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Now we know why the govt were suppressing the schools infection data

671 replies

noblegiraffe · 22/10/2020 20:03

...because for secondary it’s very worrying.

They choose to release it the day before we break up for half term, too late for any circuit breaker like the other U.K. countries.

They’ve quietly removed the assertion that schools aren’t high risk settings from the guidance. At what point are they going to start to be honest about the risks, particularly in sixth forms and colleges?

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/928749/Weekly_COVID-19_and_Influenza_Surveillance_Graphs_W43_FINAL.pdf

Now we know why the govt were suppressing the schools infection data
Now we know why the govt were suppressing the schools infection data
OP posts:
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17
Piggywaspushed · 23/10/2020 15:46

Last I looked the Communist Party wasn't banned.

And, yes, I would be vvvv concerned about a eugenicist anywhere near any committee.

Piggywaspushed · 23/10/2020 15:47

I swear a Communist just got promoted to the HoL. Because she supported Brexit.

TheHouseonHauntedHill · 23/10/2020 15:55

There is defiantly something funny going on when one solution has been put into place very easily in a range of settings and yet in others there is a blank refusal to teach a single thing from home.

herecomesthsun · 23/10/2020 16:00

Actually Dominic Cummings seems to have closer links to Russia than Susan Michie, as far as I can see.

christinarossetti19 · 23/10/2020 16:06

@Enoughnowstop

Sound quality, acoustics, background noise, trying to address two different audiences, take questions from the room and also keep up with chat or 'hands up' on the screen.Do share your secrets about how to make this work fine. I honestly would like to know

So the alternative is that kids are sitting at home for 14 days at a time, perfectly well and have no possibility of interaction with their teachers? Or that teachers are sitting at home for 14 days a time, perfectly well, whilst their classes are taught by a supply teacher with a specialism in a different subject or key stage? It’s not perfect. But it is what we have at the current time.

If the school wants to provide remote learning, it has a responsibility to ensure that staff are trained

Agreed. But we are professional people and there is plenty of support online to help with the basics. There is nothing complicated about Teams if you are used to using a computer every day. A bit of trial and error will overcome most issues. Are we seriously saying teachers are unable to take some personal responsibility and just test it out?

how is pointing out that many families don't have even Broadband so can't access remote learning even if their school lends them Tech making 'excuses'?

This is a massive sticking point. Huge. Needs millions throwing at it to solve. Are we justified in not providing online support to those who can access lessons because some children can’t?

No. The alternative is that it's recognised that this is, as Jane says, at it's best 'not bad'.

It isn't the quality teaching that most children need to fully engage with school and do their best by the time public exams come round. The social problems for the children caught up in this shit storm have only just started - there will be repercussions for the rest of their life for some of them.

It's even less than 'not bad' for children who either don't have tech at home, have others in the house with multiple demands on a shonky internet connection or don't have an internet connection at all.

And properly addressing the attainment gap, the increased emotional and psychological needs in school, the challenges of a diminished school experience etc.

We agree that if schools want teachers to use a particular technology they need to provide the training. There needs to be training in safeguarding etc specific to your own institution if you're working with children.

I think our children's education, welfare and safety are worth more than a quick YouTube webinar, don't you?

And yes the attainment gap, poverty and deprivation needs millions spent on it, as does the education system that has been systematically underfunded for 10 years.

In terms of 'justifications', fortunately state schools work on a premise that all children are entitled to an education and use their (badly depleted) resources as best they can.

Are we justified in thinking 'tough' to children from disadvantaged background, your education doesn't actually matter?

I don't think we are.

Are we justified in blaming teachers and school for government short-comings, incompetence and short-sightedness.

Again, I don't think we are but appreciate that this is a minority view on MN.

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:37

Not read through the threads but just to add Italy has ensured all kids have dongles at home for remote learning. Yes it’s expensive but a drop in the Ocean compared to crashing the countries economy to ensure face to face teaching!

sunflowers246 · 23/10/2020 17:38

The latest data (bbc) shows that encouragingly cases among 10-19 year olds are starting to fall!

Despite being open!

sunflowers246 · 23/10/2020 17:39

Despite schools and Unis being open!

That's very encouraging imo. Hopefully they'll have some immunity for a while. Smile

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:44

The fact is whatever they discover re this virus, transmission from kids, reinfection timescale, long term damage, will dictate the response from Governments in the West. I personally think they’ve been too gung ho in assuming positive outcomes re all the above. Time will tell but data will come in and educated decisions will ultimately be made.

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:45

@sunflowers246 have you seen the social media campaigns deterring people getting tested??? % positivity is more telling.

Ecosse · 23/10/2020 17:45

@Oaktree55

It’s not either or. Schools are open full time across the country and the vast majority of the economy is open and will remain so.

We will not be destroying education and the economy again in order to ensure zero COVID deaths. It will just not be happening despite the hysterics from the lockdown fanatics.

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:48

@Ecosse all of your posts are not science based. 6p on basic income tax is where we are to date. Is that not destroying economy for school leavers??? What transpires re immunity/long term health implications will dictate the trajectory of this Pandemic not your opinion (luckily).

sunflowers246 · 23/10/2020 17:48

sunflowers246 have you seen the social media campaigns deterring people getting tested??? % positivity is more telling.

At my dc's Uni ALL students were tested and most had it. Encouragingly, 90% were asymptomatic!

So I do assume that a large proportion of teens will have had Covid and that rates are now coming down again.

Hopefully they'll have some degree of immunity for a while.

HipTightOnions · 23/10/2020 17:48

Who put Ecosse in charge?

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:49

@Ecosse it’s obvious you have a basic lack of understanding of maths and science. Nobody mentioned zero Covid bit the trajectory the U.K. is on is not sustainable. Best stick to what you can comprehend. In a way I envy you life is easier that way!

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:51

@sunflowers246 yes and I have an 18 year old extended family member positive twice in 5 months. What do you think that means for this country???

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:52

The young mildly affected will likely be proven to be the reservoir for this virus. That’s not good news.

cantkeepawayforever · 23/10/2020 17:52

Schools are open full time across the country

No. At a given moment, around half the secondary schools are open full time for all pupils. The other half are not open to some or all pupils because of infection and self isolation.

In some areas, no schools are open full time for all pupils, because they all have groups or year groups closed.

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 17:53

All circulating Cov’s have short term immunity.

Devlesko · 23/10/2020 17:59

The young mildly affected will likely be proven to be the reservoir for this virus. That’s not good news.

Under 5's have between 10% and 100% more viral load than any other group.
They are surely the super spreaders but how can you prove this without testing them.

ConfusedcomMum · 23/10/2020 18:02

This is what I'm talking about. Testing only symptomatic people is futile in trying to control this particular virus. It's a farce.

At my dc's Uni ALL students were tested and most had it. Encouragingly, 90% were asymptomatic!

Think about this. If they hadn't been tested, the 90% asymptomatic students could be following every rule to the letter and still have been spreading it amongst the community. Unless we are all tested regularly or have a total lockdown for 3 weeks (including border closure, China style), there's no way this virus is ever under control and the data will always be inaccurate. Think the Government just needs to be honest about this.

Oaktree55 · 23/10/2020 18:02

The data will come. Jesus I wish people read up more 🤦🏽‍♀️

TantieTowie · 23/10/2020 18:07

@amusedtodeath1

Why can't half the class be at home watching the lesson while the other half are in the classroom.

This is what my DDs college are doing, one week in the next home learning, but everyone is having the same lessons and doing the same work?

I think this is a good idea. That's what my pilates teacher is doing too, don't see why it wouldn't work for school children. But one thing to ensure is that all have access to a device and to the internet.
sunflowers246 · 23/10/2020 18:08

Unless we are all tested regularly or have a total lockdown for 3 weeks (including border closure, China style), there's no way this virus is ever under control and the data will always be inaccurate

Yes, cases are probably higher but that makes the death rate even lower!

Also, especially in Sixth form and Uni halls, rates appear to be falling. Perhaps because the majority have had it?!

Ecosse · 23/10/2020 18:09

@ConfusedcomMum

Yep, let’s have a total lockdown and destroy businesses and people’s livelihoods only for the transmission to increase again as soon as things open.

We also have the fact that we cannot have a ‘total lockdown’ as millions of key workers are needed for us to function. Would you be happy with no electricity and no food?