So a family of 6 can't have any visitors to their home?

[covidconfusion]

"From Monday 14 September, when meeting friends and family you do not live with you must not meet in a group of more than 6, indoors or outdoors"

Does this mean a family of 6 cannot have any visitors to their home?

Source: www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing

On a related note, I really think the government need to improve the clarity of their communication. I don't usually struggle with reading comprehension but I find the guidelines so hard to follow and I know I'm not the only one. Usually I would use my common sense but the guidelines do not follow common sense. If the guidelines are saying what I think they are saying, it means a family of 6 cannot have any visitors but a single person household can have 5 visitors from 5 different households? Really? You have to laugh.

I can honestly say I only know one household who've had indoor visitors (making it five). Family, neighbours, friends are still entertaining in small numbers outside. I've only been in my Mum's porch twice (raining), my sister-in-law once in our house (10 mins, due to rain), the rest of the time outside. I've been in a group of five max outside, 2/3m apart - have no desire to increase. A family of 5/6 do have the regular company and stimulation of eachother. People here are managing really well within guidelines and it's paying off, we had a whole month with no cases and now it's the odd one or two averaging at no more than four a week. If you want to keep your loved ones safe, it does pay off.

I have 6 dc at home. Do I have to evict 2?

Boris might give everyone an xmas present and say for one day only the rules are relaxed?

I suppose it’s difficult to cater for everyone’s personal circumstances
Absolutely right. It was trying to cater to different groups that seem to have got some people confused and others breaking the guidelines.

but its this sort of ridiculousness that makes people ignore the guidelines.
It isn't at all ridiculous. It may be ridiculous to you, but it's just common sense to most of us. At least this way it should be very clear when you're breaking the rules. And if you break them, there will now be serious consequences.

I’m sure there are lots of other anomalies.
There's bound to be situations where the rules seem harsher than others. This is inevitable when the rules are made for society, not for each individual.

I would hate to be in the government trying to make rules that keep as many people safe as possible, while keeping the economy in some sort of functioning order, keeping kids in school as far as possible and still coming up with rules that most people can clearly understand. And doing it in a matter of days, when it usually takes years to put rules together. Pretty impressive actually.

Now it's up to us.

I have 6 dc at home. Do I have to evict 2?

No, you can still live together. But you will have to evict some of them temporarily if you want to receive visitors. Are the grandparents willing to take a few for a bit? Or can they go off to the park / friend's houses safely for a while?

My household is 8 youngish adults. How can we prove to the police we all live together?

DS and his uni housemates took a photo of their lease on their phone.

If adults live together full time presumably they all have something with their address on that they can have in a wallet or bag to show if needs be.

Boris might give everyone an xmas present and say for one day only the rules are relaxed?

Could call it a Covidmas gift...

@Itsrainingnotmen

I have 6 dc at home. Do I have to evict 2?

Given how annoying two of mine are being right now I kinda wish that was the rule

@022828MAN

sqirrelfriends

"Could be even shorter if you die from COVID."

Yeah, as I say - there's a 99% chance you won't. If you don't want to take those odds, don't. I'll take my chances.

It's not really about you though is it, you could be perfectly fine with COVID and spread it around, infecting someone who would eventually die from it.

Theres a lot of complaints on this thread but for some context and perspective (about how risk isnt fair nor spread evenly)

Paul Brand @paulbranditv
🚨EXCLUSIVE: Councils tell care homes to go into immediate lockdown.

Letters seen by @itvnews from Newcastle, Gateshead, Sunderland and others say family visits must now be cancelled, due to rising Covid cases.

Care sector in chaos over the guidance.

www.itv.com/news/2020-09-10/exclusive-councils-tell-care-homes-to-lock-down-again-as-coronavirus-cases-rise
Exclusive: Councils tell care homes to lock down again as coronavirus cases rise

The news also comes as a huge blow to relatives. There is evidence that dementia patients are declining rapidly without visits.

As I reported yesterday, one campaign group has now begun legal action to try and force the government to allow relatives in.

A grim winter ahead.

In terms of a right to a family life, this example is much more complex, but given the risk to life I suspect it will be a hard case to win...

It's not really about you though is it, you could be perfectly fine with COVID and spread it around, infecting someone who would eventually die from it.

Yes, just like the many other flus and coughs that could unwittingly be passed to a vulnerable person.

I'm not a conspiracist, I completely recognise that covid is a terrible virus that can cause real issues for a very minute proportion of the population.

But let's gain some perspective. 99.03% of us won't die from covid, and will be unlikely to have any negative symptoms at all.

There needs to be more spending and funding directed into protecting the 0.07% that will be negatively effected (food delivery services, support to work from home, care services etc). The answer isn't locking down the 99%+ of us who will be perfectly fine.

Can you still dance to Abba in the garden or visit your parents’ wood?

I really think the time has come for the 4 UK nations to have the same rules in general although very local lockdowns could still happen. There are so many “anticipated announcements” in the press, then the actual announcements and then 4 variations of them for each nation that it is increasingly difficult to follow. I think many people give up a bit, do their best or do what suits them.

It should be live-in household members not "people". It would make so much more sense.

Because it doesn't, and 2 families with more than 1 child each would be breaking the rules anyway, people just completely ignore them.

@022828MAN

It's not really about you though is it, you could be perfectly fine with COVID and spread it around, infecting someone who would eventually die from it.

Yes, just like the many other flus and coughs that could unwittingly be passed to a vulnerable person.

I'm not a conspiracist, I completely recognise that covid is a terrible virus that can cause real issues for a very minute proportion of the population.

But let's gain some perspective. 99.03% of us won't die from covid, and will be unlikely to have any negative symptoms at all.

There needs to be more spending and funding directed into protecting the 0.07% that will be negatively effected (food delivery services, support to work from home, care services etc). The answer isn't locking down the 99%+ of us who will be perfectly fine.

You have heard of Long Covid?

No-one knows who and why certain people of all ages get it.

@Speakeasy22

I really think the time has come for the 4 UK nations to have the same rules in general although very local lockdowns could still happen. There are so many “anticipated announcements” in the press, then the actual announcements and then 4 variations of them for each nation that it is increasingly difficult to follow. I think many people give up a bit, do their best or do what suits them.

Devolution gives freedoms in other areas and its important to Wales, Scotland and NI. A comment like this reflects English contempt for this.

I think it is a bit of a mess to have the multiple rules but i thought we were big on the idea of sovereignity right now.

And at most you only need to know 2 sets of rules not 4. And these arent massively different anyway.

Its only difficult to get it, if you cant be arsed to make the effort to know the law, and ignorance of the law is not a valid defence in a court.

@Speakeasy22

I really think the time has come for the 4 UK nations to have the same rules in general although very local lockdowns could still happen. There are so many “anticipated announcements” in the press, then the actual announcements and then 4 variations of them for each nation that it is increasingly difficult to follow. I think many people give up a bit, do their best or do what suits them.

If people have given up then it's because they are lazy or don't care. It doesn't take two minutes to go onto the Scotland/Wales part of the BBC site to get the correct rules, or to the specific government website.

The other devolved nations aren't going to just follow England's rules to make it easier for people to click on the right page, and Boris and co are never going to follow the stricter parts of guidances that the other nations have been following.

RedRumTheHorse

Yes. I've also heard of 20 suicides a day, 5 domestic murders a week, patients not getting diagnoses for chronic and severe illnesses, outpatient departments still closed down, a massive reduction in essential surgeries, a doubling of clinical depression since lockdown, and the plethora of other areas of healthcare that have been totally neglected since this.

Covid is not going to magically go away, it will be something we are living with forever now. A vaccine may or may not be made in the next few years.
It is time to get things back to normal.
You may want to follow guidelines to continue living, I won't be continuing to follow them so I can continue living.

Thankfully we have no relatives whatsoever!
Ds is a soldier - may suggest he builds a camp outside and takes a db with him!!
Rules is rules!!

Plus how do we even prove we all live together! Take our contracts everytime we go out?

Take a photo of your contract or get a pdf copy that is stored on your phone. Generally just voluntarily waving "a piece of paper" will stop them from questioning further.

If they do want to question further they will take details and the police will come round to see an original.

@022828MAN

It is not time to get things back to normal.

Covid is more infectious than flu and has long term side effects which no-one knows yet who is susceptible to them.

If you have mental health issues then get help for them.

At least you lot are getting some notice about this ( because Covid waits until Monday). In Greater Manchester a few weeks ago we got TWO HOURS notice of this sort of thing. Dd can't hang out with her grandparents or her pals at their homes or ours.

@bellinisurge

At least you lot are getting some notice about this ( because Covid waits until Monday). In Greater Manchester a few weeks ago we got TWO HOURS notice of this sort of thing. Dd can't hang out with her grandparents or her pals at their homes or ours.

You make the (wrong) assumption the Greater Manchester restrictions only affected people living in Greater Manchester...

@022828MAN

It's not really about you though is it, you could be perfectly fine with COVID and spread it around, infecting someone who would eventually die from it.

Yes, just like the many other flus and coughs that could unwittingly be passed to a vulnerable person.

I'm not a conspiracist, I completely recognise that covid is a terrible virus that can cause real issues for a very minute proportion of the population.

But let's gain some perspective. 99.03% of us won't die from covid, and will be unlikely to have any negative symptoms at all.

There needs to be more spending and funding directed into protecting the 0.07% that will be negatively effected (food delivery services, support to work from home, care services etc). The answer isn't locking down the 99%+ of us who will be perfectly fine.

This. Yes this virus is a terrible virus we all know that but even the scientists were clear during lockdown that for the vast majority of people it will be a mild illness. I could catch flu tomorrow and pass it to a vulnerable person who dies as a result but we don’t lock down every winter just in case. Yes we have vaccines for flu but not every vulnerable/ over 70 has them and they are not always effective when they do. Again, we don’t lock down just in case. Life is one big risk. I watched an interview with an ex phe official (think he was the ex deputy head of phe or something), when asked if we are now looking to eradicate the virus his response was of course not that would be virtually impossible even with a vaccine. He said the virus is here to stay with or without a vaccine and we will eventually have to learn to live with it. A vaccine is at least a year away if at all. If we don’t get one what then. We live like this forever?

Why do people keep making comparison well my kids at school mixing with 30 so i can have 10 at home
1 is important the other not so much
Yes seeing family is important but it can still happen just in smaller groups
And really nothing much has changed its been 6 in guidelines for ages and of course 2 households , which they have now removed unfortunately
But thats because people were thinking 30 was allowed due to law being 30 , thats the mistake they made having a 30 mentioned
I always interpreted the 30 to be for a wedding , funeral etc not in a private home
But realistically who is going to know if 7 of you unless your in garden, pissing off neighbours who report you , but i think they hope it puts people of having the larger gatherings
I hope the pubs that don't comply are also punished as round here most have only allowed 6 per table anyway and no leaving table other than use loo
But those few pubs that have ignored advice then end up ruining it for everyone
Pubs / restauranTs have rules they should be following ,at homes no one can check theSe and supposedly the higher numbers are coming from transmissions in indoor homes ? If this is true then it would help if they published these figures then people may understand better why these have been changed from 2 households
To now max 6
Who actually will police it is another question
Time for weekly briefings to update again ,especially where infections are taking place and why as well as hopefully updates on developments and when they think we may be able to increase the 6 as putting it as for the foreseeable makes it more unachievable , making it say for 4 weeks then review gives people hope it won't last too long and light at the end of the tunnel
Its going to be a ling autumn/ winter at this rate