Are we allowed 7 people in our house in different rooms?

[Firefliess]

DSD and her BF have come to stay this weekend. We also have DD and DSS and me and DH at home, so that makes 6 of us. DD wants her BF to stay over tomorrow night. I can't figure out whether that's allowed or not. It would mean 7 people in the house, but in no sense would we be "gathering" DD and her BF would get in late and go straight to her room. Rest of us probably we wouldn't even see him. Is that allowed? Or are people considered to be "gathering" simply by being in the same house? We're in England by the way and not in an area with any local lockdown

All this not being able to count to 6 and follow a simple rule is ridiculous. Stop looking for loop holes, suck it up and stop thinking that the rules can't possibly apply to you.

I'm curious about how the OP'S set up is all that different from my set up living in a tenement block. It sounds like the DD and BF would be in a self contained area, just using the "communal" stairs. Someone mentioned something about air circulating throughout the building (ie there would be a risk of transmission simply by being in the same building). I do think that there is an important distinction between a "gathering" of more than 6 and more than 6 people being in the same building.

What if you household is 6 people to start with? Does it mean nobody can ever visit?

I feel like I should know the answer but I don't.

@REDLIPSTICKANDNAILS

No. The rule is 6. You will have 7. I get that it's ridiculous but surely you understand that 7 people is not 6?

Surely you understand that it applies to people in a gathering? And that by law that is defined as "when two or more people are present together in the same place in order to engage in any form of social interaction with each other, or to undertake any other activity with each other"? Therefore the rule does not apply to seven people who are not interacting or undertaking any activity with each other?

It seems likely that soon none us will be allowed anyone outside our family in the house. We can then thank all the people in the country taking the lines being taken here.

Does it mean nobody can ever visit?
Correct. If the 6-person household bubbles with one single-person household, then that person can come over, otherwise no visitors. A healthcare professional might go there to do their job, but should wear PPE.

It’s not looking for loopholes, it’s trying to understand both the intent of the law and manage risk whilst still being able to carry on with elements of our life that are important to our wellbeing.

Most of the social activities my DC and I would do involve more than 6 people under the same roof but 6 or fewer “gathering”.

I can just blindly accept that >6 under same roof is banned under all circumstances and suck up the fact I’ll have barely any social life for another 6 months, or I can try to understand whether that is the correct interpretation of the law as intended.

Thank you @MRex

It’s not that the rules are confusing at all. You just have a large household by default and are effectively confusing yourself by trying to find loopholes.

@MRex

How about each student in a flat of 8 has 5 friends over for drinks? A mere 48 in a flat, but they've all arrived and are leaving at different times, and the rooms are en suite. Certainly not a party, it's just the 48 of them in their different groups. Would you tie yourselves in knots to pretend that's OK too?

If it was a big enough flat that 48 people could all stay 2m apart from each other at all times and not use any of the same shared facilities, then I would think it was ok (legally, I wouldn't personally suggest it's sensible)

however, unless student flats have changed massively (pun intended) since I was at university, I doubt this is anything other than an extremely hypothetical situation.

Your house in its entirety and your garden is 1 setting - so no more than 6 anywhere in your house/garden

Technically not allowed but I wouldn't stop it.

Frappuchinonthats what Im not sure about. Surely 4 in your garden not mixing with the 4 asleep in your house would be okay.

@PineappleUpsideDownCake

Frappuchinonthats what Im not sure about. Surely 4 in your garden not mixing with the 4 asleep in your house would be okay.

I think it’s clear from the highlighted paragraph? Taken from www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing#seeing-friends-and-family

Doesn’t matter if it’s indoors or outdoors, no more than 6 people

[quote avenueq]@VanGoghsDog you don't have to socially distance from someone you're in an established relationship with[/quote]
Where is that written? I've not seen it.

[quote EarlGreyJenny]@VanGoghsDog

I mean, if we're saying it's legal to have the boyfriend over because the 7 people are not gathering together, then it must be legal for someone to have 5 friends over, their partner have 5 friends over and their kid have 5 friends over as long as the groups don't gather all together. Can someone please confirm the legality of this. Because if the law allows for this, IMO, that is bonkers [/quote]
Exactly - that's not what it says, it says six, end of story!

@MRex

How about each student in a flat of 8 has 5 friends over for drinks? A mere 48 in a flat, but they've all arrived and are leaving at different times, and the rooms are en suite. Certainly not a party, it's just the 48 of them in their different groups. Would you tie yourselves in knots to pretend that's OK too?

I don't know. I would imagine not just in student flatshares but in all houses of multiple occupation that is a real problem right now, and another reason for the law to say 'gathering'. I know a (large) house rented out to 7 separate people (locks on bedrooms, etc). It would seem pretty unfair to never allow any of them to have anyone over.

And (to go back to the drafting) plenty of MPs are landlords and may well be mindful of this situation.

However, given fines for 30 people indoors in certain circumstances are £10k, I would think that is a situation no-one would want to risk.

@VanGoghsDog

@Frappuccinofan

It’s not that the rules are confusing at all. You just have a large household by default and are effectively confusing yourself by trying to find loopholes.

Yet again, IT IS NOT A LOOPHOLE. It is literally following the legislation to the letter. It is people trying to claim that the law says what it doesn't who are looking for loopholes.

isadorapolly

Technically it’s breaking the rules but I’d let them.

So glad I’m not the only one. I would also allow it in my house.

@Frappucinofan, your problem is that you are looking at the guidance but not the statute. But even the guidance talks about not meeting in groups, as opposed to not having more than six people under the same roof.

It's a similar issue to students in shared houses with boyfriends/girlfriends. Are you REALLY saying you expect them not to have "close contact" for potentially six months, or is it more sensible to say - you can see each other but keep away from other housemates?

@Frappuccinofan That's the rules I was looking at. We wouldn't have more than 6 indoors or outdoors! 4 indoors and 4 outdoors surely?

For example, if the alternative to having the gathering in the house (say, for example, a woman having 3 friends over while her 2 children are asleep and her husband is elsewhere in the house) is for her and the friends to go to the pub, what is the best situation?

That's bit "the alternative" though, is it? The alternative is not to have friends round, or just have one or two.

*not the alternative