The wealthiest families should pay the Coronovirus bill

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Aibu to think this is VERY unfair the household incomes of £100k plus should be tax EVEN further?!

Ffs... Anneliese Dodds. What a joke!!!!

However, some people work PT hours/choose a certain career as a lifestyle choice, it's really not fair for people who work FT as no ability to be PT or who work in a difficult job should pay more than someone who chooses not to work more hours

Genuine question, how would you apply this to households with a SAHP or PT worker providing childcare? It’s not really a ‘choice’ for many. I work PT because DS’s FT fees would be equal to my FT wage.
You could argue that people like me ‘could work FT’ but it would make us no more able to pay extra taxes if I did.

@Pomegranatepompom - You want to penalise me working part-time, while paying more tax than many due to income. How exactly do you plan to do that? And why?

No I really didn't mean anyone should pay more tax who works PT.

But I would definitely reduce my hours for all the reasons pp have said.

@Pumpertrumper sorry I wasn't clear, I'd reduce my hours as no incentive to work FT. I'd also not need as much childcare, wouldn't employ a cleaner etc.

My choice comment was re the pp who described earning 1k a month in an enjoyable occupation. I do think it's a bit off if you expect to be topped up because you work 20 hours a week but could work 37.

We're all going to be paying for this for years or even decades let's face it, but a couple of points:

1. It can't be a return to fuck over the poor with crippling cuts while the rich get tax breaks like the last 10 years under the Tories

2. The poorer sections of society (low paid unsecure workers in the gig economy etc) have got nothing left to give. The councils who've been cut to the point of bankruptcy have got nothing left to cut.

It's because of the poor suffering under austerity while the rich got richer that it can't happen again

I’ve just looked in on this thread, and it has gone in exactly the direction I thought it would.

Any poster who makes a rational, evidence-based argument (excellent work by @ReceptacleForTheRespectable) is attacked, as follows:

• you’re twisting my words.
• you’re dim and didn’t understand my argument.
• you’re stealth boasting.
• I’m flouncing off in a huff.

We also got the return of ‘tax the super rich’ and ‘make Amazon pay more’. The latter appears every two pages, on average. I could set my watch by it.

So far, so predictable. However, there were some unexpected highlights, in the form of innovative new excuses for why particular posters can’t possibly pay any more tax:

If we had loads of extra money, if we didn’t have to budget and be careful, I would be happy to pay more.

There are other contributions in this vein from higher-rate taxpayers. In other words, HMRC should ask the taxpayers how rich they feel and how much tax they themselves think that they should be paying. Voluntary taxation, in other words. Why has nobody ever thought of that?

Actually, I’ll tell you who has. The last time I saw that suggestion, it was made by a global thought leader in economics: Ashley Banjo, the dancer from Britain’s Got Talent, when he was interviewed in Take a Break. He was asked what he’d do if he ran the country. Answer: he’d make tax voluntary and he’d give more money to the poor.

I’ll be generous and speculate that Ashley was preoccupied with writing his speech for the world economic forum at Davos and hence hadn’t really thought through the implications of a voluntary tax system, not least for the poor people he professed to care so much about. Take a Break is notorious for asking the hard hitting questions; it’s the print version of Jeremy Paxman.

Does that give some indication of how such a suggestion would be received if it were made to anybody who actually understands tax or economics?

I was also entertained to read that another high-earning poster would, in protest at having to pay more tax, go part time and reduce the hours worked by her cleaner, her gardener and her nanny. What a threat to the economy! I don’t suppose that she considered that the cleaner, the gardener and the nanny would undoubtedly have the sense to go and work somewhere else.

To say nothing of, “I think I’m paying too much tax because I don’t agree with how it is spent”.

Talk about ridiculous. Do you think that every taxpayer in the UK should be consulted on how tax revenue is spent, and that none of it should be spent until everyone agrees? How do you think that would work out?

Get stealth boast JasJas but maybe you should give you land up or your second home in France to people that need rehousing? Millions of people that need housing in the U.K. I’m sure it’s the same in France? How selfish of you to have a second home that no one lives in ...

I agree Eveleft.
Jasjas you're obviously rich and successful and you often post about what an unfair society we live in, so maybe you should gift the land with planning permission to the local council to provide housing given there’s a massive housing shortage.

@Iamthewombat and @ReceptacleForTheRespectable are surely same person here?

I thought you’d flounced? No, we are not the same person.

So, for someone who worked throughout the whole Covid issue in ITU, do you also think I should paying more tax? Sorry but no, I have done my bit. I do not agree to being taxed more to pay for the governments choices.
Let’s face it- nhs will keep on getting screwed as we are seen as unimportant. But I refuse to pay more tax after what I have gone thru.

I do not agree to being taxed more to pay for the governments choices.

Which choices in particular do you object to? Saving the economy with the bail-out schemes?

I am curious to hear more about your ‘paying tax in kind’ concept, through. As in, you feel that you have done your bit already by not being furloughed.

Do you think that certain professions should pay less tax? Which?

How about people who were not furloughed, irrespective of profession? Do they get special treatment?

Who pays more tax if you’re paying less? The people who were furloughed and who consequently earned less? Do you see that as a just punishment to offset your just reward?

#iamthewombat
Is that aimed at me?

Yes, that is why I quoted your post.

Okay, no I don’t think I should be made to pay more tax.
Nothing to be furloughed.
More to do with the fact that I was redeployed to work in a Covid area, looking after intimated patients with constantly changing PPE.
I put my, and my families life at risk to care for others.
So no, anyone like me, in similar situations should not be bearing the brunt.

Intubated!

@iamthewombat I am guessing you were furloughed then. So haven’t had to witness and care for those dying. Having to work crappy shifts to ensure ITU is covered. So you can try to make a point about those who have.
You just have no idea.

No, I am not furloughed. I’m working as hard as ever, thanks.

Is your argument that because you work in the NHS, you should pay less tax than everybody else?

Which other professions do you think should enjoy the same advantage? Retail staff? Utilities workers? Transport workers?

If you are paying less, who should pay more? Surprise me by NOT saying, ‘make Amazon pay more corporation tax’.

Perhaps you could also set out which of the government’s choices you don’t feel that you’d hold pay for.

That should read, ‘you should pay for’, not ‘you’d hold pay for’. Butterfingers.

@Pomegranatepompom

Ahhh ok, that makes much more sense!
Yes I thought similar when reading the ‘we only earn’t 12k in a year’ post! Sounded very much like that posters partner was choosing to work freelance in their ‘vocation of pleasure’ which happens to be badly paid. I can only assume PP themselves didn’t work at all. In which case there’s a huge element of ‘that’s your choice’ about it all. (I’m also guessing that UC/benefits were not included in that £12k, which would raise the total yearly amount substantially. If they were included then PP’s DH must be working sparse PT hours at most, else be charging pennies for lessons).

At the end of the day I’d love my DH to be around more rather than working 60+ hour highly stressful weeks. I’d love to be able to wake him up right now and hand off our fractious DS without worrying that in a few hours he’ll be all that stands between other people’s loved ones living or dying 🙄. Jobs are a trade off of time and skills in return for cash compensation, it’s not wrong that people are paid differently. It’s not wrong that teaching music PT pays 6x less than saving lives or 3x less than FT academic teaching.

I think people who choose to value their time and interests over earning potential then complain or stealth boast about how they’re ‘just scrapping by’ are THE WORST. If you’re not earning enough work more, or work differently. I’m afraid ‘but we have childcare to juggle...etc’ isn’t much of an excuse when 2/3 of the population are in the same situation and just having to get on with it.

Posters like @Iamthewombat are so trigger happy jumping on people like me with the ‘well if you’re not happy living on DH’s high wage and your PT one why don’t you work FT that’s your choice obviously’. (Regardless of the fact we’d be no better off if I worked FT.
But... if we were a low income household surviving (by choice) on just my PT wage saying ‘it’s hard we have kids to care for’ we’d be lavished with ‘poor you’ opinions

I really enjoyed that ‘you posted right next to those poor people earning 12k per year you grabby cow’ shaming I got earlier! Well yes, DH would like to teach golf PT for a living and I’d like to bake cakes...but we’d rather not be poor. So he’ll go work 60 hours at the hospital and I’ll go to the office 3x a week!

Ha! No I'm definitely not Wombat.

Gizmo - I don't believe that anybody should be exempt from the tax system. If there is an increase, the new rules should apply to all.

However, I would like to see NHS and care staff rewarded with better resourcing and better working conditions. I've always opposed the removal of bursaries for student nurses, for example. I worked in the NHS until comparatively recently and under-resourcing was a huge issue.

It's interesting that the first assumption you made was that anyone who disagreed with you was furloughed. Only 25% of the UK workforce was furloughed, and while that's a huge number it's still a minority. Whether in or outside the NHS, most people have carried on working hard throughout. It annoys me that the media have presented this as everyone having loads of free time, as for most that simply isn't the case.

(I also wasn't furloughed btw.)

@Pumpertrumper I agree with you.
DH and I studied hard and now have stressful and busy jobs - if the balance tips so my family are not benefiting from my hours, I’ll change careers/ reduce hours.
I truly believe we should help people but the sense of entitlement dismays me.
Had a similar conversation yesterday re someone who normally works 15 hours, no reason why she can’t increase to provide a better life for her DD.
I know this post will get bashed - I won’t see as just about to get off train to pay some of those taxes !