Do people think it’s over now?

[SpookyNoise]

I’m surprised at how many people seem to think the lockdown is over and there is no threat from the virus. I’ve had a friend ask us over for dinner in their house, and my son has had a friend ask him over to play. We declined both invites, obviously. Has anyone else got friends who think it’s all over?

@TheGreatWave
I agree and it’s very worrying. We are failing so many people. Many will not survive due to a delay in diagnosis or treatment. Many will need treatment for longer.
The emotional tole this is taking on people also cannot be overlooked. I have patients who were diagnosed days before lockdown. They have not been treated. How can we begin to imagine the impact of living for months with something growing inside you that you know is slowly killing you. How do you deal with that. I was so relieved when the clinics reopened but shocked at the number of people they were seeing.
I know other departments are like that too.
One of my best friends is a nurse on the surgical ward. She said it was easy when she was transferred onto the Covid ward as there was never more that 12 people in. She among others could not understand why every other department stopped.

@BeijingBikini

I agree. A lot of 'selfish and entitled' attitudes about. There will always be people at higher risk than others for infectious diseases. That doesn't give them the right to demand that others put their lives on hold for them. The worst thing is that the same people here are lecturing others about being 'selfish' and not caring about 'society'.

@FromMarch2020
It is awful, I know one lady who had her grandchildren round, all 7 of them. Her neighbours phoned the police (beginning of lockdown). They actually came to her house and told her they had reports of her doing this on numerous occasions. She agreed she had been as she has an aggressive form of cancer and has less than 6 months. The police just left. No apology or anything.
It is really interesting to me that the people who are facing present danger to their health seem more relaxed about the risk of the virus. I think as a society we have become too used to very little risk to health because ‘science will fix everything’ that we panic when a small risk occurs.

@BeijingBikini

I am also of the assumption that if you're out shopping in Primark, you're not that bothered, so I don't worry about infecting people no. If you're terrified about being infected and dying then you should be indoors, not telling everyone else to stay indoors for you (and sacrifice their livelihoods/mental health) - that's quite selfish and entitled.

👏👏👏

I am also of the assumption that if you're out shopping in Primark, you're not that bothered, so I don't worry about infecting people no. If you're terrified about being infected and dying then you should be indoors, not telling everyone else to stay indoors for you (and sacrifice their livelihoods/mental health) - that's quite selfish and entitled.

I am not sure I understand your perspective @BeijingBikini. Are you saying that basically people are either terrified and should stay in, quit work etc...or they should go out with no precautions and not care at all about either their personal risk of getting ill or the risk to everyone of a exponential rise and all the economic, social and health disasters that entails?

That would seem a very distorted perspective and one that can never be realised in any practical sense as it does not reflect reality or any practical way forward. On this thread as we see ad nauseum on MN, a false opposition is created between people who want to act as if the virus has never existed and take no precautions, and argue as if there is an opposing group who want total indefinite lockdown. Perhaps there is such a group. But neither of those attitudes will ever be govt policy or ever be realised. Not only that but the vast majority of people don't take these sides, they recognise that we need to ease restrictions as we can but that we need to take precautions.

In fact Beijing the quickest way to not get back to normal is to say to people, right it's a free for all out there....if you out it's at your own risk and no one will be distancing etc. Many people who are right now shopping and working, sending kids who can go back to school etc will not continue to do so, and those who are out there will be busy brewing up another peak.

So I am thinking that I must have you wrong.

If people are still scared of getting the virus when it is estimated that only 1 in 1700 people have it then what figure would it take for them to not be scared?

I think you’re missing the point. Personally I’m not scared of Covid... but I am concerned that people don’t understand that it won’t stay at 1 in 1,700 if we simply ignore all social distancing and go back completely to life as it was before, and that cases will increase exponentially again until we’re back where we were in March by September, and that would be an unmitigated disaster!

We should relax lockdown and we can’t live in bubbles for ever, and need to open up....but it’s not all or nothing. Some people only seem to be able to think in binary terms. Gradually increase social mixing, whilst coming down hard on infection clusters as they occur and refraining from crowded super-spreading scenarios is reasonable at this point.

In fact Beijing the quickest way to not get back to normal is to say to people, right it's a free for all out there....if you out it's at your own risk and no one will be distancing etc. Many people who are right now shopping and working, sending kids who can go back to school etc will not continue to do so, and those who are out there will be busy brewing up another peak.

This... I long for things to return to normal... but pretending we’ve defeated Covid and allowing things to get completely back to normal would be the worst possible thing we could do to achieve this. Look at Arizona...

I agree. A lot of 'selfish and entitled' attitudes about. There will always be people at higher risk than others for infectious diseases. That doesn't give them the right to demand that others put their lives on hold for them. The worst thing is that the same people here are lecturing others about being 'selfish' and not caring about 'society'.*

I feel like I am wading through thick, shoulder deep irony here. i guess you do too.

But you know, don't put yourselves out. I know Beijing has very very kindly sacrificed coughing on other people, but please don't step into the road or make the effort to keep your hands as clean as possible. Why should you? Everyone else can just quit their jobs and stay inside!

Yes. And never really was. Bloody expensive phoney war.

According to my sister it is done. She had a party this weekend. She's a selfish moron.

I’m a front line worker and I’m done with the guidelines. They’re a total farce, in work we socially distance in the tearoom, maximum of 12 people in there at any one time, we had a specific changing room for getting into scrubs, maximum of 3 people in that room. Yeah 20 minutes prior to shift we’re all in the same changing room downstairs, no room to socially distance, mingling with staff from all over the hospital.

In my unit you wear full PPE in your room, doors closed at all times. If someone comes into your room they just put on a plastic pinny and can walk in and out your room and other rooms as needed. We have no Covid in the entire hospital. All patients are screened in pre assessment or on admission and repeat screened every 4 days.

I’m just done. Our department didn’t have much in the way of Covid patients, we trained nurses from various wards and in the end they were sent to other wards. We were massively over staffed, hardly any patients. Now those staff are back in their own wards and we’re busier than ever, struggling through the masses of patients who had surgery cancelled or had their regular clinic appointments cancels and who are now so much sicker, requiring more intensive care.

I’m just done now, exhausted, utterly exhausted. I can’t go to my mums house for a cup of tea but I can literally stand shoulder to shoulder with my colleagues for 12 hours.

telling everyone else to stay indoors for you (and sacrifice their livelihoods/mental health)

...Is pretty much what you are proposing.

Some people only seem to be able to think in binary terms.

Thank you Derby! That is what I having been trying to say but didn't know how.

I have been so strict till now, not seen parents since February and not seen anyone. Barely been to shops. This weekend I had a Chinese in my friends garden. I feel so much better for it. We sat a part so yes a small risk but i honest to God feel so much happier now.

Friends in hospital management are bracing for a rise in case in July.

No I cannot go to work in the office, kids cannot go to school and I cannot stay overnight with my parents. Def feels like lock down to me surprised there are people who feel it is over but then people’s life before this was different I guess!

Is my life normal?
No school
No volunteering
No group hobbies/ sports
DH still working from home indefinitely so no time alòne
No swimming/ leisure centres/ libraries/ museums etc
Family/ friends not avaliable due to distance, busyness/ 2 adults + 2 children x 2 = too many and they are sticklers for the rules.

Apart from a few odd moments and driving to a wider range of parks, my life is not substantially different now to 13 weeks ago. My family is young, healthy and of no added risk factors. It's a heck of a lifestyle, social and educational cost for an illness of currently low community transmission, that is statistically highly unlikely to kill us or make us seriously ill, and a moderate chance of being mildly ill or not even symptomatic.

I have in tears, ended up on a friend's sofa because I was desperate after 12 weeks of lonliness and lack of purpose. It was pissing down with rain, so not the night to be sitting out getting cold and drenched. We've all barely left the house and have minimal contamination risk. That evening and a couple of illicit hugs went a very long way to lift me out of about 10 days of depressed mood. I'm not brilliant but have stopped the random tears.

My children have sacrificed an appropriate education and social life for 3 months with over 2 to go. I'm no longer overlooking any accessible play equipment when on yet another walk

Is it over? No. It's not going to be over for a number of months. Normality will resume whatever happens to this virus because the social and economic costs are too high to suspend life indefinitely. The virus itself may never be over, like flu or measles or TB...

I accept some concessions continuing to avoid triggering exponential rises- but not the indefinite sacrifice of my entire framework of life. We are not in the same position as March. Treatments and understanding of this illness are improving. There are tentative promising studies and observations about the illness becoming milder, and social resistance.

It is unjustifiable to be socially isolated for ever.

I look forwards to taking the DCs on a pub garden crawl during a school day as a variation of yet another bloody walk. There must be some kind of irony there...

I have been so strict till now, not seen parents since February and not seen anyone. Barely been to shops. This weekend I had a Chinese in my friends garden. I feel so much better for it. We sat a part so yes a small risk but i honest to God feel so much happier now.

That's great @Scruffyoak. I am so pleased people are starting to get some relief. Many takeaways enjoyed in gardens this weekend! Also so pleased to bump into ( not literally) my shielding friend out for a walk with another friend...and next week she is planning a garden takeaway with a friend too.

I believe in democracy. If you want to go out and are willing to risk infection - go for it. If you are scared of the virus - don't. We have to preserve human rights and freedoms, the mental health and economic future of our young people. Lockdown was to bolster NHS capacity and buy the government time, why the hell is it now 3 months later with the aim of eradication? I think we should go back to normal, with extra hygiene measures and distancing in public, but seeing as the main spread has always been in hospitals and care homes, it's insane to keep everyone locked up and businesses shut down. It will absolutely cause more deaths in the next 10 years.

@Qasd

No I cannot go to work in the office, kids cannot go to school and I cannot stay overnight with my parents. Def feels like lock down to me surprised there are people who feel it is over but then people’s life before this was different I guess!

It depends what job you do. I’m assuming you both are WFM if they are no overnight stays for your kids. It’s obviously a bit different for some people who cannot WFM and have the school run/play schemes to go to still.

@TheGreatWave

My colleague said they saw 13 a day last week and one senior oncologist said it will take years and lots of deaths to get out of this backlog.

Not covid: Doesn't matter.

I don't mean to be flippant with that, but unless it is covid it is currently having to take a back seat. People forget that getting back to normal includes those of us working with other sections and if we don't things will get a whole lot worse.

It absolutely breaks me that we are failing huge numbers of people at present.

I couldn't agree more.

@Boudicabooandbulldogs

That poor lady. I don't blame her for having her family round throughout with a life limiting condition.

@April241

I totally agree with you. Thank you for working so hard and I get that you are done and need to see family. This seems so wrong "I can’t go to my mums house for a cup of tea but I can literally stand shoulder to shoulder with my colleagues for 12 hours."

I wouldn't blame anyone who visits their family for a cup of tea. I know friends that do and today I visited by father on Father's Day and had a cup of tea in his sitting room.

i’ve been shielding since March. i think i’m done with it. there has been absolutely no guidance on how long i’m supposed to spend indoors with just my cat for company. i have mental health problems and i’m at the end of my tether.

i’m now in a bubble with a friend and her family. they have all just had a negative covid test, so this weekend they came to my house to help me move some furniture. i went to a shop. i wore a mask and used hand gel, but i went out of these four bloody walls and i feel like i’ve been on holiday.

once the notability scheme reopens on 01 July i’ll be test driving and ordering a car so i can go and collect my own weekly medication. my friend has been doing this since march for me - is it just supposed to go on forever?

i’m waiting for 2 operations, with no clue when they might happen. i haven’t been able to go for vital blood tests as i haven’t had my own transport and the GP surgery wouldn’t send the district nurse to me. so my arthritis is flaring like a bastard, i’m in so much pain and i cannot do this any more.

so i will take all precautions, and i’m not suddenly going to the seaside or to visit all my friends. but i can’t stay indoors forever. what are my options? nobody seems to know so i have to start making my own decisions.

of course the virus hasn’t gone away. but i have to weigh up the risks and benefits of staying indoors indefinitely and ending up sectioned, or relaxing slightly and being able to cope.

onwards!

*Motability scheme, even.

Sadly, we are not a very communitarian minded nation right now, so people will do what they want. My bet is another lockdown in September-November
This is my worry. By September it will be 6 months my son hasn't been able to go to school and I worry it will be even longer.