Pubs or kids?

[coffeeandllbd]

Whitty said we cannot have it all. Pubs are jobs. School is mental health.

I have a 13 year old struggling with lockdown. I would choose schools. My brother would choose pubs.

Who would you choose?

Schools.

I work in education.

I think pubs matter and are job and economy. But from what I've seen they aren't enforcing SD very well and many are overcrowded.

If it's a case of schools which aren't having PPE or SD (just bubbles) don't open because pubs aren't having these either I'd close pubs.

My answer would be improve ensuring businesses follow the covid secure guidelines.

I don’t think it’ll come down to a decision between pubs/hospitality and schools, the government need both open for different reasons. Far more likely in my opinion will be a row back on social interactions, perhaps similar to what’s recently happened in some areas of the North, or maybe more back to where we were a few months back. No indoor meets, only meet up with one other person etc. Not ideal, especially as the weather worsens, but I just can’t see them shutting down businesses again in September.

*Whitty does not live in the real world. He does not have to take any cognisance of the wider economic impact of medical decisions made.

I don’t understand the love for him on this site. He inspires no confidence in me at all. The only thing I can find in his favour is he’s better than that idiot Harries.

@SengaStrawberry* I'd love to know what you do for a living. Genuinely and I mean that without any spite or goadiness. I'm a supposedly clever person educated to a high level and unless I was a scientist and had some sort of clue in that area of expertise wouldn't he bandying about the word 'idiot' ... you could, of course, be a world leading epidemiologist/ doctor in which case please expand! I'd love to know more about what we should be doing from a genuine expert.

I’ve always found Whitty very clear on his own role when asked to expand into an area that is not his own.

However on the school statement he will be speaking on behalf of the government, having given advice then being briefed.

senga

He’s a doctor, he gives medical opinions.

He’s not your local GP you know! He’s the most senior ”doctor” in the land! He is a scientist (an epidemiologist to be precise, so that’s handy!)

In this capacity, Chris Whitty is one of the most senior members of sage. He is there to represent the joint opinion of sage, which covers multiple fields of science).

You are right though, he is first and foremost a doctor, which is why he is so good at talking to the public and a scientist which is why he’s so carefully presenting the information.

Sorry should have said he is a scientist as well as a senior medic.

I got the impression from the briefing that

1. Schools will definitely open
2. They may prevent households from meeting in order to achieve this.

That’s my interpretation and I hope I’m right that this is their priority ordering but who knows really!

Dh and I went to a lovely pub last week where everything was followed to the letter. I felt more relaxed there than at my friend's house the previous week, where all my friends had apparently decided social distancing was over. However I accept not every pub will be doing things properly. I think if they breach guidelines, they should lose their license.

I would say schools but I can't believe they are going to let pubs have reopened, establish their businesses again and then suddenly close again.
As a teacher, I think it's absolutely essential that schools reopen. I am confident that I can get my class caught up with what they have missed and get them back on track. It'll be hard work for me and the kids but definitely doable. If we miss much more time in the classroom, it will get difficult to catch up.

It's not just pubs though, it's the entire sector. People socialising and spending money, earning a wage has been put first.

It would have been far better to make more effort to provide these services at home. Investing in incentives to get pubs, restaurants etc delivering.

The government have put our kids last. They should have looked at ways to provide every child with at least 50/50 school and home school. Rather than this everyone back in September ideal.

They should have planned for the worst and increased time in school if it was successful.

All I see on my fb timeline is school parents having mass meets with family and friends. Groups of 30 people are not uncommon. My family has slightly increased risk, they can't go back and mix with the idiots who are hugging and kissing everyone they meet.

I'm a TA and care very much about the pupils I work with. They simply can't afford to be out of school any longer. It seems to be widely accepted children don't get very ill from COVID and they may not transmit it - the science is still out on that though. By keeping them out of school, the government has prioritised other groups in society. This is not acceptable in the medium to long term.

Education is a right, every child has a right to an education so school would get my vote every time
I completely agree. Pubs are leisure, not a right.

Schools every time. I understand the economic issues but I am very concerned about the mental health of my DC (no school since March and poor provision for home schooling from school) and my own ability to work as a single parent. IMO pubs are potential areas for the spread of the virus amongst the age groups who could require hospitalisation.

If I were to pick schools but I have no interest in going to the pub. I would miss cafes etc. if they closed.
I have a feeling that rather than it being schools or hospitality that meet up indoors will be banned. Going into winter I would find this very hard as during the week I’m at home on my own with a baby as partner works away during the week. To have the ability not to have my mum or friend over will really hit my mental health. If baby groups start up it won’t be so bad but I don’t think they will if we ‘have reached the limits of what can be open’ and meeting outdoors with a baby during what could be a wet winter will be very hard.

It’s pretty obvious that schools wins this one.
Has your brother had kids to look after since lockdown started?? Maybe this is clouding his view!

My children need to be in school. Much as I like going to the pub, in my opinion school reopening is the most important thing.

I really don’t think they will close pubs and restaurants again, they have gone to great effort to encourage people back into these places with the eat out to help out scheme, they aren’t going to offer that for the whole of August, only to close them again come 1st Sept.

More likely that they will tell us we can’t mix with other households again, which won’t work IMO because people will either meet in the pubs that they’ve chosen to keep open or will just ignore the guidance altogether!

Pubs!!!

I agree that the first thing they will limit is social contact as it will cost the government nothing.

This is a silly question, if you have kids you will be likely to choose schools, if you don't have kids it's probably pubs!

I think you'd get a different answer on Pistonheads!

If we can't make it work with people in pubs and eating out, they have been perfectly clear that they will close them and even go back to full lockdown if they have to

The more careful and sensible people are with our current freedoms, the more likely we will keep them

Surely it has to be schools?

Children need an education and a lot of parents need their children to be in school so that they can work, in turn helping the economy.

Pubs are purely for pleasure, and from what I've witnessed are a sure fire way to spread the virus as people don't distance and give incorrect information for the track and trace.

Yes, people will lose their jobs and businesses, but I think that is an unavoidable reality right now. Education and work for a higher majority is more important.

@gingganggooleywotsit

This is a silly question, if you have kids you will be likely to choose schools, if you don't have kids it's probably pubs!

I don't have children but I can see sense in getting them back to school which should then stop the arguments about how to do this, is it safe etc. This also means it shouldn't be a problem for childcare for parents needing to return to work. If parents don't want to send their children back then it's their choice to keep them at home if they are expected to go back to work outside of the home.

Then open everything else up that is still closed.

Schools should be priority, but I would like to see ppe allowed to be used for those who wish to use it.