Now we know why the govt were suppressing the schools infection data

[noblegiraffe]

...because for secondary it’s very worrying.

They choose to release it the day before we break up for half term, too late for any circuit breaker like the other U.K. countries.

They’ve quietly removed the assertion that schools aren’t high risk settings from the guidance. At what point are they going to start to be honest about the risks, particularly in sixth forms and colleges?

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/928749/Weekly_COVID-19_and_Influenza_Surveillance_Graphs_W43_FINAL.pdf

State schools have been mixing live and remote learning too noble, I'm almost afraid to tell you.

Anthony Costello has just said that if we were pursuing a herd immunity policy in schools, we would send all the children back without masks and put them to sit in small crowded rooms together all day.

Hum

(I paraphrase)

Indie SAGE has quite a bit about schools today here

And also when they try to derail threads about school covid data and bring it to their favourite topic of how shit teachers are

That is literally in your head.

The most batshit reason (doesn't know how to use a computer) given for not wanting to implement remote learning came from a private school teacher by the way.

@Janevaljane

State schools have been mixing live and remote learning too noble, I'm almost afraid to tell you.

Yes and my school doesn't have the money nor the facilities to do that jane so I'm not sure how that's helpful.

If I were at home, I could do live lessons. If I'm in school, I can't.

But as I've said about a million times, don't assume that it's what the parents want or are able to facilitate.

That is literally in your head.

So what is it you're discussing, Jane, the covid data posted in the OP? No, no it's not.

Orange the data looks better for secondary but worse for primary so swings and roundabouts.

The ONS twitter feed you linked to says 'There have been increases in #COVID19 infection rates in all age groups over the past two weeks, including over-70s, with the current rates highest in older teenagers and young adults ' which doesn't fit with the graph for Y7-11 so I'm not sure what they're referring to.

And they're still shoving in sixth form with uni students. My graph in the OP shows why it needs to be separated out!

Schools must stay open primary and secondary .. the odd 2 week closure will not set them back as much as online learning will ... otherwise they wouid have done it by now.

My kids have no year closures and they are in 3 different schools so not sure why this needs to happen anyway.

Im the opposite. I have one home because school's closed. Im lucky we arent having to self isolate too like a lot of her friends.
Id rather blended learning than regular periods of self isolation for 2 weeks at a time. It isnt healthy staying indoors and not exercisinf for 2 weeks at a time.

The ONS twitter feed you linked to says 'There have been increases in #COVID19 infection rates in all age groups over the past two weeks, including over-70s, with the current rates highest in older teenagers and young adults ' which doesn't fit with the graph for Y7-11 so I'm not sure what they're referring to.

I think it's because if you look back at the 7-11 graph to Oct 2, there is growth to Oct 16 - a fortnight from the last date. Its gone up and then down again between the two but the 16th is still higher than the 2. So technically there has been growth in the last fortnight, though it might (large confidence intervals accepted) be on the way down again...

@Remmy123

Schools must stay open primary and secondary .. the odd 2 week closure will not set them back as much as online learning will ... otherwise they wouid have done it by now.

My kids have no year closures and they are in 3 different schools so not sure why this needs to happen anyway.

Bully for you. Indie SAGE are saying online now that looking at a range of options are really important "given the overcrowding".

So clearly other schools have been having problems, and it seems very reasonable for them to make sensible infection control precautions.

I don't understand the line of reasoning, if there is one, in the first sentence. On line working can be effective in many situations for many young people.

I think choice and flexibility are really important. If schools can stay open safely face to face that would be great, but it clearly isn't working out for too many people.

I agree the timing for the release of this is intentional although I suspect it’s to allow it to blow over during half term so schools can return as normal following it.

@herecomesthsun

Independent SAGE are a far-left group that includes communist party members. It’s all very well for them to state from their fantasy land that COVID is the only thing that matters and the government can just spend trilllions of pounds to resolve everything else.

Even Nicola Sturgeon who I am not a fan of to put it mildly was very clear this morning that schools must and will stay open on a full time basis as the damage to the Evel okay and DC’s futures of closing them is too great.

[quote Ecosse]@herecomesthsun

Independent SAGE are a far-left group that includes communist party members. It’s all very well for them to state from their fantasy land that COVID is the only thing that matters and the government can just spend trilllions of pounds to resolve everything else.

Even Nicola Sturgeon who I am not a fan of to put it mildly was very clear this morning that schools must and will stay open on a full time basis as the damage to the Evel okay and DC’s futures of closing them is too great.[/quote]
Indie SAGE far left?

They are full of eminent scientists- Anthony Costello is a former director of the WHO.

Schools did stay open over the summer term and will continue to provide education but we have to take into account the current spate of infectious disease and intelligently modify our strategies.

I am a fan of Nicola Sturgeon. What she actually said (after a quick google was

"Apart from the October holidays, which are already planned, we are not proposing to close schools, either wholly or even partially. I hope all of that gives people some reassurance."

That is a bit different from what you have written (which reads like your usual emphatic style) and of course a "proposal" could change in response to altering circumstances. And even if learning were in part on line, that wouldn't mean that schools were closed at all, they would just be doing things differently, in a 21st century way....

Apart from the October holidays, which are already planned, we are not proposing to close schools, either wholly or even partially. I hope all of that gives people some reassurance

That sounds like they aren't going to close schools to me.

Nope @herecomesthsun, Nicola Sturgeon was very clear in her update today that schools will not be closing at all, even in the highest tier 4 level.

Bless people who collate graphs onto the same axes.

What do the top three lines have in common?

For someone who claimed to have voted LibDem you don't half sound right wing Ecosse with your union bashing and your reference to eminent scientist as communists.

It didn't come from a private school teacher jane . It came form me about my DH. Because you seem to think all private schools are better and all teachers better facilitated , equipped and trained.

But I don't take kindly to my DH being called Batshit. He is a bloody good teacher who gets the best results in his department. He can't sue a compute. that isn't an excuse, it's a reason. When would you like him to be trained?

@Ecosse

Nope *@herecomesthsun*, Nicola Sturgeon was very clear in her update today that schools will not be closing at all, even in the highest tier 4 level.

Well, only reactively.

Once a school has closed all its classes due to cases in staff or students, it is closed - whether or not a government describes it as 'open'.

Same as currently - for the 400,000+ children per day (probably higher now) who cannot go to school because the school is closed to them, schools are not open

can I point out while everyone is piling in on my DH, his school never provided him with a laptop so he never had to use one. Only the most arrogant use the word just when referring to completely learning anew how to do a job you have done in an entirely different way for 30 years and expect staff to be able to do that overnight. He doesn't have a scanner to 'just upload things'. I know he is being a bit pathetic but lots pf people are resistant to change and by remote learning whilst other are in the room we are asking teachers to completely change methods- but not because it is better for learners to learn. It almost certainly is not. the screen share business is all well and good it all the kids are at home, which had been my initial point.

He is doing that. He is trying. He is also clinically vulnerable and shouldn't even be anywhere near school imo so I would kindly ask you to get knotted.

Surely even with blended learning they'll be episodes of self isolating when DC have been in close contact. Imagine that, they'd be out of school for even longer.

@Piggywaspushed

Susan Michie who is a member of ‘independent’ SAGE is a self-confessed member of the Communist Party of Great Britain and has been for 40 years.

Look it up.

The Lib Dems are a centrist party and I would describe my ideology as right-of-centre.

I don't care. Communists can understand Covid.

Union bashing is very right of centre, certainly.

@Piggywaspushed

Would you accept a Nazi on ‘independent’ SAGE? If not, why on earth can we trust a supporter of an authoritarian ideology that has killed millions of people.

Funny enough, I also voted Lib Dem in the last election .

I see absolutely nothing wrong with a scientist being a member of the Communist Party and fail to see what that has got to do with the price of eggs, or, indeed Coronavirus and schools.

We are after all not living in 1950s America and we have freedom of speech.

If anyone has good ideas for delivering education to kids in a pandemic, they should be given a good hearing, on the merits of the actual ideas, and not other tangential factors.