Every child in every year group will return to school in September, Education Secretary Gavin Williamson has said.

[itswhereitsat]

I didn't catch the briefing but read the above comment in the news. The big question is, did he say whether children returning would be part-time or full time? Or did he just gloss over that bit?

@Appuskidu - up to 30 for 12 hours a day. Patients from other wards for periods of up to an hour.

@easterbuns I think an awful lot of posters on MN (not in real life!) seem to be saying exactly that about schools. Go back as normal and tough. I think the sensible posters on here are saying that isn’t possible and adjustments need to be made and trying to make suggestions.

With your idea just some questions - how do we account for option choices at secondary? If we are staggering start and finish times does that mean pupils are in school less time? If not and all full time where will the extra teachers come from? Which subjects do students lose time in if not full time as before? Do we provide some kind of blended learning to compensate? How do we manage lunch/canteens? At my school with 2m SD we’d need approx 40 sittings to get all pupils fed, this might reduce if the distance goes down. At the moment my school is trying to roughly plan for all sorts of scenarios, but at the same time they can’t waste time on something that isn’t going to be allowed. As soon as any guidance is released then schools can plan and once we’ve planned then parents and students know where they stand and can equally plan.

IMO what we really need is robust and routine testing of staff and students and a robust test, track and trace scheme in place. If BOTH of those were in place and worked properly I think schools could probably return much more to normal as long as people are aware there would the localised shutdowns when outbreaks occur.

I won’t have time to wipe down desks, sides etc between lessons!

By the time I’ve got one lot out, sorted any fights on the corridors the next lot are coming in!

What a ridiculous suggestion!

EasterBuns - how does A-level teaching work in your model?

A-level is easier in some ways (and in some contexts) - fewer subjects, smaller classes, more able to understand social distancing.

The bubble doesn’t work though, obviously.

How close are we to same day testing? The thought of my y10 dd going back and having a little shit in her form group be “symptomatic” Forcing the group to go home and isolate for god knows how long and wrecking her education even more

The other issue with teachers moving instead of students is it is generally not a good idea to have students unsupervised in classrooms (particularly rooms like science labs which have extra dangers that can't be removed as they are fixtures). In a large secondary school it can take 5 minutes to get across the school which is a long time for students to be left. With some classes you could quite easily turn up and discover they have flooded the room, unplugged the computer system, started a fight...

But I’m guessing you’ve already changed your behaviour policy so they’ll know the ramifications of that sort of behaviour will be nothing like pre March

How do teachers expect their zero tolerance policies to pan out realistically?

@Mostpeculiar

How close are we to same day testing? The thought of my y10 dd going back and having a little shit in her form group be “symptomatic” Forcing the group to go home and isolate for god knows how long and wrecking her education even more

Current guidelines are the bubble only isolate after a positive test, not just for symptoms. This is good in being less of an issue for education disruption, not so good if they then test positive as there will be more chance that it spread. Currently tests are aiming for 48 hours, so if someone developed symptoms on Monday, they would have their result and be able to return on Wednesday or Thursday if it was negative.

The problem here is with no adult in the room how do you prove who did it. Or do you punish the whole class? Very few students would flood the room with a teacher in the room due to the sound it makes, they'd get caught - if you weren't there how do you prove it was them...

@Flagsfiend

The problem here is with no adult in the room how do you prove who did it. Or do you punish the whole class? Very few students would flood the room with a teacher in the room due to the sound it makes, they'd get caught - if you weren't there how do you prove it was them...

Lol you don’t get a more realistic example of how a behaviour policy would work in Covid times than this,

The other issue with teachers moving instead of students is it is generally not a good idea to have students unsupervised in classrooms

I completely agree. Who would be liable for anything that happened to any pupil or equipment during those unsupervised crossover times? I can remember some secondary students I was at school with who would been in their element plotting what chaos they were going to enact in the classroom when there was no adult present, just to liven things up a bit!

Rainbow did it say when he wants to do it?

Sorry some of you teach in schools where classes cant be left unattended for 10 minutes. Not a problem in all (I would hope most) secondaries.

But expanding to a 'bubble of 30' only works for some.

Due to funding cuts we regularly have KS2 classes of between 36-39.
What happens to the overspill? ( government have already said no extra funding for supply cover, and no space.
Lunchtimes will be difficult and require catering staff working longer hours.
EY, part time places, children at a mix of providers, children not in everyday, an FS unit can have 120 children on roll.

But expanding to a 'bubble of 30' only works for some

It won’t be a ‘magic’ number of 30-it’ll just be the normal legal class size for the key stage, I would imagine.

classes cant be left unattended for 10 minutes

Erm, we're not allowed to do that.

Sorry some of you teach in schools where classes cant be left unattended for 10 minutes. Not a problem in all (I would hope most) secondaries

Wtf

@Porcupineinwaiting

Sorry some of you teach in schools where classes cant be left unattended for 10 minutes. Not a problem in all (I would hope most) secondaries.

I was a very good student in school in top sets, we were occasionally left on our own and we did things we shouldn't have done. In y11 top set maths we changed all the clocks so we'd get lunch 10 minutes early (this involved climbing on desks), most of us went onto study A-level so it wasn't that we disliked maths, we just wanted to see what we'd get away with (it worked!)

I regularly have to stop students doing ridiculous things when I am in the room, there is no way I would leave them unattended for 5 minutes. Teenagers do things without thinking even if they are not being malicious. Some students also do things that they know are wrong deliberately.

@Porcupineinwaiting

Sorry some of you teach in schools where classes cant be left unattended for 10 minutes. Not a problem in all (I would hope most) secondaries.

What do you mean leave them alone in a classroom? We are literally not allowed to do that, and I've never worked in a school were I was allowed to. Granted, I teach Science, but kids can't be in a room without a teacher full stop. Now add to the fact that it would result in carnage in my school, how do you suggest I socially distance and break up a fight at hte same time? Some of my Y10 are over 6ft so I need to be right there to break up a fight.

Ok, so not 'bubble of 30'.

So BJ/GW said 30 but they didn't mean 30...they meant more than 30....

Suggesting classes of children across the country will be ‘fine’ being along for periods of time at the start/end of every single lesson (and feeling sorry for people that work in the ‘type’ of schools where you think that might be a problem) is one massive reason why people who actually work in schools need to be be involved in making decisions about HOW we reopen!