So a family of 6 can't have any visitors to their home?

[covidconfusion]

"From Monday 14 September, when meeting friends and family you do not live with you must not meet in a group of more than 6, indoors or outdoors"

Does this mean a family of 6 cannot have any visitors to their home?

Source: www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing

On a related note, I really think the government need to improve the clarity of their communication. I don't usually struggle with reading comprehension but I find the guidelines so hard to follow and I know I'm not the only one. Usually I would use my common sense but the guidelines do not follow common sense. If the guidelines are saying what I think they are saying, it means a family of 6 cannot have any visitors but a single person household can have 5 visitors from 5 different households? Really? You have to laugh.

Realistically no one is ever going to know if you have more than 6 people in your home. Ok if you are organising a party that’s not going to work but if aunty Mavis is popping over- whose going to know?

@cassgate

The reality is the government know that people will ignore it here and there to visit family and but they can’t say it. With universities going back It’s the only way they could think off to stop large gatherings of young people outside educational settings and stop the large rave like gatherings.

This.

Won't stop the raves, either. People will find work arounds.

@picklemewalnuts

The rules don't work when individuals are considered. They only work population wide. That means that for any individual they don't look rational, sensible or fair. Across the board however, if followed, they will have a big positive impact.

But we are individuals and struggle to process population wide measures.

Yes, intellectually I understand that this is the reality. However I still think it’s shit.

Why 6? Why not 8 - a more helpful limited number?

I wish they’d explain clearly using the scientific data why the fairly arbitrary number of 6 was chosen.

@whatswithtodaytoday

Yes, correct. But do you really need visitors to your home? We haven't had anyone else here since March, and doubt we will until next year as we need to keep our family and friends safe.

I honestly had no idea people were having others over to their houses so much! It's such a risk when that's exactly how the virus speads.

It's not just to your home though, it's any other venue indoors or outdoors. You might be happy to not see friends or family for months but the majority of people arent

@Aroundtheworldin80moves

My friends situation. 2 parents, 5 children. 2 eldest at university, 3 at home. Are the 2 eldest unable to stay at their home at the same time, since officially they aren't in the household anymore?

Why does this bother you. Let them work it out.

The rules are awkward but not impossible. People having been bleating for months that they want simple Rules. Not confusing or complex rules that cannor be enforced. You’ve got it.

And it was never going to please all of the people all of the time.

@covidconfusion

"From Monday 14 September, when meeting friends and family you do not live with you must not meet in a group of more than 6, indoors or outdoors"

Does this mean a family of 6 cannot have any visitors to their home?

Source: www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing/coronavirus-covid-19-meeting-with-others-safely-social-distancing

On a related note, I really think the government need to improve the clarity of their communication. I don't usually struggle with reading comprehension but I find the guidelines so hard to follow and I know I'm not the only one. Usually I would use my common sense but the guidelines do not follow common sense. If the guidelines are saying what I think they are saying, it means a family of 6 cannot have any visitors but a single person household can have 5 visitors from 5 different households? Really? You have to laugh.

I thought the maximum number of households at a meet up was 2?? I agree, I’m thoroughly confused and just follow my own rules as I know I’m more cautious than the government wants me to be anyway.

Depends really. If your kids are asleep upstairs and you and dh have two friends round, you’ll be meeting in a group of 4, which is fine.
I wondered this. Since being allowed to have people over we've entertained them in our annexe only as it's a big space where 6 people can socially distance and they have their own bathroom there, plus the garden. So eg the kids want to invite a couple of friends over that's 6. Us grown ups can be in the house and keep an eye from outside the door occasionally (ours are almost teens), so no more than 6 ever together. But still not sure if that's allowed.

It's really shit not being able to go to the park with another family now. That is really low risk. Families are being unfairly penalised imho.

I cannot understand why so many people are having such difficulty understanding this basic instruction. If you can count to six, you will be able to comply. It could not be simpler.

DP died on Monday. After the funeral I will not be able to have the 8 close family members back at my house. We could however book 2 tables separately in a pub or restaurant as long as we don't interact with each other. This government are a bunch of heartless bastards who don't give a shit about ordinary people. Their website refers to treating bereaved people with respect and dignity.
They are hypocrites

Rules are at a population level even if at an individual level it seems odd or doesn't work. It's been like that from the start (a 17 year old can see their parent who lives at a different address but they can't on their 18 birthday???)

@Escapedtothecountry

I cannot understand why so many people are having such difficulty understanding this basic instruction. If you can count to six, you will be able to comply. It could not be simpler.

This! People want simple, they’ve got simple, but now it’s not nuanced enough to take account of their specific situation

@CactusForever

It's really shit not being able to go to the park with another family now. That is really low risk. Families are being unfairly penalised imho.

Exactly, and this is our usual form of casual socialising.

Parkrun has just announced its intention to return following a review of all the known evidence about outdoors transmission and the risk outdoors is pretty darn close to minimal. Using the known science to make an informed risk assessment. Good stuff

So in a couple of months I can run/ volunteer amongst 500 odd people at my local parkrun, but later that day, if I arrange to meet another family of 4 to meet my family of 4 in the same park that's illegal

It's also denying my children the right to a family life and seeing a family unit of their cousins.

Not a perfect solution, but a decent caveat would have been to exempt u16s who are under supervision of their parents. Looking at the data used at the conference, this would be an acceptable level of risk.

@feellikeanalien

DP died on Monday. After the funeral I will not be able to have the 8 close family members back at my house. We could however book 2 tables separately in a pub or restaurant as long as we don't interact with each other. This government are a bunch of heartless bastards who don't give a shit about ordinary people. Their website refers to treating bereaved people with respect and dignity. They are hypocrites

I'm so sorry that an already difficult time is being made even harder by these circumstances.

feellikeanalien I'm sorry for uour loss.

Not a perfect solution, but a decent caveat would have been to exempt u16s who are under supervision of their parents.

It actually this element that frustrates me the most. We now cannot meet up with OHs family as there are 4 of them and 3 of us even though one of us is an almost 9 month old.

@whatswithtodaytoday

Yes, correct. But do you really need visitors to your home? We haven't had anyone else here since March, and doubt we will until next year as we need to keep our family and friends safe.

I honestly had no idea people were having others over to their houses so much! It's such a risk when that's exactly how the virus speads.

I didn't think it was particularly good for the 4 to or the few month old babies to not see anybody at all for god knows how long and then suddenly throw the now 5 yo straight into full time education and the babies onto school runs twice a day. I wanted my close family to get to know our babies. I'll concede I'm an awful person and selfish but it's true nonetheless

Not a perfect solution, but a decent caveat would have been to exempt u16s who are under supervision of their parents. Looking at the data used at the conference, this would be an acceptable level of risk.

Especially with all the propaganda that Children Do Not Spread The Virus.

Right, this does make more sense if you under stand the new rules are all about the effectiveness of track and trace.

The new laws stress this and priortise formal settings which have clearly laid out rules and an ability / obligation to honestly engage and assist with track and trace.

If you are informally meeting your mates and family there isnt this same sense of responsibility and there isnt the same professional responsibility / company liability to report health and safety incidents. Its too easy for family or friends to have a drink and go 'oh fuck it' and then start hugging / kissing etc because there is no one with a clear cut 'official' enforcement role.

So yes it is about both priority making (hence why health and education are being promoted as reasons for exemptions) and why bars / restaurants are being allowed to continue to operate (not just for financial reason but also because prohibition leads to demand being met by things like illegal house parties or raves and clandestine restaurants, hair dressers etc - where it become much more difficult to track and trace).

People also are more likely to forget informal meetings that arent regularly scheduled and the names of everyone at a larger gatherings. I believe 6 is the optimum number that people easily remember.

The overall point is that social interactions have to be more limited, ranked in terms of priorities and controlled and managed in a way that makes it as easy as possible for fast and efficient track and trace.

At the heart of the increased restrictions is the weaknesses in the UK's track and trace system which the government is struggling to get a grip on. These problems stem from reliance on telephone tracing rather than on the ground tracing (which is why several hard hit councils set up their own local systems), lack of trust in government (not helped by discrimination and economic marginalisation and language and cultural barriers which the government have been slow to recognise and try and resolve at community level - because they operate in such a centralised and one size fits all mentality.

If you under the 'fuck it' principle, you understand its about track and trace being ineffective and you understand that behavioural modelling will probably suggest if you say '6 people' a sizeable number of the public will interpret that as 'oh well 8 is just fine then' (when its not) the new rules do make a lot more sense.

In reality the police are not going to be interested in there being 7 people in the house if the grandparents visit. It's about it being easier to prevent house parties or gatherings of multiple families.

I thought the maximum number of households at a meet up was 2?? I agree, I’m thoroughly confused and just follow my own rules as I know I’m more cautious than the government wants me to be anyway.

Only two households in Scotland.

Up to six households allowed in England.

@feellikeanalien sorry for your loss.

@whatswithtodaytoday

Yes, correct. But do you really need visitors to your home? We haven't had anyone else here since March, and doubt we will until next year as we need to keep our family and friends safe.

I honestly had no idea people were having others over to their houses so much! It's such a risk when that's exactly how the virus speads.

I thought that too. t's not going to kill any of us to restrict social visiting for a while longer.

I thought that too. t's not going to kill any of us to restrict social visiting for a while longer.

Surely that's a pretty foolish thing to say. Have you not seen the news stories or reports of people who have died or committed suicide because they felt unable to cope without social interaction.

It doesn’t say “max 6 people on your property” because otherwise pubs would be unworkable.

It does say that. Pubs and restaurants and businesses in general are treated differently. If you have 4 people upstairs and 4 people downstairs in your house you will be breaking the law. At least that is my interpretation.