It's just an overreaction.

[madcow88]

Now don't get me wrong I followed the rules to the letter and still am doing as I don't want to break the law.

However I think it's all a massive overreaction and I don't want to sit by and allow my children's generation to be destroyed.

Their education is totally fucked, they will not get to have the same social experiences as we did as young people.

Why is everyone happily sitting by and allowing our government to restrict our lives over a virus that kills 0.01% of people. Whilst 1000s of people are dying every day due to the lack of treatment and social interactions.

I really just do not feel comfortable with all the laws on our freedom being changed so dramatically over a virus if truth be told is not as deadly as they would like us to be believed.

Don't get me wrong I have sympathy for those people who lost their lives and for the people who will lose their lives in the future but no more than for the people who die of flu and other viruses each year.

@Lweji

Firstly you’ve got to have reglar testing for care home staff with quick turnaround times- this still doesn’t seem to be happening.

Secondly, you need to stop staff moving between different homes. Thirdly, there has to be adequate access to PPE for staff which there wasn’t earlier in the year.

Regular testing of staff is vital but so to is the need to keep cases in the wider community under control. If the virus was allowed to circulate uncontrolled as many posters repeatedly suggest, it would not spread easily to carehomes, hospitals, extremely critically vulnerable homes. A worker could test negative, then catch it the next day, be asymptomatic spread it around before next getting tested.

• should say 'soon spread'

Where's MP00 then? Won't be happy Boz says we've got to protect the elderly instead of putting them out their misery and taking their houses. Is she sulking?

@mrshoho

We should have a system where care homes effectively become ‘bubbles’ where a group of staff staff live on site for say a week at a time (sort of like offshore oil workers do) and are then replaced by a different ‘bubble’. They would then need to be to be tested before they return to work.

This would not prevent COVID getting into homes even with slightly higher community transmission, but it would reduce it.

Sweden keeps on getting mentioned and how we should emulate it... But aren’t we trying to do something akin to a “Sweden” now, albeit in our own way.

Similar to Sweden, we’re looking to keep open much of the economy (restricting the higher risk parts), working from home where possible, and keeping the schools open. Yes, we have masks and the ‘rule of six’ is more stringent than Sweden’s rules on gatherings, but it’s broadly similar. Surely those in favour of Sweden should
be pretty pleased!

[quote Ecosse]@mrshoho

We should have a system where care homes effectively become ‘bubbles’ where a group of staff staff live on site for say a week at a time (sort of like offshore oil workers do) and are then replaced by a different ‘bubble’. They would then need to be to be tested before they return to work.

This would not prevent COVID getting into homes even with slightly higher community transmission, but it would reduce it.[/quote]
Care home staff have lives too! And families / children that need looking after. Would you move into your workplace for a week at a time? I work in a hospital and I wouldn't. My autistic son needs me for a start.

[quote Ecosse]@mrshoho

We should have a system where care homes effectively become ‘bubbles’ where a group of staff staff live on site for say a week at a time (sort of like offshore oil workers do) and are then replaced by a different ‘bubble’. They would then need to be to be tested before they return to work.

This would not prevent COVID getting into homes even with slightly higher community transmission, but it would reduce it.[/quote]
Back in March/April there were some truly dedicated carehome staff who camped in the grounds of their care homes effectively living in for weeks. Would be grim in the Winter months!

Unfortunately we can’t always have what we want. What we need is empathy - because everyone is going through this - it is harder for some than others - in different ways. But it was amazing the number of volunteers who ran around doing errands for others during lockdown. This pandemic affects everyone in the whole world- no time for whinging about the hardships when people are dying. The only way to prevent this killing a quarter of a million people (or more) is to keep people away from each other until there is a vaccine. We need to focus on the positives and the little things in life - be thankful we’re alive and have fresh air and enough to eat. And the company of our families. It is much harder for some and that is why we don’t currently have total lockdown (as well as the economic aspect). I am worried about money but have also decided life is too short to wish away the time now for a better future. We need to make this time as fun as possible and enjoy being alive. Do a fun thing every day (even if it’s only to ask Alexa to tell you a joke). I quite like staying at home more and some people like working from home. We all took too much for granted and I actually wouldn’t want to go back to the way things were - although I miss the freedom and sense of safety being out and about. We will have that again - something to look forward to. As for young people and kids - this is life experience. All those 16 year old boys in WW1 did some growing up and came out stronger for it.

A quarter of a million was the expected number of deaths if we had done nothing. And every death is someone‘s loved one - not just the elderly either.

All those 16 year old boys in WW1 did some growing up and came out stronger for it. yeh, no they didn't. Many of those that survived were left utterly broken. No such thing as PTSD back then, and if you look at how traumatised young men were treated in asylums it was nothing short of barbaric. Many committed suicide, and many more struggled in silence for many years haunted by things no person should ever have to have witnessed.

Care home staff have lives too! And families / children that need looking after. Would you move into your workplace for a week at a time

In addition to this I would be wary of safeguarding concerns. If there’s no regular staff change over issues are easier to cover up.

I suppose it could be done but it would cost an awful lot of money both to recruit and retain the right kind of people to a long term live in role.

It looks like Sweden is pondering tougher measures now. Even they are not huge fans of their model.

[quote Ecosse]@mrshoho

We should have a system where care homes effectively become ‘bubbles’ where a group of staff staff live on site for say a week at a time (sort of like offshore oil workers do) and are then replaced by a different ‘bubble’. They would then need to be to be tested before they return to work.

This would not prevent COVID getting into homes even with slightly higher community transmission, but it would reduce it.[/quote]
This would be ridiculous. Would they also pay care home staff the same rates as for oil rig workers?

Good point Oldmapie. Maybe it wasn’t a good comparison. I was thinking of the ones who survived and went on to be stronger. My Grandad just went back to his old life and got married. But yes some suffered.

@Lweji

What we can learn from Sweden is that 50% of deaths were in care homes. If they had managed to protect care homes it would be a different story. And for us too. Let’s hope we don’t make the same mistake twice.

How do we protect care homes? Anyone? Anyone?

It's irrelevant comparing us to Sweden. 50% is also the amount of Swedes that live in single person households. A big key to social distancing (which is something Swedes are more naturally inclined to do as it is).

Separately, as a pp says, it looks like Sweden's facing it's own issues. Stockholm is looking at tougher measures due to an increase in cases.

My FIL’s surgeon said he’s in favour of herd immunity, that vulnerable and elderly should isolate whilst they healthy get infected. I know a few people in the medical who favour this approach and others who are dead against it. I don’t think anyone really knows the answer.

Now don't get me wrong I followed the rules
To the letter now I’m feeling like a fool.

So I still am doing mostly what I’m told
Even though on this approach I’m just not sold

And I don’t like this messing with our laws
Life’s on hold, like one never ending pause.

But my children have no future and no life
I HAVE FUCKING HAD ENOUGH OF THIS STRIFE.

I am sure it’s not as bad as what they said;
Don’t get me wrong, I am sorry you are dead.

Separately, as a pp says, it looks like Sweden's facing it's own issues. Stockholm is looking at tougher measures due to an increase in cases.

That would have been me who said it.

In other cheery news,

www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384

Have you not been using NHS services over the past few years?
No disrespect to those working in it but parts of the NHS are really
failing now due to a shortage of staff but an increased demand.
This was the case long before 2019!
The Nightingale was built as they panicked due to being afraid the NHS would not cope. Wake up

But my children have no future and no life

I understand people feel down but personally I do not feel this way. My children are still learning, laughing and looking forwards - even though there have been huge changes.

for those who feel very down, but I believe my children will be ok and I really hope yours are too.

My children are so far largely ok. We have both kept our jobs. I see that changing soon.

Many many children I know are struggling. I’m talking not sleeping, don’t want to attend school. Trying to get referrals and none being available.

I think we are throwing a generation under a bus, personally, for the sake of people over 80 who possibly only have a few years left. They don’t want that either.

[quote cbt944]In other cheery news,

www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-23/covid-19-may-cause-parkinsons-disease-research-finds/12688384[/quote]
Ugh. I don't see how it wouldn't cause all sorts of ongoing issues, the number of simultaneous infections worldwide means there will be high numbers.

I don't understand really why people are laid back about catching it!

Brazil is currently on around 138,000 deaths, America now over 200,000 - and they are known to be under-estimates, as are our current figures.

The NHS can not treat large numbers of Covid patients and do routine work, never mind clear the backlog from the last wave. It just does not have the resources to do so.

Every time an infected person passes this on they reduce their own chance of getting health care in future, because waiting lists will go through the roof. They also help tank the economy because people dont go out and spend money if they feel unsafe. So taxes will be higher for years - and benefit payments likely cut for those who have lost their jobs.

I know of several young, previously healthy people who have died from this, others may be permanently disabled. And it's avoidable for those who are not key workers.

You are putting at risks the lives of those who would look after you.