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Covid

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Original poster

Shut the pubs now to give schools a chance

74 replies

notevenat20 · 22/08/2020 08:52

...and/or whatever the govt statisticians have worked out has the biggest beneficial effect for reducing Covid infections.

Given the fraught political atmosphere about the risks from schools opening, it seems only fair to make a huge effort to ensure it works. Shouldn’t they restrict some other major activities now to give the first weeks of school the best chance?

OP posts:

PinkSparklyPussyCat · 22/08/2020 08:53

So the hospitality industry suffers even more? I have no idea what the answer is but more job losses are it.

worriedandannoyed · 22/08/2020 08:57

The hospitality industry will rebuild, a whole generation of kids won't get their education back.

excellentcustard · 22/08/2020 08:58

The two things are only connected by the Daily Mail. If you're advocating the closure of pubs, then it must also include shopping centres, cafés, offices since people gather there as well.

Or we could accept that children need educating, life must go on and we learn to live with risk again.

PinkSparklyPussyCat · 22/08/2020 09:00

@worriedandannoyed

The hospitality industry will rebuild, a whole generation of kids won't get their education back.

So what about the people who rely on it to keep a roof over their heads? Should we just leave them to it? There's been enough redundancies as it is in the retail and hospitality sectors without adding more.

OverTheRubicon · 22/08/2020 09:02

Yes, education matters. Also, while the hospitality industry is large, a large number of working parents will also have to quit if there are frequent shut downs and localised self isolations due to children getting ill, increasing child and family poverty as well as wider unemployment.

OverTheRubicon · 22/08/2020 09:03

The two things are only connected by the Daily Mail. If you're advocating the closure of pubs, then it must also include shopping centres, cafés, offices since people gather there as well.

No, because shopping centres for example are far more spaced and not full of people who've had a few drinks and so are getting close together, raising voices and going home together! Even karaoke bars are open now, which is insane, given the experience of Spain.

CallmeAngelina · 22/08/2020 09:05

Yet "only" around 8% if the working population have children of primary age. That leaves 92% unaffected by the childcare issues that are thrown up by schools being effectively closed.
(Not saying they should close, just to be clear)

Fainasnowchild · 22/08/2020 09:06

If you want to reduce outbreaks it's care homes and workplaces you need to shut....

Shut the pubs now to give schools a chance

lonelyplanet · 22/08/2020 09:17

"Yet "only" around 8% if the working population have children of primary age. That leaves 92% unaffected by the childcare issues that are thrown up by schools being effectively closed.
(Not saying they should close, just to be clear)"

In uk about 20% are under 18. If each child has 2 parents that's 40% of the population who are responsible for them.

OverTheRubicon · 22/08/2020 09:25

@CallmeAngelina

Yet "only" around 8% if the working population have children of primary age. That leaves 92% unaffected by the childcare issues that are thrown up by schools being effectively closed.

Yes, but over 8.82m (over 13%) of the UK population are school pupils, the most important demographic affected by school closures. There are 2.9m (9%) of the UK population employed in hospitality - lower than the primary school parents % you shared. Many secondary school parents are also affected, younger teens, children with additional needs or other issues cannot be left at home 8-6 everyday while their parents go out to work.

Many hospitality workers will also be parents affected by this. Some of the 2.9m will work in areas that can continue. Many others of those work in zero hour, minimum wage, low skilled jobs that are sas to lose but can be started back up when this is over, and/or are likely to be able to be replaced by some of the other areas that are growing with covid like home delivery.

Of course it's shit for hospitality workers, and I hope that furlough is extended and supplemented by support in finding new jobs. But the health and education of our population has to come first.

BackInTime · 22/08/2020 09:37

@excellentcustard

The two things are only connected by the Daily Mail. If you're advocating the closure of pubs, then it must also include shopping centres, cafés, offices since people gather there as well.

Or we could accept that children need educating, life must go on and we learn to live with risk again.

In shops and supermarkets people are wearing masks and conditions are more controlled. Cafes and restaurants and pubs serving food are also a more controlled environment. For example Sunday lunch in a pub is a bit different to people spending Saturday night in the pub getting pissed. Perhaps close the pubs that are exclusively boozers and allow those that serve food to remain open for those that want to eat in the same spirit as restaurants.

Perhaps

Original poster

notevenat20 · 22/08/2020 09:41

Yet "only" around 8% if the working population have children of primary age. That leaves 92% unaffected by the childcare issues

Hmm...if your children are 12 or 13 do you just leave them in the house all day every day when you go to work?

I should also mention that 100% of us were of primary school age at one point. It really matters what happens to them.

OP posts:

Barbie222 · 22/08/2020 09:43

Boris will not shut the pubs again. Remember, school closures won't be his fault, because he told them all to open and what could possibly go wrong?

I would urge anyone with children who can't be supervised at home to make plans for unexpected closures now.

YouLikeTheBadOnesToo · 22/08/2020 10:03

I’m wondering the their reluctance to close pubs is fear of reaction in places with low infections? There was 1 new infection in our local authority last week (population of 107,000) there was 2 new infections each the previous two weeks, 4 the week before and 2 the week before that (so staying pretty consistent since everything has opened). A few other authorities reported 0 new cases. Would people living in those areas be less receptive of closures, since the infections are under control?

I’m not disputing the importance of getting children back to school. It should absolutely be our priority. But I can understand the anger of those staff who would have their earnings reduce to 80% (again) even though there’s no new cases where they are.

Waxonwaxoff0 · 22/08/2020 10:10

Is it even necessary though?

Cases may not be going down but hospitalizations and deaths are extremely low. Unless they start to increase I don't think it's necessary.

GabriellaMontez · 22/08/2020 10:10

Why? Are lots of cases being spread in pubs?
I thought it was in households (certainly in GM area).

Oldbutstillgotit · 22/08/2020 10:12

Scottish schools have been open for just over a week and already one in Dundee has been closed until 31st August .

HeresMe · 22/08/2020 10:14

It's not being spread in pubs, the most recent wave of infections are mainly in a section of society who doesn't go in pubs.

But let's let loads of people lose jobs because of Mumsnet pubophobia

motherof2masterofnone · 22/08/2020 10:17

DH is a chef in a pub, we have had 6 months of mortgage holiday and I doubt they'll give us any more...we've also got 2 children to think about.

We rely (and so do thousands more) on the pubs and restaurants being open.

I find it really offensive when people just say 'shut the pubs' like the people who actually work in them don't matter and that they aren't important.

Of course kids should be going back to school but the rest of the country can't close forever.

monkeytennis97 · 22/08/2020 10:26

As a teacher I agree.. doubt it will popular with government/general population. Economy and all that. Chatting with epidemiologist friend of mine the other day she lives in Massachusetts all bars/pubs are closed so school openings given best chance.

Gingerfish91 · 22/08/2020 10:26

Why though?

Despite the cases rising, the hospitalisations and deaths continue to fall. As with Spain, the cases have been on the rise since mid June but death rate remains low.

monkeytennis97 · 22/08/2020 10:28

@excellentcustard

The two things are only connected by the Daily Mail. If you're advocating the closure of pubs, then it must also include shopping centres, cafés, offices since people gather there as well.

Or we could accept that children need educating, life must go on and we learn to live with risk again.

Are you a teacher? How do you fancy the risk of 1400 kids in poorly ventilated rooms, no PPE etc because that's what I'll be facing in September,.

monkeytennis97 · 22/08/2020 10:30

@Fainasnowchild

If you want to reduce outbreaks it's care homes and workplaces you need to shut....

When was week 32? During the school holidays or when there were limited openings?

feelingverylazytoday · 22/08/2020 10:30

@HeresMe

It's not being spread in pubs, the most recent wave of infections are mainly in a section of society who doesn't go in pubs.

But let's let loads of people lose jobs because of Mumsnet pubophobia

Good post. Thankfully researchers are able to trace routes of transmission, rather than just asking random self appointed experts on mumsnet. Give it up, people. You don't know everything about everything, after all.

Original poster

notevenat20 · 22/08/2020 10:36

It's not being spread in pubs, the most recent wave of infections are mainly in a section of society who doesn't go in pubs.

I think it is more subtle than that. It seems that there was a local spike caused by people socialising. But nationally I don't know what the overall most common cause of transmission is. Hopefully the govt does!

I guess the government could have a national scheme where they restrict different things in different areas. I worry that the messaging and politics would be too complicated though if they did that.

OP posts:

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