US Doctor On Opening Schools

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Dr James Hildreth, CEO of an American hospital and public health adviser to the mayor of Nashville, has a clear message about the opening of schools.

6 minute video well worth everyone's time.

IME the engagement from teenagers with online learning was utterly woeful. They need to be at school learning not pratting about on their phones at home.

If there are any breakouts then there will be local lockdowns (for a couple of weeks not months on end)

Children are sociable animals and need to be with their friends. Not endlessly staring at a screen.

Can't teachers just wear masks ? My son is in primary he went back in June and was with another 15 kids but he is in a bubble of 30 when going back or even teachers wear visors ?

@LynneThePA

IME the engagement from teenagers with online learning was utterly woeful. They need to be at school learning not pratting about on their phones at home.

If there are any breakouts then there will be local lockdowns (for a couple of weeks not months on end)

Children are sociable animals and need to be with their friends. Not endlessly staring at a screen.

Agree

The DFE document r staff dying is awful. Teachers signed up to educate not put themselves on the firing line in a pandemic. They would have been doctors Ormandy nurses if that was their career intent.

@AnIckabog

The government also released a document a few weeks ago for school leaders on what to do when education staff die of covid, e.g. how to break it to pupils that their teacher has died. They know what they are doing.

I can understand it is distressing to see this guidance but it has always been there. One of our teachers in my school was murdered a few years ago. It was horrific. We used the guidance then. I am not saying this makes it okay but there has always been advise on what to do if a staff member dies

It’s it a bad thing for teachers to learn how to break bad news. I’ve been a teacher for 20 yrs and in that time 3 of my colleagues have died. Teenagers tend to be sensitive souls (underneath the hard exterior) and any death needs to be dealt with in an appropriate manner.

@LynneThePA

No idea what’s going on in England but I’m a high school teacher in Scotland and we went back last week. We can wear masks but I’ve chosen not to. The children aren’t expected To socially distance themselves from each other but are supposed to keep 2 metres away from teachers.

It was great to see all their faces. They all looked so excited to be back (not normally something I would say😂)

Brilliant Really pleased to hear things are going well.

Sorry - should read “not a bad thing”

@GingerandTilly

It is interesting how this isn’t being reported more widely though isn’t it? Especially as he is a Harvard trained epidemiologist. Makes you wonder what else we’re not being told...

Its an opinion not a fact.

There are plenty of very well regarded epidemiologists saying different

Part of the problem is the non compliance of mask wearing on public transport and in shops. Unless all those that can, wear masks, we won't overcome the virus.

This is one Doctor giving his opinion on research done on air. But the body of research done across Europe, where schools have been back for months , says different.

They need to weigh up why it is different. There could be lots of reasons for that. We already know that air conditioning is bad. We knew that in terms of other types of flu, it was a carrier, but that didn't mean that we all got infected.

Now we have better testing and treatment pathways, we need to look at how deadly it is and what issues it's leaving, in who.

The Lancet reports that I read of the deaths of children in the US showed that the children were all obese. That's been a big factor in younger US deaths.

The government knows that we can't get compliance on mask wearing. It will mean teens from deprived areas all out of education.

This isn't as simple as it sounds.

Can you cite one @SodomyNonSapiens who directly addresses airborne transmission in context of schools re-opening?

There are also plenty of well regarded epidemiologists who support what is saying. For instance, see...
twitter.com/drzoehyde/status/1286985284102443008?s=21

@Ellsbells12

Can't teachers just wear masks ? My son is in primary he went back in June and was with another 15 kids but he is in a bubble of 30 when going back or even teachers wear visors ?

Masks need to be worn by all for their to be any benefit.

@NebularNerd

There's another thread on here where hundreds of posters have said they would like all staff/ students to go back to school WITHOUT any masks or social distancing as their preferred option.

I just cannot understand the lack of support for teachers' and students' safety given the scientific evidence.

It's like living in a parallel universe.

So right! Loads seem to have just stuck their head in the sand mainly out of desperation.

All teachers (most of) want is to be back in but with PPE just like most other workers. With all the furore on other threads you would have thought we were calling for schools to permanently closed for the next 5 years .....

This is from the Royal Society's DELVE group, set up to advise SAGE.

"If physical distancing in schools is not possible, masks will play a role in preventing infection. Older children, all adults in schools, as well as parents bringing their children into schools, should wear masks."

Report here

rs-delve.github.io/reports/2020/07/24/balancing-the-risk-of-pupils-returning-to-schools.html

I’m not convinced by that at all. If social distancing indoors without masks doesn’t work why did t we get even more cases and deaths before masks were obligatory? Everything opened with just SD and there was no big increase.

I can’t understand why government guidance doesn’t recommend masks in schools. Is it a supply issue or are they worried it will make parents / teachers more conscious of the risks?

@LynneThePA

IME the engagement from teenagers with online learning was utterly woeful. They need to be at school learning not pratting about on their phones at home.

If there are any breakouts then there will be local lockdowns (for a couple of weeks not months on end)

Children are sociable animals and need to be with their friends. Not endlessly staring at a screen.

That is a general assumption given the variation between schools. We delivered a full online curriculum via Teams. Most of my students made good progress and we finished one of gcse units and the online assessments were good.

Raspberry - the point is schools didn’t. They were open but only very partially as with very small groups which don’t reflect what there will be in September. I really don’t see the harm in trying the mask thing - surely it’s better than the alternative?

To clarify, the document RE staff death has been added, it is specifically about death from covid not other causes.
It's also a pretty shit document that tells us nothing common sense didn't.

@AnIckabog

The government also released a document a few weeks ago for school leaders on what to do when education staff die of covid, e.g. how to break it to pupils that their teacher has died. They know what they are doing.

Yep.

And this is at the end

There must be reasonable evidence that the death was caused by an occupational exposure to coronavirus (COVID-19). The responsible person should notify HSE by the quickest practicable means, without delay, and send a report within 10 days of the death. The failure to make a RIDDOR report is a criminal offence.
HSE will look at the circumstances and may decide to investigate. Through their investigatory work, HSE:
• identifies actions employers must take to prevent recurrences
• aims to share broader lessons
• could take enforcement action if there are breaches of health and safety at work law

There is an inconsistency in the video:

1. He talks about the virus still being present in the air in spite of triple-filtration (in addition to UV/vastly increased air circulation).

1. He then talks about the importance of wearing masks.

Given number 1, why would masks make any difference?

I'm not against masks at all. But according to his evidence they're not going to work, are they?

@BertiesLanding

There is an inconsistency in the video:

1. He talks about the virus still being present in the air in spite of triple-filtration (in addition to UV/vastly increased air circulation).

1. He then talks about the importance of wearing masks.

Given number 1, why would masks make any difference?

I'm not against masks at all. But according to his evidence they're not going to work, are they?

Read between the lines. He’s saying it isn’t safe to open schools but if we’re going to do so, take such steps as we can to reduce risk.

@BertiesLanding

There is an inconsistency in the video:

1. He talks about the virus still being present in the air in spite of triple-filtration (in addition to UV/vastly increased air circulation).

1. He then talks about the importance of wearing masks.

Given number 1, why would masks make any difference?

I'm not against masks at all. But according to his evidence they're not going to work, are they?

It's not inconsistent. Any reduction in virus will lower the dose - potentially to less than the infectious dose. And masks do reduce droplets Also the aerosols are formed by droplets evaporating into the smaller aerosol microdroplets. Catching them in a mask as they are exhaled will stop them forming.

The schools need to be opened and children need to receive an education.

Let’s deal with a second wave (if and it’s a big if) if it happens.
Some of you really are catastrophising (not sure how you spell that) and you really need to think about getting help from your GP for this.
Ask yourself - are you spending all day, online, searching for articles and videos with a worse care scenario? What is your behaviour doing for your mental health?
Set your children a better example and put your phones down.