Why not masks for all in secondary schools ?

[countryroses]

Why not ?

I was actually asking indeo but thanks for replying.

"It's the Netherlands. Not some backward country. Here wheelchair users can use every metro station. Try that in London. Also, disabled people are not locked away."

If there are no exemptions that means that some people due their disability are banned from using public transport. People with conditions such as autism and learning disabilities aren't going to magically cope because they live in the Netherlands rather than the UK. They just won't go out.

I'm in Greater Manchester. I presume dd will have to wear a mask now in common areas of the school.
Why doesn't Johnson just say, fuck it and hand all the decisions over to Nicola Sturgeon. Scotland is clearly leading the UK's fight against the pandemic.
My local parents' FB group has been predicting we would be following Scotland's lead.
More confusion. Just what we need.

But the Netherlands only has masks for public transport and dont believe there is any scientific evidence that proves they are effective

In shops? Yes. Helps build confidence. But either kids are back at school or they aren't.
Masks will help a bit but are we now going to start blaming kids if there is a school outbreak?

@bellinisurge

In shops? Yes. Helps build confidence. But either kids are back at school or they aren't. Masks will help a bit but are we now going to start blaming kids if there is a school outbreak?

That makes no sense. Masks have no bearing on whether or not a school is open or closed in the sense you mean it.

However if you want staff to stay well and therefore schools to stay open, this is the only mitigation we currently have.

Masks are required in parts of Amsterdam although medical exemptions are allowed and in June there was a disability rights group campaigning for exemptions on public transport so claims that everyone can wear a mask and everyone accepts this, are not true.

@bellinisurge

In shops? Yes. Helps build confidence. But either kids are back at school or they aren't. Masks will help a bit but are we now going to start blaming kids if there is a school outbreak?

No we're definitely only blaming teachers for that.

Children in Dutch schools wear masks.

@Piggywaspushed is this a new thing from all I have seen they dont in the Netherlands indeed they have less rules than us in schools.

www.dutchnews.nl/news/2020/08/more-schools-go-for-face-masks-despite-official-government-stance/

seems to say that some schools (like here) are making them but officially they dont.

Personally I think it should be corridors/communal areas but not in classrooms - pretty much the Scottish approach

They wear them in corridors and communal areas, like Scotland.

Out of interest quartz is this because you think our classrooms are socially distanced?

Piggywaspushed where do you get that from with the Dutch schools?

And no of course the classrooms aren't socially distanced. My area has very few cases I am happy with the idea of a class bubble. We are also an area that was hit in March as well.

TheDailyCarbuncle summed up my views really about it in classrooms as well.

But that is my risk assessment and in the area I live it we all seem fine. Our primary had a 90% uptake of places of children allowed back in June

Anyone who opposes masks/ any other measures always begins 'the area I live in' . We do not all live in these areas. And if unaffected areas aren't cautious they may well soon change.

Various places tell me Dutch kids wear masks in schools : there was a picture in The Times today which was (for a change) authentic and recent.

We also don't have class bubbles in secondary. there is no suggestion of masks in primary.

I do wish people would stop seeing everything through the prism of primary school.

And no masks in classrooms : so, essentially everything you are concerned about isn't happening!

As far as I can see, Dutch teachers are as concerned about lack of clear guidance , masks etc. as UK teachers, and have had to act autonomously , which English schools pretty much could not do until last night on the issue of masks. British teachers are not unique in their concerns. People always point to Europe and say 'well, they do it there' without considering whether teachers, unions, parents etc. are happy there.

piggywaspushed but area does matter though and I have both secondary and primary aged children. We were hit hard in March in the schools and in the area.

Yes the Dutch teachers are as upset as ours and individual schools are insisting on masks that doesn’t change the fact that the Dutch parliament doesn’t insist on masks? It isn’t a debate on whether they should - they don’t like the UK one.

And as I said my view is the same as Dailycarbuncle I think we see masks as a panacea and for me in the classroom they are not

But @Quartz you've said you're happy with a class bubble which can't exist in a secondary school.

Once more, the are not being used in the classroom.

So in our secondary school each year group has a entrance and a route to walk around the school and a set of classrooms. Whilst walking in those areas masks will be worn apart from in the classroom. The yeargroup has an area in the canteen and each class within that. Masks worn when ordering food and until sitting down in the canteen bubble. Each year group has a set of toilets and masks worn

I am happy with all of that - I dont want mask wearing in the classroom - these girls have all walked to school together/spent time together outside. But I have been very impressed with the planning and thought that has gone in - the clear guidance as to how symptoms/testing works etc. And that not all schools are set up this way

Quartz our school is exactly same but up to now masks are optional thankfully

Interesting watching the two mainstream news broadcasts last night. None of the kids being interviewed were the least concerned, every one said they were very happy to wear them and they made them feel safe. They also expressed wishes to protect older relatives.
Far more selfless attitude than some of their parents. They gave me hope for the future 😃