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Original poster

New guidance just published on Clinically Extremely Vulnerable

96 replies

Goldistheanswer · 13/10/2020 11:39

I’ve just read the guidance and it seems that there will be no shielding apart from in very small (high risk) areas and only for short periods of time.

OP posts:
Thisisnotnormal69 · 13/10/2020 12:06

Could you post link please?

Badbanana · 13/10/2020 12:10

Well I’m sure that will definitely help the NHS...ffs.

The most medically vulnerable in society, just thrown to the pandemic lions.

QueenOllie · 13/10/2020 12:14

It's crazy when my consultant (who knows the risks specific to my condition) has advised me to carry on shielding

Ecosse · 13/10/2020 12:55

This seems like madness to me. I’d reintroduce shielding on a voluntary, funded basis. This would help prevent the hospitals being overwhelmed and avoid the need for another lockdown.

Grausse · 13/10/2020 12:59

I've read through it all and it makes a lot of sense to me.
It's guidance on being extra careful and not the complete stay at home as before.

herecomesthsun · 13/10/2020 13:01

Thank you very much for the link.

I'm not keen on all the shielding being compulsorily shut away indefinitely.

I'm also not keen on pretending that there isn't a problem.

Is there really no middle way?

Also does anyone know when Jenny Harries is supposed to be speaking about this?

herecomesthsun · 13/10/2020 13:13

And some discussion on the BBC website

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54525067

EmmaBrightside · 13/10/2020 15:01

I don't know what to do. I'm supposed to be returning to work from furlough soon but I don't feel safe. I am considering stopping taking my immune supressant medication because I need to keep the wage, though I may be on the verge of being made redundant anyway. I absolutely hate this situation and the Government.

Grausse · 13/10/2020 15:11

@EmmaBrightside I don't know what medication you are on but I caution you to take medical advice before stopping.
I have (among other things) RA and had to stop my immune suppressing medication to have chemotherapy. My RA was well controlled and I was symptom free. I underestimated it's severity because the resulting flare of symptoms was appalling. Not only that it has taken me 10 months to not quite get back to where I was before.
I have read several articles that suggest auto immune diseases haven't proved to be as dangerous as first expected. So ask your specialist?

Is there really no middle way? I feel like the new guidance is a middle way. Lots more caution than the rest of the population but without the imprisonment. Different levels depending where you live.

obscureone · 13/10/2020 15:12

I think the Gov are saying "make your own decisions, you are on your own" Hmm

Cupcakegirl13 · 13/10/2020 15:15

I don’t understand why people on here need to be told what to do ?!!!! Just make safe decisions based on your local rates of infection and common sense ? The government can’t possibly fund shielded people indefinitely , which is sad and hard for many people but it’s the truth .

IrmaFayLear · 13/10/2020 15:18

This all makes sense.

It’s the advice someone would receive in non-Covid times if they were, say, undergoing chemotherapy.

ssd · 13/10/2020 15:31

No one is asking to be funded indefinitely, but there should be financial assistance for people who should be shielding. There shouldn't be a choice between homeless or dead. That's immoral. This country has the money.

SheepandCow · 13/10/2020 15:32

@EmmaBrightside

I don't know what to do. I'm supposed to be returning to work from furlough soon but I don't feel safe. I am considering stopping taking my immune supressant medication because I need to keep the wage, though I may be on the verge of being made redundant anyway. I absolutely hate this situation and the Government.
Immunosuppressants likely reduce rather than increase the risk. For example, RA patients (those on medication) are underrepresented in hospital admissions (worldwide - so clearly unrelated to shielding).

Covid is now known to be a vascular and inflammatory disease.

The government can't easily setup a new shielding list because there are so many genuinely extremely clinically vulnerable. For example, many diabetics (who make-up 25% of all the deaths) work in hospitals, social care, and schools.

Add in the non medical risk factors - urban area, deprivation and poor housing (see SAGE and ONS data on this), and choosing who to protect and who to throw to the wolves becomes increasingly difficult.

Shielding also ignores the risks to everyone of the potential long-term disability of Long Covid.

WanderingMilly · 13/10/2020 15:39

People don't need to be told what to do. If you are happy to be out and about (masked, distanced etc.), then go out, whatever your age, whatever your condition.

If you feel worried, anxious, vulnerable, have other conditions that you feel would be risky or exacerbated if you caught the virus, stay in, shield yourself or whatever combination you feel comfortable with.

You don't need the government to tell you which to do...

IrmaFayLear · 13/10/2020 15:48

Heartily agree, WanderingMilly.

With no vaccine in sight, it is not possible to finance people to stay indoors... not to mention their household members. There might never be a vaccine. It’s a bugger, but there it is.

Ecosse · 13/10/2020 15:53

@IrmaFayLear

Funding the vulnerable to stay at home to prevent hospitals being overwhelmed is a lot more affordable than shutting down the economy and keeping everyone at home.

7Days · 13/10/2020 15:58

Of course people need to be told what to do, in line with the best knowledge the experts currently have.

You dont have to take that advice - but pretending what some rando feels is equivalent to the most up to date info an expert has is ridiculous.

Haenow · 13/10/2020 16:06

[quote Ecosse]@IrmaFayLear

Funding the vulnerable to stay at home to prevent hospitals being overwhelmed is a lot more affordable than shutting down the economy and keeping everyone at home.[/quote]
@Ecosse

Have you considered that “the vulnerable” also keep the economy going?

SheepandCow · 13/10/2020 16:10

[quote Ecosse]@IrmaFayLear

Funding the vulnerable to stay at home to prevent hospitals being overwhelmed is a lot more affordable than shutting down the economy and keeping everyone at home.[/quote]
Not really, considering that The Vulnerable are a very large group (that's if you include all highly vulnerable, rather than a selected few). We'd lose an awful lot of essential workers. Add in their households (because most people don't live on their own) and that's likely more than 50% of the working age population.

Again. People seem determined to ignore the inconvenient fact that Long Covid risks mean everyone is potentially vulnerable.
However much ecosse tries to claim it doesn't exist, I'd say people are better off listening to world governments, scientists and doctors worldwide, the NHS, the CDC, the WHO, and other experts - all of whom say it does. The NHS isn't setting up treatment clinics for an imaginary illness.

VaTeLaverLesMains · 13/10/2020 16:11

I think it's wrong that extremely vulnerable people have to work in schools for example. I'm lucky as we don't depend on my wage so can make a 'choice' but I still lose my earnings.

SheepandCow · 13/10/2020 16:35

@WanderingMilly

People don't need to be told what to do. If you are happy to be out and about (masked, distanced etc.), then go out, whatever your age, whatever your condition.

If you feel worried, anxious, vulnerable, have other conditions that you feel would be risky or exacerbated if you caught the virus, stay in, shield yourself or whatever combination you feel comfortable with.

You don't need the government to tell you which to do...

Many people do need the government to tell their employers and landlords etc what to do. Workers can't just not turn up to the workplace (loads of jobs including hospital, social care, and schools, can't be done at home). And many tenants were forced to allow unnecessary visits i.e. non urgent repairs or inspections unless on the shielding list.

Slightly off topic, but many vulnerable tenants are not allowed to protect themselves. The eviction ban has been lifted but in any event it never applied for many - lodgers, etc. The media reports imply it's only happening for rent arrears but in actual fact the no fault evictions mean many tenants are evicted despite paying their rent in full. There are several recent threads on here about landlords selling up and evicting their tenants.

Ecosse · 13/10/2020 16:42

@SheepandCow

To be frank, post viral syndrome, unpleasant as it may be for some people (a very small number IMO) is just not a reason to shut down society and keep everyone at home.

Egghead68 · 13/10/2020 16:45

@Grausse

I've read through it all and it makes a lot of sense to me. It's guidance on being extra careful and not the complete stay at home as before.
It seems like exactly the same guidance given to the general public to me.
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