by by scrimping. A lot of people don’t have that option. Especially if you have a career type job, it’s going to be almost impossible to get back into jobs once Covid is over because of the state of the economy.

[quote Corrag]@WinnieHarlow please stop with the not so subtle digs at people who make the difficult decision to move a family member to a care home. It's great that you were able to give up work to look after your mum but not everybody is in a position to do that. Believe me, we feel sufficient guilt already. We don't need you to keep implying we're selfish.[/quote]

Amen.

Believe me it wasnt an easy decision to make putting my mum in a care home. But it was the right one. I would far rather she was still in her own home or with us but it's just not possible. It would not be safe for her apart from all the other stuff. Please don't judge other people on your own circumstances which which sound manageable anyway. Just hope that things dont change too drastically for you in the future.

[quote Corrag]@WinnieHarlow please stop with the not so subtle digs at people who make the difficult decision to move a family member to a care home. It's great that you were able to give up work to look after your mum but not everybody is in a position to do that. Believe me, we feel sufficient guilt already. We don't need you to keep implying we're selfish.[/quote]
Amen to that too. Thank you to all the carers and because it is close to my heart thank you to all the carers in care homes for younger vulnerable people like my DC.

My original point was to say that - as people are desperately concerned about the mental health and lack of visitation options in care homes, shouldn’t the option of taking that loved one out of a care home for temporary care within the home through Covid - be considered more/made a more viable option/given more financial support?

The thing is, newborns are pretty small, and therefore physically manageable.

I've worked in a care home. Some people need specialist hoists, specialist showers or baths, specialist chairs, specialist beds, and still require two people to be safely moved. Some people become aggressive and refuse personal hygiene. You would need a lot of resource to be able to look after some of these people - basically, you'd probably need another person there or on call almost 24/7, so three or four full time employees? Even with a lower level of need, you might still need significant help, and a highly adapted house.

If you can, it can be a lovely thing to look after a relative. (My mum cared for my gran for a couple of years.) It can also be completely impossible. (At the end of that two years, gran had deteriorated to the point mum couldn't cope. She's now in a (very good) care home.)

@Shitzngiggles @corrag @monkeytennis97 @Gazelda - this article www.communitycare.co.uk/2020/04/21/social-workers-aiming-get-residents-care-homes-pandemic/

@110APiccadilly www.communitycare.co.uk/2020/04/21/social-workers-aiming-get-residents-care-homes-pandemic/

No one misunderstood your OP, but offered you plenty of reasons and examples as to why that isn't a viable option.

Care in a care setting is paid for in one of two ways, self funded (paid for my the persons estate, bank account, family etc) or social service funded. (or in some rarer cases maybe a mix of state and self funded)
For self funded individuals how would they obtain state help to remove themselves from the care setting and go home? No gov will give money out for that.
And as for SS funded, there's no chance. SS will only fund the necessary level of care. If the necessary level of care is care home (and that is the top whack) then they will fund care home. They will very likely not agree that the person should be funded to then go home, potentially increasing the bill to SS to attempt to provide the same level of care at home for, frankly, little benefit.

I absolutely did not want to imply that it was selfish, and I apologise/expressed myself in the wrong way. Its just distressing reading about the care home in Wales, and I’m trying to think of a solution.

And having just read the link you shared, I would to reiterate my point I made earlier that the way to protect care homes and thus our residents from covid is not by moving then out to live with their families but by not seizing our ppe shipments, by not making false promises in regards to virus testing, and by sorting out the issues with the tests so we aren't waiting over a week for staff results to come back.

Yes, it's shit. Yes, they are lonely. But care staff are tackling that.
What care staff need to protect residents is the PPE, accurate and rapid testing, and maybe the govt & everyone else should focus on why the govt promised accurate and rapid testing for visitors so we could allow people in again and then literally never followed through.