Two week circuit breaker - who's in favour?

[zafferana]

Keir Starmer is in favour - so are you?

If they did it over the next two weeks I actually wouldn't mind that much, as it's half term.

No. It's pointless. What do you think is going to happen when it's lifted in two weeks? Back to square one in no time.

Not really - there's so much mixing needed to keep essential services running.

Plus given how long March lockdown went on for - I wonder if Uni students and their parent would start to panic and worry about them being stuck for months in small rooms – so you could end up with more travel happening form high areas to lower in response to a national lockdown.

I think we’re stuck with local rolling lockdowns.

@IronLawOfGeometricProgression

And how many of these do we want to do? One every six weeks?

Wouldn't having an adequate Test and Trace system be a better option in every single way?

How do we think other countries have managed without Lockdowns? (The ones who have tens of thousands fewer deaths than us)

Adequate test and trace system is futile if the R rate is well over 1. You need to get the cases down first and make sure the testing system sorted out beyond that, which is what the government fucked by coming out of lockdown without that last time.

Look at Germany.

Yes please! But the schools should be closed to give it a chance to work. We're only in October - the thought of where we'll be next month without this scares me!

If you think a "two week" circuit breaker would last two weeks I have some magic beans to sell you. We are currently half a year into a three week "flatten the curve" circuit breaker with no end in sight so the chances of any of the retrictictions being removed after 2 weeks are zero.

Absolutely for it & I find it incredibly frustrating that the government is ignoring scientific advice to do so.

@AlohaMolly

If they’re going to do it they need to do it now, while furlough is still active. Compliance will be MUCH lower after end of October because who can cope on 67% of their wages?

For those that are fortunate to get furlough. There are approx 3M self employed who have either not received any financial help at all or minimum help I.e. new style JSA at £75.00 pw (taxable). It really depends whether you have been fortunate to receive furlough (my DH would be very pleased with 67% of his earnings - as new SE he got the JSA only after 44 years on PAYE). Believe me many would feel differently if they got no financial help during a circuit breaker. And don’t tell me lives are more important, please. Try being on our side of the fence. Money quite often is lives.

2 weeks isn't long enough. Back in March, we had something pretty similar when all but "essential" shops closed, plus garages, garden centres, leisure centres, gyms, etc., etc., It took 2 MONTHS for covid numbers to fall to the low levels we had in June. Trouble is that you can't lock everyone down. You still need "essential" workers in the food chain, emergency services, garages, hospitals, emergency tradesmen, etc., so it will still be spreading amongst those types of people. Not to mention we'd need strict border controls and quarantine for EVERYONE coming in from abroad. It just wouldn't work. We'd have 2 weeks of misery only for it to start spreading again straight after.

All it does is pause the inevitable it doesnt stop anything long term. People and businesses can't afford to take 2 weeks( or more likely longer) off work and the government can't afford to pay everybody again.

Yes the sooner the better!

Deaths are rising, although people argue not as many as before. These people are someones mother, father, brother, sister, grandparent etc.

People are missing the point that Match's lockdown was very very soft and compliance was not good.

Id rather 2 weeks now than 5 weeks in a month's time.

@Chaotic45

Nonsense- compliance was far better in March than the government planned for and many more businesses shut down than was intended.

*March's

@3littlewords

All it does is pause the inevitable it doesnt stop anything long term. People and businesses can't afford to take 2 weeks( or more likely longer) off work and the government can't afford to pay everybody again.

I don't understand why people don't understand that the whole point is to pause things!

If we pause-release-pause-release far fewer people will die, both from covid and non-covid causes.

Do you want hospitals to be so full of covid patients everything else gets cancelled?

I don't understand, genuinely, why this concept doesn't make sense to some.

@Chaotic45

People are missing the point that Match's lockdown was very very soft and compliance was not good.

The first couple of weeks WERE pretty good actually. I remember virtually no cars on the road, most shops were closed (except food), garages closed, most factories closed. People generally respected it at first. It was after that first 3 week period when it got extended (and extended) that people started getting fed up, workplaces started to open up again, etc. 2 weeks is nowhere near long enough simply because you can't close everything down.

@starfro exactly. People seem to jump on the bandwagon “it’s cause of failure of track and trace”. Yes you should be able to get test quickly and results in 24 hours, but those issues aren’t causing cases to spiral.

In countries like South Korea you test positive you are put in an isolation centre, they go through your bank statements to track down contacts. That’s the only way you could eliminate this disease.

The problem in this country is that people aren’t following the rules or self isolating when told to and a 2 week circuit break ain’t going to help that.

Yes I support it. We can't just sleep walk as we are now.

I'm a bit sick of hearing the phrase "kick the can down the road" as a negative response. It is exactly what needs to be done NOW. Transmission needs to be slowed, numbers of positive cases in especially the asymptomatic need to be out of circulation and not in contact with people outside their home in order for this to happen. We need to buy time.

Its all very well saying that the deaths of vulnerable people are inevitable and kicking the can down the road won't save them.....imagine actually saying that to someone who was extremely clinically vulnerable. Imagine saying to them that death or severe ill health was inevitable and you would rather get it over with sooner! Its not morally acceptable. End.

I think it needs to be at least two weeks. The length of it very much depends on the severity of the measures and how strictly we abide by it.

I'm prepared to believe the epidemiologists that this will make a difference, and it makes a lot of sense to do it over half term. If we don't do something, infections and deaths will keep spiralling out of control, and I can't see the latest measures doing anything realistic to prevent that unless the government is proposed to go in for some pretty draconian enforcement strategies.

It would NOT be for two weeks.

"Just another week..."
"Just another week..."
"Just another week month..."
"Just another month year..."

Remember the WHOPPING LIES "We can turn this virus around in twelve weeks" and "normalish by Christmas"?

Saint Boris himself said "when you remove freedoms, it's very difficult to grant them again".

If it’s the absolutely definitely the only only way to get cases down to a manageable level and nothing else will work then okay, I suppose, but oh God I feel absolute despair at the thought of working from home with schools and childcare shut again.

I think in March the message got confused about who could go to work. The message was if you can, work from home. Otherwise you could go to work. A lot of people wrongly interpreted as only keyworkers were allowed to work. My DH is SE and he worked (admittedly only a few days a week as he had barely any work) throughout lockdown. There was barely anyone using the train, and he was the only person in the building at work.
Will there be new furlough or self employment help?

I don't see the point if schools stay open. The Scottish health woman on the news just now said we all know households mixing in any setting is the main problem, school is 30 households per class mixing everyday.

I'm not saying this lightly, as the mum of a yr 11 due to take GCSE exams next year I am desperately worried about her education but I would rather a short sharp closure now than the inevitable longer one later once hospitals are totally overrun.

No, if the following is true:
SAGE minutes say that if a 2-3 week fire break/circuit breaker was as strict and well-adhered to like the restrictions in late May, this could put the epidemic back by approximately 28 days.

Starmer has demonstrated he doesn't have a clue about basic flu epidemiology that has been known for years, so I don't think I'll be relying on his wisdom regarding COVID.

It sounds incredibly attractive.

Except.... Remember the three month circuit breaker? Even if there were 100% compliance / enforcement, it will be back within a week or two. It was tried in the most isolated / isolationist countries in the world. And they stayed at a better place than we would. It hasn't worked. Humans emerge. So does the virus. You need six months. Then we'll all be deaf of other stuff, so it won't matter.