No sympathy for people who booked a recent holiday

[fairparie]

Headlines this morning have got me cross. People who are 'devastated' that their holiday to Spain that they booked last week won't go ahead as they can't quarantine on return and lost all their money.
How stupid to book a holiday when you know it is a risk. We were going to go away and had not booked anything as was leaving it till the last minute. . We still could but I would not expect my work to pay for me in quarantine on top of two weeks away. It is understandable if I had booked before the pandemic but why should a firm pay for quarantine for those who knowingly knew it may be a risk.
I have full sympathy for those that booked before the pandemic and at least they will be insured. But c'mon how can you be upset that you have lost your money for a holiday you booked last week and now can't go on due to quarantine?

walkaround Unless and until the whole of Spain is in full lockdown it becomes impossible to cherry pick what areas are safe, and what areas are not. As people are constantly moving around both for work and leisure therefore continuing to spread the virus. The modelling for Spain with the predicted number of infections (and deaths) in the next 3-6 weeks is eye watering. You should be so dismissive and irresponsible about the risks, they are very real for Spain now.

@madbirdlady22 - why does the FCO still think the Spanish islands are safe, then? Just to mess up people’s insurance policies?

walkaround the issues on planes is not only one of air droplets, but one of touch, and repeated touching by those not wearing gloves. Gloves are currently not compulsory. Although masks will help, they will not stop a sneeze - especially given the flimsy material most people are using, they are by no means medical grade masks. People will fiddle with masks, taking them on and off during the period of its wear, and transference of infection is obvious.

In terms of the pubs, they are completely empty here, and the ones that are being used are mostly being encouraged to sit in the gardens where is in the fresh air and safer. Most/all pubs are socially distancing people, so yes of course they are safer than a packed plane, I am surprised you have even considered the comparison. Pubs have the same restrictions as everywhere else. Careful numbers of socially distanced people are allowed, time limits are in place etc etc. We are not seeing packed pubs of people anywhere unless they want to be closed down.

@LolaSmiles - do you count the entire country of Spain as being “whiny” for asking the UK government not to quarantine people coming back from the Spanish islands? Or only individuals who are arguing that the Government did not need to react in such a sudden and blanket way that was not co-ordinated with FCO advice on places exempted from the no non-essential travel advice?
I think governments should work with each other to establish plans and that what government plans are is totally separate to people choosing to take a gamble and then complaining when it doesn't go their way.

Nobody needs a foreign holiday. Anyone who sees a regularly changing international health situation and chooses to gamble on being able to take an overseas holiday during a pandemic is taking a risk. People are free to take whatever risk they like within the law, but they can't take the view of wanting to take the risk... But only if it goes my way because I don't like the fact it might not go my way.

madbirdlady2 - what makes you think the aeroplanes are packed when the pubs are not?! I’m not sure I get your point on gloves - it is no safer getting the virus on your glove, then touching your face, than it is to do it without a glove on. Gloves just mean people wash their hands less, making everyone less safe. As for masks, if everyone wears one, then everyone is safer and less likely to be hit by droplets. Touching or not touching your mask while wearing it is up to the individual. I am not made less safe by someone else touching their own mask. The risks cannot be completely removed from any situation.

@LolaSmiles - it seems to me that people making a fuss are doing exactly the same thing as countries - stating why they personally think the Government’s reaction was unreasonable and trying to get it to change its stance to suit their position. They won’t succeed if they try the tack of, “I needed that holiday, it’s not fair,” as that’s an exceptionally weak argument, but that doesn’t mean every person complaining about it is immoral and/or stupid.

Walkaround
I've not said anyone challenging the government is stupid

I've said that people who've booked an overseas holiday in the middle of a pandemic and then get annoyed when their gamble didn't go their way we're short sighted and bleating on about how they need a foreign holiday is silly.

Nobody needs a foreign holiday. If you book one during a pandemic then you're taking a risk because governments can, and will, make changes to the rules. Travel insurance doesn't cover these sorts of situations so if someone chooses to take the risk then they are accepting the associated risk. That's the reality of an international health crisis. People getting annoyed online because they need their holiday/ the weather isn't nice in the UK / I couldn't bring myself to go to Cornwall because some rural areas didn't want visitors at the start of lockdown so I'm stamping my feet is just whiny in my opinion.

@LolaSmiles - that is not what the OP was arguing though, was it? You can be upset your holiday was unnecessarily ruined and that your money has been wasted for the very legitimate reasons Spain is talking to the UK about at the moment - that a sudden blanket quarantine rule for the whole of Spain and its islands was not a proportionate or reasonable response. So to agree with the OP is to agree that people should shut up and not complain about anything.

yes, people ARE entitled to a holiday !

Words fail me.

It's a shame for them but they did take a risk booking recently. We'll be staying in the UK this summer. Plenty of places to go and things to do to get a break. Just because Cornwall is packed doesn't mean "everything is full" nor is everywhere massively expensive. London is like a ghost town and much cheaper than normal - we've booked rooms in Covent Garden at £50 a night (Premier Inn) and there are still lots of things to do. Also looking at Norfolk for similar prices at a hotel or hiring a boat on the Broads. Lots of options and less risk of losing money. We moved our holiday abroad to next summer as it's just not worth chancing it.

Latest is that Labour are calling for support for those returning and having to quarantine. So an individual makes decision to go on holiday during a pandemic, gets stuck and Labour want us to support them.
Financially?
Um no I don't think so.

Latest is that Labour are calling for support for those returning and having to quarantine. So an individual makes decision to go on holiday during a pandemic, gets stuck and Labour want us to support them.
Financially?
Um no I don't think so.

No me either. Annoying by Labour.

@ShutUpaYourFace If you are quarantining, then you are not entitled to SSP and if your employer will sack or not pay you....... they then won't quarantine, will go to work and risk further spread.

Um good thinking there!

Its a farce, you can go shopping whilsts quarantining, even go back on holiday again.

I booked a holiday last year for October this year! I don’t think I’m a horrible person for wanting to go and not waste £2000 which I could be spending on better things like my mortgage now I’ve been made redundant because of this virus! I’m hoping the holiday gets cancelled so I can get a refund but if they don’t cancel it I can’t get my money back!

@jasjas1973
Confused by your reply.
If you booked a holiday and now have to isolate for 14 days on return you should have considered that before you went. Why should you get any support?
If you won't get paid and go to work anyway and risk spreading the virus that's on the individual.
My guess is employers will know where the employee has been and won't want them in work. So Unpaid 2 weeks then. I wouldn't expect a government scheme to bail me out.

If quarantined or isolating you shouldn't be going shopping or on holiday again?

@ShutUpaYourFace

As i said, if your employer wont help and you cannot get SSP, then the temptation is to carry on working, especially for the ZHC's and self employed, no obligation to tell your employer where you've been.

The numbers of people who would need this help would be small and far better to assist them rather than say give £1k to an employer to take back a furloughed worker who they would have done so in anycase.

if you are quarantined but cannot get food delivered, you can go shopping yourself, otherwise you'd starve! you can also go on a pre booked holiday too, pretty sure you would be able to take your kids to school as well.

@jasjas1973
It would be really irresponsible to go to work if you were supposed to be quarantined. I'm sure there are fines available for the selfish people that think they are exempt.
So ok we pay for those returning who have to isolate. If they did that I'm sure the travel industry would be revived with thousands suddenly willing to take the risk. "Oh well the government will pay us to have another 2 week holiday after this one, lets pack our bags now"!
There are charities out there l, friends, family or neighbours who can pick up groceries, I'm sure the government did food parcels as well for those who were unable to get support.
There is no excuse. You decide to go abroad during a pandemic and now have to quarantine. The government can't bail everyone out, especially those who made the decision to fly knowing the consequences.

@ShutUpaYourFace

Latest is that Labour are calling for support for those returning and having to quarantine. So an individual makes decision to go on holiday during a pandemic, gets stuck and Labour want us to support them. Financially? Um no I don't think so.

Not like Labour to be out of touch with public mood.

@ShutUpaYourFace

Latest is that Labour are calling for support for those returning and having to quarantine. So an individual makes decision to go on holiday during a pandemic, gets stuck and Labour want us to support them. Financially? Um no I don't think so.

They havent said financially and theyre talking about people who had the rules changed whilst on holiday or enroute - not people booking now or not there yet! Theyre also not talking about payment, theyre talking about making sure there employer is understanding and lets them quarrantine as its ok Raab saying "we hope employers are understanding" they need something which says the must be.

I don’t think you can force employers to accept this unless the person needed to travel for a sick relative or funeral. It’s a personal choice to go away mid pandemic for a want not a need so people need to accept the consequences.

More will book or do a second trip etc if they know there employer would have to grant extra leave etc.

I think it’s a bit harsh to expect employers to have to take a hit on this. They are trying to get their businesses up and running again they don’t need the extra expense of paying additional leave to an employee who took a risk by booking and taking a holiday during a pandemic (I’m talking during COVID not prior bookings). Also the employee, if on furlough, could be putting themselves at the top of the list for possible redundancy if the company were looking to reduce staff numbers.

@palacegirl77
Those people already on holiday in Spain or en route also knew the risks of travelling abroad during a pandemic.
An employer shouldn't force people to work if isolating, likewise they shouldn't have to pay the person if they can't work. It will all depend on the employer. Some employers will be more understanding than others. You can't create a new law demanding understanding.
Apart from being paid to isolate I can't think of what other support they could possibly offer.
This is not an employers responsibility.
If travelling you should assume that situations may change, you may get stuck unable to travel home or you may have to isolate on return. I would hope many on holiday now would have discussed this with their employer prior to leaving.
Unfortunately you don't need a beach to bury your head in the sand.

Not like Labour to be out of touch with public mood.
😀😀😀

@ShutUpaYourFace Raab on Sophie Ridge said that no one should be out of pocket for following the law, indeed he said it was "against the law" to do so in this country.

Shows what he knows then! a Tory toff out of touch... there's a thought!

There is zero enforcement of any quarantine restrictions, many people live from week to week, inc those who go on budget holidays.... pay the rent & feed my family or stay at home....mmmmmmmm decisions decisions!

If its important to quarantine, then the Govt should ensure people are able to, after all, it was they who said international travel is ok.

@jasjas1973

You can't be that skint if you can afford to traipse off on foreign holidays in the middle of a pandemic.