We were doing ok until we opened all the schools....

[Bbq1]

After lockdown was lifted pre September and pubs, restaurants etc were opened we seemed to have a handle on Covid with cases, hospital admissions and deaths all declining fairly steadily. Since we released millions of school aged children and thousands of teachers etc back into the classroom- boom, cases and consequently deaths, are now growing very rapidly again. It didn't take a rocket scientist to work out that this would happen. I work in a school and I have a 15 year old starting his gcse's so I 100% don't want the schools to close but surely there must be a more workable solution? Couldn't schools be one week, one week off for different bubbles or alternate days? Nobody wants schools to shut but surely in the long term if we don't get something safer in place and just continue sending kids and adults in day after day, then eventually they will close again?

@pluckedpencil im glad out children were allowed out to exercise and Italy's cases although lower are still hitting over a thousand a day
Our schools were open to keyworker children only in may and there were very few cases, people had to work like dr and nurses etc
We only all went back in sept to school full time

@Bluelinings

Looking at this thread I realise. If cases were rising before schools opened - they opened in an unsafe way. If they’re weren’t - well they also clearly opened in an unsafe way. The government promised a fully functioning track and trace and low transmission. That isn’t the case. I took a look at the Us4Them group. Their views are disturbing and their campaigning is militant. They have no empathy or conscience for the illness they’ll cause.

Hear hear. On all points.

@Pomegranatepompom

The phrase ‘thrown under a bus’ never heard it pre covid, now it seems to be on every thread. A MN thing?!

It's a common saying! I have heard it loads before covid.

@noblegiraffe

Bloody hell this thread is Us4Them all over again. Someone will be along to tell teachers who are unhappy with unsafe working conditions to resign next.

Yep. MilesJupp could get a great haul for her "list" from here.

Us4them - are they the conspiracy group?

And noblegiraffe I expect you'll be telling everyone that blended learning is the magical solution to all our woes? Except - oh dear!! - parents have to work, to keep the economy going, and you know, keep teachers paid and the NHS afloat, but they can't do that if the kids can't go to school can they?

Honestly its like bloody groundhog day around here sometimes

You're not wrong, OP. Schools are a massive factor, together with the fact that the government actively encouraged people to travel and make use of the hospitality industry in the month or two beforehand, which added plenty of Covid cases to the general September swill of germs being swapped around.

I think there was a pretty easy solution tbh, but it needed a modicum of foresight and planning to carry out, and that was for schools to invite parents to express a preference for remote or on-site learning. Everyone here knows that parents are split right down the middle about whether they want and need their kids to be back in school or whether they can or would prefer to have them at home. Schools could then have run their eyes over the lists to check that kids who are struggling academically or have vulnerable family situations were included in the on-site group. Parents would be told that not everyone's preference could be accommodated numbers-wise to avoid stigmatising those groups. Then you put kids in bubbles based on who lives near each other and will travel home on the bus together anyway, suspend fines for non-attendance, and set up the tech so that home-based kids are participating remotely via zoom or teams in the same class other kids are actually there for.

Et voila. Families with vulnerable health status or whose kids preferred home learning during lockdown are happy, families who use school as childcare or whose kids need the social aspects of school are happy, everyone's getting an education, bubbles are a manageable size. It's not perfect but it's way better than what we ended up with.

(You do need to sort out the testing debacle as well though.)

Parents need to work, yes, but they're not solely responsible for "keeping the economy going." I think the figure is 8% of the workforce that have primary-aged children (of an age to need childcare if schools aren't open).
Just sayin,' (in the interests of balance).

@Juststopswimming What's your plan?

And noblegiraffe I expect you'll be telling everyone that blended learning is the magical solution to all our woes?

I don’t tend to do that.

I’d like other mitigation measures in first.

Test and trace was a pretty fucking important one, but they ballsed that up.

Except - oh dear!! - parents have to work, to keep the economy going, and you know, keep teachers paid and the NHS afloat, but they can't do that if the kids can't go to school can they

Except schools are closing due to infections - meaning that parents won't be able to go to work anyway.

There are two approaches - cross fingers and hope you are 'lucky' in the constant hokey cokey of closures, but go to work every day not being sure whether it will be today that you are rung to take your child home for 14 days; or have something more sustainable and predictable in place. Nobody WANTS blended learning, but it may be the least bad of two awful options.

[quote letsghostdance]@Batshitbeautycosmeticsltd Well we should have opened schools using blended learning which was what was originally planned and risk assessed for. Then by this point we might have been able to open schools full time to pupils. Instead we're stuck with this.[/quote]
This

@CallmeAngelina but parents work for their own personal reasons to pay the bills and put food on the table not to do their moral duty to the economy

@Bluelinings

Looking at this thread I realise. If cases were rising before schools opened - they opened in an unsafe way. If they’re weren’t - well they also clearly opened in an unsafe way. The government promised a fully functioning track and trace and low transmission. That isn’t the case. I took a look at the Us4Them group. Their views are disturbing and their campaigning is militant. They have no empathy or conscience for the illness they’ll cause.

It doesn't mean anything of the sort.

It probably means that track and trace is simply being too slow and this was already a problem before the schools reopened.

It does keep coming back to difficult questions about how track and trace is not fit for purpose and we have socio-economic issues over who can afford to isolate.

UsforThem are awful. They really have lost their way - the Scottish one is unbelievable!

As a teacher (in a low incidence area) I’m glad schools are back. I am so happy to see the pupils happy and having relatively normal childhoods.

I teach secondary and the rooms I work in are not very well ventilated. I am not wearing a mask as I struggle to breathe in one. I have no underlying health issues but I am concerned. However the stress of the alternative - being highly vigilant, distancing from the pupils and being masked up at all times is too much mentally for me (given the low incidence here).

@ConquestEmpireHungerPlague

You're not wrong, OP. Schools are a massive factor, together with the fact that the government actively encouraged people to travel and make use of the hospitality industry in the month or two beforehand, which added plenty of Covid cases to the general September swill of germs being swapped around.

I think there was a pretty easy solution tbh, but it needed a modicum of foresight and planning to carry out, and that was for schools to invite parents to express a preference for remote or on-site learning. Everyone here knows that parents are split right down the middle about whether they want and need their kids to be back in school or whether they can or would prefer to have them at home. Schools could then have run their eyes over the lists to check that kids who are struggling academically or have vulnerable family situations were included in the on-site group. Parents would be told that not everyone's preference could be accommodated numbers-wise to avoid stigmatising those groups. Then you put kids in bubbles based on who lives near each other and will travel home on the bus together anyway, suspend fines for non-attendance, and set up the tech so that home-based kids are participating remotely via zoom or teams in the same class other kids are actually there for.

Et voila. Families with vulnerable health status or whose kids preferred home learning during lockdown are happy, families who use school as childcare or whose kids need the social aspects of school are happy, everyone's getting an education, bubbles are a manageable size. It's not perfect but it's way better than what we ended up with.

(You do need to sort out the testing debacle as well though.)

I agree with this.

School from home if you can/need to/want to.

Instantly lowers numbers in class

(I am a parent and a teacher. I work with my mobile on my desk - unheard of pre-Covid - on constant alert in case DD or DS are sent home to isolate during the course of the day. Every day. Luckily, they are old enough to be at home on their own, once fetched. But as a parent, I would prefer some predictability rather than the constant stretched-wire tension of 'is today their last day in school?'

@CallmeAngelina

Parents need to work, yes, but they're not solely responsible for "keeping the economy going." I think the figure is 8% of the workforce that have primary-aged children (of an age to need childcare if schools aren't open). Just sayin,' (in the interests of balance).

A valid point I say!

@ConquestEmpireHungerPlague
Sounds ideal tbh.

We? Millions of us have been in local lockdown since the beginning of August when cases had been rising for a few weeks already

Schools are definitely part of the problem because they are well known for being mass incubators for illnesses. This is not the fault of schools or kids or staff, it's the nature of the beast. I think we will need to be practical and say something along the lines of primary schools should stay open as this is the age where parents found it most hard to cope and kids sufferered the most. Secondary schools can be more flexible especially with older year groups with the aim of cutting down the numbers of children physically in school and travelling. The reality is that without more restrictions now, eventually a lockdown with schools completely shutting is more likely.

being highly vigilant, distancing from the pupils and being masked up at all times is too much mentally for me (given the low incidence here)

I live and work in a very, very low incidence county. Consistently tiny cases for many months.

2 year groups closed already in local secondary. Third will join them over the next day or so as have 1 case and so far that has always been followed by a second within a couple of days.

Don't think it can't happen to you.

@cantkeepawayforever

Except - oh dear!! - parents have to work, to keep the economy going, and you know, keep teachers paid and the NHS afloat, but they can't do that if the kids can't go to school can they

Except schools are closing due to infections - meaning that parents won't be able to go to work anyway.

There are two approaches - cross fingers and hope you are 'lucky' in the constant hokey cokey of closures, but go to work every day not being sure whether it will be today that you are rung to take your child home for 14 days; or have something more sustainable and predictable in place. Nobody WANTS blended learning, but it may be the least bad of two awful options.

And - oh dear!! - some vulnerable people might die because of the lack of safety in schools and the lack of test and trace.

Never mind about the loss of life, that sort of thing is actually very bad for the economy as well you know. We can't plug away in offices as normal while people die around us and society is overwhelmed.

The Tories would have done that in March if it were at all possible. It isn't.

Think about it.

@cantkeepawayforever

Except - oh dear!! - parents have to work, to keep the economy going, and you know, keep teachers paid and the NHS afloat, but they can't do that if the kids can't go to school can they

Except schools are closing due to infections - meaning that parents won't be able to go to work anyway.

There are two approaches - cross fingers and hope you are 'lucky' in the constant hokey cokey of closures, but go to work every day not being sure whether it will be today that you are rung to take your child home for 14 days; or have something more sustainable and predictable in place. Nobody WANTS blended learning, but it may be the least bad of two awful options.

For some families who live hand to mouth a "hokey cokey" approach is the best they can hope for.

CallmeAngelina are you a working parent?

What would happen if you lost your job due to being unable to go to work?