No social distancing in 6th form classrooms/common room

[kitnkaboodle]

I know that there was an earlier thread on this that ran to 1000 messages and shut down, but ...

I'm sitting here with egg on my face, as through the summer I didn't believe my DS (16) telling me that in his (new) Y12, they wouldn't have to distance from the other pupils in sixth form or be spaced out within the classrooms. He said that things would be 'the same as normal', and I honestly thought he was talking rubbish.

He's just home from his first day and, sure enough, the WHOLE sixth form is classed as one bubble and there are no social distancing measures at all between the kids there apart from desks all facing the front. I'm not sure about teachers - will ask later, but I presume they aren't in the bubbles and have to keep apart.

I glanced at the earlier thread title (that was something along the lines of 'the govt are letting the public believe there will be SD in schools') and thought it was all a bit paranoid (without reading it). However, I now genuinely believe that photos of all the 'back to school' stories have been carefully curated to show kids standing/sitting at least a metre apart. I'm one of those who thinks that we just need to 'get on with it' now, regarding schools, but I do feel royally hoodwinked by that. It was very subtle ... (and now I have to apologise to DS for not believing him!!)

@OverTheRainbow88

Or maybe some haven’t buried their heads in the sand but have weighed up the risks and benefits and made the informed decision that the benefits outweigh the risks.

The problem is that scenario really only applies on an individual level.

As a society, I don't think anyone can argue that the benefits of ignoring this and just cracking on outweigh the risks.

@OverTheRainbow88

Or maybe some haven’t buried their heads in the sand but have weighed up the risks and benefits and made the informed decision that the benefits outweigh the risks.

Yes, I'm sure that's true.

But I was responding to the OP

@OverTheRainbow88

Or maybe some haven’t buried their heads in the sand but have weighed up the risks and benefits and made the informed decision that the benefits outweigh the risks.

But, as EDSGFC said, you might want to decide on the balance of risks for your family, but you don't have the right to inflict that choice on others around you, who might decide differently.

Social distancing, bubbles, shit like this is all 100% contrary to human nature so were never going to work long-term. People need to realise this.

@MilesJuppIsMyBitch

I completely understand parents burying their heads in the sand about this: so many need to get back to work, and lockdown was pretty dreadful for many children.

My mind just doesn't work like that. I need to KNOW. It gives me (probably the illusion) of control.

I've felt like a right bloody Cassandra since the news started coming out of Italy in Feb. I really, really wanted to be wrong, but I wasn't.

Nothing, however, can excuse the avalanche of pure shit which has been poured over concerned teachers and parents throughout this terrible time. Nothing.

( to @noblegiraffe , all the other teachers (except the nasty ones: you know who you are), & my fellow vulnerable/shielded).

Thank you as ever lovely @MilesJuppIsMyBitch

@InDeoEstMeaFiducia

Social distancing, bubbles, shit like this is all 100% contrary to human nature so were never going to work long-term. People need to realise this.

Throughout history there have been periods of distancing amongst non family members, dictated by social etiquette?

Surely it is cultural, not human nature?

@InDeoEstMeaFiducia

Social distancing, bubbles, shit like this is all 100% contrary to human nature so were never going to work long-term. People need to realise this.

So you'd agree, then, that it would be inhumane (or against human nature) to expect a shielding parent to send their children to school & isolate from them in the house.

Not trying to jump on you, and don't know your personal take, but that is what worried ECV parents have been advised to do on here, over and over again,

Then why is isolation used as a form of punishment and torture? Distancing among family members culturally was usually in the form of fostering children to other families in the hopes they'd form a relationship with the fosterers, usually for dynastic purposes, or to avoid assassination of high-ranking families. It didn't usually involve socially distancing from people.

Humans have lived in societies for thousands of years, and these societies involved social contact. All for very good reasons.

Social distancing and bubbles aren't going to work long-term and particularly among the young as humans also have a strong inbuilt need to be together and to reproduce (especially among late teens) or at least practice it .

It's also pointless to expect large scale adult behaviour, that which we deem 'sensible' among people who are still not fully neurologically developed/adults, however much we laud this in teens, it's not going to magically make them behave how we older people want them to on a large scale and even when managed somewhat, it would not be unusual for a not too insignificant number to seek out closeness to peers behind our backs. It's been done for centuries, governments have tried to stop it, ban sex even, ban mass gatherings, meetings, etc. It never works.

People need to realise this and get over it.

And preaching, lecturing, hectoring, attempting to shame or guilt, even direct punishment don't work on this, either.

Social distancing is a proxemics term and is the distance with which most people feel comfortable.

I've learned three new words on MN today, and proxemics is my favourite.

I used to teach a late, lamented A Level called Communication and Culture so it was a bit of a surprise to me when social distancing became such a key term in health!

Isolation and social distancing are not the same thing, isolation is being alone whereas social distancing is sitting 2m away.

I would think that it would be much more distressing for children maybe up to about 12 or so to be at school but observe SD with a parent, than to be schooled at home, so long as seeing some other people outside the home. The latter would be like what happened for most of human history, as school is very modern.

Absolutely.

My 16 year old still hugs me three times a day! He is the Best!

@InDeoEstMeaFiducia

Then why is isolation used as a form of punishment and torture? Distancing among family members culturally was usually in the form of fostering children to other families in the hopes they'd form a relationship with the fosterers, usually for dynastic purposes, or to avoid assassination of high-ranking families. It didn't usually involve socially distancing from people.

Humans have lived in societies for thousands of years, and these societies involved social contact. All for very good reasons.

Social distancing and bubbles aren't going to work long-term and particularly among the young as humans also have a strong inbuilt need to be together and to reproduce (especially among late teens) or at least practice it .

It's also pointless to expect large scale adult behaviour, that which we deem 'sensible' among people who are still not fully neurologically developed/adults, however much we laud this in teens, it's not going to magically make them behave how we older people want them to on a large scale and even when managed somewhat, it would not be unusual for a not too insignificant number to seek out closeness to peers behind our backs. It's been done for centuries, governments have tried to stop it, ban sex even, ban mass gatherings, meetings, etc. It never works.

People need to realise this and get over it.

What the fuck did I just read?

Jesus Christ the lengths some posters will go to to dress up ‘it’s child abuse’ in a bow to try to slip it under the radar.

What the fuck did I just read. I said it doesn't work, not that it's child abuse. Good god, some will do anything to jump to wild conclusions about a random post to suit their agenda.

WTF is being 'slipped under the radar'? Teens don't do 'social distancing' well, hell, look how adults do it. We're not hard wired to do so long term and quite frankly, for a virus like this, pretty ridiculous IMO. A lot of people are starting to realise this as well, it seems.

@Titsywoo

To be honest I wish they weren't even doing the bubbles - they are meaningless and the kids will be stuck in the same classroom most of the time while the teachers move around. I bet music/art/drama/PE all get sidelined due to this. It's going to be a miserable experience and will make little to no difference at all as far as I can tell!

It's all to give paranoid people an illusion of safety.

We absolutely are hard wired culturally to socially distance outside our families. It is complexly completely normal to stay 4 - 8 feet away from people (in fact, American and Scandinavians struggle the least with the concept of SD). Overcrowding is what affects this. It's not a natural state in most cultures to huddle up.

completely completely normal. Not complex at all.

@InDeoEstMeaFiducia

What the fuck did I just read. I said it doesn't work, not that it's child abuse. Good god, some will do anything to jump to wild conclusions about a random post to suit their agenda.

WTF is being 'slipped under the radar'? Teens don't do 'social distancing' well, hell, look how adults do it. We're not hard wired to do so long term and quite frankly, for a virus like this, pretty ridiculous IMO. A lot of people are starting to realise this as well, it seems.

Yep, thought I was reading your post correctly.

Stop trying to ‘evolutionary psychology’ your boring old opinions.

What’s quite amusing about this thread is the claims that all these posters have been maligned, whereas if anyone disagrees with all of you (you are all saying the same thing over and over?) we get a shit load of abuse.

Upthread I was told I should be ashamed and that my dd should have the book thrown at her . Nice. This is not a discussion thread. Now you’re all jumping on the next divergent opinion, but mumsnet is a discussion site. And from where I’m standing, those of us who are trying to discuss are not the people being rude.

It's only relatively recently that we Brits became a nation of huggers. What the hell happened to shaking hands? Well, we shouldn't do that either now, but I'm more than happy to ditch most of the hugging, as in, people I don't know well/love a lot.

Upthread I was told I should be ashamed and that my dd should have the book thrown at her hmm. Nice.
Yep, that was me. And I stand by it. You were thrilled that your dd would be hugging her friends once back at school. On another thread today/last night, a teacher reported that students would be put straight in detention if they broke their school's "no touching" rule.

we Brits became a nation of huggers

No thank you. I didn’t mind that brief period of elbow bumping though.