The wealthiest families should pay the Coronovirus bill

[WellDoneBridge]

Aibu to think this is VERY unfair the household incomes of £100k plus should be tax EVEN further?!

Ffs... Anneliese Dodds. What a joke!!!!

I also do find it a bit odd that ‘high earners’ were actually the least cushioned by the furlough scheme. Many lost much more than just 20% because of the Caps but now they’re also the ones who should pay it all back that doesn’t sit right.
The only fair way to recoup this money would be a blanket X% tax on everyone regardless of income level. The furlough scheme supported people from all pay grades, it’s not now being pushed onto the middle class to repay!

People earning £50k up until about £125k were the squeezed middle. We get absolutely nothing back - not even child benefit - but pay higher rate taxes.

Isn’t there already an economic measure of tax - Laffer curve?

@voiceofreason the PP already accounted for the tax free and low tax allowances the numbers are correct

@voiceofreason the PP already accounted for the tax free and low tax allowances the numbers are correct

I know someone who inherited a house last year & sold it for 2.4m, they work 2 days a week as a teacher.

In relation to London whether your parents own property or not & if they pass it on to you will have far more impact on your life outcomes then a high paying job.

£50k in London is not the same as £50k in Hull though. So a household income of £100K in Hull would leave a shitload of disposable income compared to a household on the same money in London or the SE in general if comparing like for like housing etc. So I don't think a £50K salary makes you wealthy but I think you are wrong to claim poverty OP.

It’s 100k a household though not 50k

Income tax rates in this country are low historically and compared to other nations, even taking into account NI.

I think we should add a penny or two onto income tax across the board, go back to taxing dividends and savings as income (since ISA levels are pretty generous), give earners over £100k their personal allowances back (it's too bloody complex), but start the 45p tax rate at £100k, and maybe make £200k plus 50p tax.

Plus align self employment NI rates to be a bit closer to those for employee people.

Sorry, is this a joke? 100k a household pa and you're strapped for cash?!

For those that asked about Amazon, I believe they are using a registration loophole for the business being officially registered in Ireland, while trading in England. I understand Amazon pay less than £15m in tax, which sounds immense, until you realise their UK turnover is in the billions and their profits are in the hundreds of millions.

What we need in the UK is tax law which takes into account technological change, and profits generated via the internet, and bills passed in Parliament to keep up with this.

Increasing tax rates on individuals earning over £100k in excess of what they already pay will bring in a tiny fraction of what's needed to make a difference, if it's to be believed that only 5% of people working earn that amount.

@Greencox your situation sounds very similar to ours. We also hail from the North originally and haven't had input from family and pay for any childcare we use.

It all looks great on paper but it's expensive living here - we have a decent size house but two of the DC share a room, the car is a 12-year old people-carrier and sadly we don't routinely shop at waitrose.

Regardless of where you live 50k is 50k where you choose to live is up to you.

totally depends where you live. London and parts of the SE are very different from The Wirral

I’m in London. Nice outer borough with great transport links, so housing isn’t the cheapest. Two kids, one in still in nursery. Combined income of around £115k - I took a salary drop to change sectors and DH recently took a chunky pay cut thanks to COVID so we have less coming in than before.

And still you know what? We’re absolutely fine. If we need to pay more tax to contribute to making sure the economy doesn’t completely fall apart and we see mass unemployment and kids in poverty, we’ll still be absolutely fine and better off than most.

Sure, I’d like to see higher corporation tax, and sure, I’d like to see higher inheritance tax (and before you ask, yes I’m due to inherit - but it’s a fuckload fairer to tax unearned inherited wealth more than piling the burden onto consumption taxes or other regressive taxes that hit the poorest disproportionately hard.)

It’s called perspective, OP, and being grateful for one’s good fortune.

Earslaps that incremental loss of personal allowance over £100k is so bizarre, it needs to be gone yesterday!

I do wonder why there is never any suggestion of a tax on profits in property? That's a huge mass of unearned profit and one of the few assets that there is no tax on on disposal. Surely not that difficult to allow people to keep a part of the profit and then tax the remainder. Would be a huge way to bring in revenue. But for some reason,
property gains are seen as untouchable in this country.

@Pixxie7

Regardless of where you live 50k is 50k where you choose to live is up to

But the cost of living can be wildly different depending on where you live, so that £50k can either stretch a long way or just about cover the basics.

Surely the government could just get the tax from the companies that use tax havens etc rather than trying to get the money from a certain percentage of the country. I doubt this will happen as far too many Tory voters will get hit.

What we need in the UK is tax law which takes into account technological change, and profits generated via the internet, and bills passed in Parliament to keep up with this.

Not this again. Do you think that HMRC actively encourages businesses to shift profits to low tax jurisdictions? Or that Parliament is sitting idly by watching profits that should be taxed in the UK being funnelled offshore? Of course not.

The UK is only one country. We can’t stop the Cayman Islands, or Luxembourg, or any other country, making itself attractive to businesses by offering low tax rates. How do the previous posters suggest that we make those other entities play nicely? Answer: you can’t.

That’s why we have the BEPS (base erosion and profit shifting) tax legislation, which other countries have also signed up to. That helps, but ultimately the only thing that will stop Amazon and the like from taking the piss is if people vote with their feet and stop buying from them until they pay more tax on their UK profits.

Will that happen? I hope so, but people might have to adapt by not buying the cheapest stuff with free delivery.

(The OP is clearly having a laugh, BTW).

@hadenoughbleach it's pretty nonsensical really. If someone earns £200k, they actually pay a higher effective tax rate on the £100k to £150k portion (with an effective tax rate of 60% from £100k to £125k) than on the portion over £150k.

It makes the tax system overly complicated and means lots of tax returns needing to be done.

I do think we need a reform of self employment too. It is currently much cheaper for companies and individuals to get contractors to be self employed. I'm pleased they are clamping down via IR35. If there is a loophole people would be crazy not to take it, so it's up to the government to close loopholes.

@whacks493

I used the MoneyExpert tax calculator .

The UK is only one country.

Exactly

That helps, but ultimately the only thing that will stop Amazon and the like from taking the piss is if people vote with their feet and stop buying from them until they pay more tax on their UK profits.

Yep

Iamthewombat the second paragraph you quoted was mine, and no, being tax qualified I am well aware that HMRC doesn't sit around like that.

What I am aware of is that corporation tax legislation hasn't kept suitable pace with the development of online transactions. I'd like to see HMRC become more agile in its response to these huge companies who avoid tax by taking advantage of loopholes.

Shmithecat@ true but that’s why you get London weighting people choose what they spend their money on, Including where you live. So if you decide to spend more on housing then someone else, you may have less to spend on other things.
You can’t have a system where how much tax you pay depends on your expenses otherwise everyone would spend their whole salary.

[quote WellDoneBridge]@Uhoh2020

Michael Kors? I'm not a chav. [/quote]
Yeah, that ain’t the c word I’d use to describe you either

I am with you there Earslaps. The loss of personal allowance is completely unnecessary in the way they've applied it, and only serves to piss people off. It's be far more effective to just do away with it altogether, and perhaps start 45% at £135k.

I also agree the whole self employment system needs reforming. I'm currently trying to recruit a Systems Manager at £60k. No-one will come because they earn £120k as contractors on £500 per day. My Head Of is on £85k, so increasing them really wouldn't work. What the contractors overlook factoring in is the NI, PAYE, holidays, pension, sick days etc that you get from an employer. Ironically Covid-19 plus the delay in implementing IR35 means I'll probably find someone great when we next go to market.