Surely they can’t keep schools open as normal if cases keep going up like today!

[Worriedmum999]

My daughter went back to school last Thursday. She really needed to go as lockdown played havoc with her mental health. She was fine doing her academic work but she is someone who needs the social side of school.

We are a vulnerable family and, with this shitshower of a government, I had no faith that cases wouldn’t rise and I wouldn’t be forced to take her out of school again. But I cannot believe that she has been back 2 days and the jump in cases has been so huge. I honestly expected us to be able to get to half term. Of course deaths are going to rise now. Why wouldn’t we follow the pattern of the other European countries. Add to that the fact that people can’t get tested now and we’re fucked. And I’m so fucking angry and upset about the damage that this is doing.

What are the government going to do? Surely it will be impossible to expect parents to keep sending their children to schools when the death toll is huge again and the ICUs are full.

Who can't get tested now?
I suspect IF there is a rise in hospitalisations and deaths in a few weeks, then something will be done. But I doubt it will be closing schools unless as a very last resort.

In March/April/May people with symptoms were told to self isolate. There was no testing available. I know a number of people who had mild but significant symptoms over that period but have never been tested. As such there was limited testing and it was mainly of people who were unwell enough to require hospitalisation.

Testing has now expanded so that people with mild and no symptoms are being identified (whether through door to door type testing in hotspot areas or routines tests in some jobs etc). As such we are picking up cases which previously would have been suspected but not confirmed and as these are often milder they aren't linked to higher admissions nor, thankfully, deaths.

Yes the confirmed infection rates are increasing - this could be due to increased testing and lack of SD

The mortality rate isn't increasing and this is unlikely to be purely down to the lag effect.

It is probably down to the following factors - younger cohort of infected people, reduced viral load due to SD, increased knowledge of treatment management.

If you follow Spain/France - they are further along their "second wave" with very small comparative deaths.

Schools will not (and should not) close down for such minimal numbers of hospital admissions or deaths.

I bloody hope they do. Schools need to be open.

@TheSunIsStillShining agree with all that you say.

Some of increase seems to be due to returning holidaymakers. It’s not due to schools at this point. Hopefully the increase will slow. It’s still a tiny proportion of what jt was in March and kids were in school then. One day at a time.

I think it helps to base your risk assessment on your own reality. How many people do you know personally who have had it in past few weeks? Easy to get carried away by news cycle. Eg I used to work as a journo and I worked quite intensely at a rail disaster and for years I found it difficult to go on a train because they do sometimes have accidents. But in my actual reality no one I know has experienced a train accident. It’s about perspective really. The numbers yesterday were a shock but it’s still less than 1 percent of people being tested .

We will never have another lockdown like we did initially. It’s very much a case of herd immunity and get on with it now, even if the cases keep increasing. The economy will come to its knees otherwise.

@TheSunIsStillShining

oh, and before someone can be included in the number the relatives have to give consent. I will check up on this - wonder if this is still the case.

When has this ever been the case that relatives have to give consent? I didn't.

It's very much a case of herd immunity and get on with it
No it isn't. It's a case of keeping infections and hospital admissions as low as possible until large scale vaccinations can be carried out, while keeping the economy as open as possible.

The deaths reported yesterday were from the 4th and 5th September.

I am not sending my 5 year old (or even older primart age child) to school with a mask.

Do we really want to go down that road with children? We have made decisions as adults that have had a massive detrimental impact on the children. Do we really want to continue?

Adults need to be adults and be respobsible outside of school as keep their children away from the virus.

Keep it low in the community means it has less risk in the schools.

My children need face to face education. My toungest especially is too young for blended learning to be successful. But i would seriously consider removing them from school if they needed to wear a mask all day. It's cruel.

@YummyJamDoughnut

Who can't get tested now? I suspect IF there is a rise in hospitalisations and deaths in a few weeks, then something will be done. But I doubt it will be closing schools unless as a very last resort.

It will take six weeks to filter through from the young to the old. Another four for people to start to die.

A lot of elderly relations may not see Christmas this year.

The rise in cases won't have been caused by kids going back to school a few days ago. That isn't a long enough incubation period.

@TheSunIsStillShining

We don't know how many people have had it and not got tested, either because tests weren't widely available at the time or because they just couldn't be arsed to book a test.

We don't know how many people got it and didn't have symptoms, and therefore didn't get tested.

So the amount of actual cases is going to be more than 350k.

1. get secondary school kids to online learning = more space

So secondary school children no longer count?

Their mental health has probably taken the biggest hit of all, little kids tend to like being with their parents! Not to mention the education and attainment impact - i.e they will simply give up on the home schooling and go out with their friends. This will be a total disaster for their future, and will never happen.

This is NOT a workable solution at all thesun

@TheSunIsStillShining 👏🏼

And don’t forget “increase the list of symptoms that you need to isolate / get tested for” - the number of threads on here I read that say “I feel like shit but my cough isn’t exactly CONTINUOUS” or “I have the worst sore throat ever, a headache and my temperature is 37.7 - I can go and teach tomorrow can’t i?” is ridiculous.

PS I think a 10x estimate of actual cases during the pre testing phase is pretty accurate. I would almost certainly still double it now (at least) as loads of people don’t bother getting tested or can’t access a test.

Schools won't close at a national level unless we reach the peak numbers of deaths and infection rates. It is more likely that local lockdowns and outbreaks will see schools close temporarily.

The next stage will be shield the elderly not close the schools.

If you have people aged over seventy in your family, you might like to suggest to them to start being much more careful now.

Mine haven’t gone back yet so don’t say this!

Realistically we are going to have to realise that schooling is essential and that other non-essential activities are going to have to be restricted to allow schools to return. I’ve already told my parents that they can’t see my children so much now they are back at school.

Agree with Friends on all points

@Worriedmum999

My daughter went back to school last Thursday. She really needed to go as lockdown played havoc with her mental health. She was fine doing her academic work but she is someone who needs the social side of school.

We are a vulnerable family and, with this shitshower of a government, I had no faith that cases wouldn’t rise and I wouldn’t be forced to take her out of school again. But I cannot believe that she has been back 2 days and the jump in cases has been so huge. I honestly expected us to be able to get to half term. Of course deaths are going to rise now. Why wouldn’t we follow the pattern of the other European countries. Add to that the fact that people can’t get tested now and we’re fucked. And I’m so fucking angry and upset about the damage that this is doing.

What are the government going to do? Surely it will be impossible to expect parents to keep sending their children to schools when the death toll is huge again and the ICUs are full.

Completely agree. I can’t believe we aren’t learning from other countries again. People were called out for scaremongering in the two weeks running up to lockdown. An earlier lockdown would have saved tens of thousands of lives. I can’t see how it won’t start to spill into the vulnerable and older groups without the restart of shielding. Only middle classes can afford to shield without any government support / letter etc. We should all be outraged by this fact.

They will reduce community transmission everywhere else by closing pubs restaurants leisure activities etc before schools close again. I think we are way off that point though.

Do we really want to go down that road with children? We have made decisions as adults that have had a massive detrimental impact on the children. Do we really want to continue?

No we haven't. There is no actual evidence of detrimental impact, it's an emotional and irrational decision. Children in other countries wear them, our children are no different from them. Foolish to think otherwise.

If anyone thinks the cases in the UK are caused by returning holiday makers, they need to take a drive through Leeds city centre and see twenty people in a barber shop without masks sat next to each other, people wandering around without masks in shopping centres, packed playgrounds, cafes with staff with no masks, Marks and Spencer staff with no masks...all things I've seen while back in the UK and I have not seen since Jan in my own European country.