Places actively discouraging children

[Allhallowseve]

Just wondering what other people opinions of this are?
I follow a few local garden centres as we visit quite regularly under normal circumstances. Since they have reopened they are advertising as being open but asking people not to bring children.
I am just finding the way children have been treated throughout this pandemic absolutely awful .... I don't know if it's just me?
Yes I know things could be far worse for them and people are shielding not able to really get out. But garden centres actively discouraging children from visiting?!
Adults are able to meet up in outdoor areas yet it's incredibly hard for children to do the same. Adults can pop out to shops now , grab a coffee maybe do a couple of things they enjoy . However the play parks are padlocked and taped up . Most school year groups are not going back until September , all playgroups , clubs and classes are cancelled. Yet they are the least vulnerable group in society and seem to have been forgotten.

There are many many children living through far worse than this every day all around the world and their situations won't improve

How is this relevant? It’s not some kind of race to the bottom.

There is plenty online about concerns to children and their mental health on a long term basis, you can take a look I’m sure instead of just snarking at kids and parents.

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My parents were kids in the 1950s and 60s and I’m pretty sure they’ve never told me about a time they were banned from seeing and socialising freely with friends, had their education stopped and weren’t allowed in shops.

My parents were children in London during the war. They've told me plenty of stories about what they saw and experienced that makes twelve weeks at home seem like a holiday camp.

Nights in tube stations as air raid shelters, having your home, and neighbours, obliterated in a bombing raid, being evacuated, family members getting killed overseas. I think if they managed to get through that then children today will get through not being able to the garden centre or going to the playground.

The shielded and elderly are at least at risk of the virus so know (assuming capacity) that they are at risk so it’s in their interests to stay at home.

Children are at the lowest risk and still have to be stuck away.

Time to stop the bullshit, recognise that whatever crap and fear the government and the media try to stir up that this illness is only a serious threat to the old and clinically vulnerable, shield them and let everyone else get back to normal and everything open. This has gone on long enough and most people not at serious risk have more than done their bit.

It’s not an ideal situation but for the sake of the economy and the well-being of the majority it’s got to be better than everyone being locked up.

It’s relevant because some parents’ attitudes are completely disproportionate to what children are experiencing for a matter of weeks. It’s nothing to do with a “race to the bottom” and everything to do with getting a bit of perspective.

Most children are with their families in their homes, well fed, increasingly able to go to school, with devices, TVs and, in most cases, more toys than they know how to play with. They’re considerably better off than most kids in earlier generations were for the whole of their childhoods.

And here was me thinking we’d moved on since the days of the blitz in how we treat our children in society.

You can ignore what experts say including the children’s commissioners who have raised concerns that children’s human rights are being breached and make out you know better or waffle on about the past if you like , you’re still wrong.

There is plenty online about concerns to children and their mental health on a long term basis, you can take a look I’m sure instead of just snarking at kids and parents.

I'm not snarking. I'm looking after my own children, one of which has SEN and I'm now unemployed.

A global pandemic isn't fun for anyone and it has been and still will be hard for many. However, the level of wailing about the children and their mental health baffles me. Most children I know have been just fine at home. They've taken the changes and restrictions in their stride and are a lot stronger than some people give them credit for.

They’re considerably better off than most kids in earlier generations were for the whole of their childhoods.

What utter rot

@Teateaandmoretea

They’re considerably better off than most kids in earlier generations were for the whole of their childhoods.

What utter rot

Really? Care to elucidate?

YABU. Children are infection carriers (bless them) and garden centres are full of older people. By the way, parks are open, it's just playgrounds that are closed! Take a ball or kite with you.

@SudokuBook

And here was me thinking we’d moved on since the days of the blitz in how we treat our children in society.

You can ignore what experts say including the children’s commissioners who have raised concerns that children’s human rights are being breached and make out you know better or waffle on about the past if you like , you’re still wrong.

Children live through their parents. They take their cues from us. If we make something fun or an adventure then that's how they experience it. If you are playing with your child they're not going to be sat mourning the fact they can't visit the garden centre are they?

When I was little we used to go camping for our holidays with my godparents. My godfather had such a fantastic imagination. No one had much money so entertainment had to be free - usually long walks. Every single walk we went on was an adventure. One time, somehow, he hid his socks in trees so as we turned a corner we saw a sock "growing" in a tree. For the next hour or so he had us all convinced that there were such things as sock trees and we had to look out for them, there was a whole story about how they grow, how they came to be (obviously involved magic and fairies etc). Another time he told us a story about ferns and how they are actually pork pie trees, we hunted for pirates, we were marooned on a desert island - all sorts. In reality we were just walking around fairly dull places just to while away time without spending money. To us kids they were the best times of our lives. I still look back today and consider those holidays as the best that I've ever been on.

The point being kids can have fun anywhere. It just needs a little imagination.

If you are playing with your child they're not going to be sat mourning the fact they can't visit the garden centre are they?

They can actually, in general. It is some that are being ridiculous.

YABU. Children are infection carriers (bless them) and garden centres are full of older people.

No evidence of this and one age group don't have more rights than another

We do all those things with our kids too, as soon as we can we’re taking them camping.

I find your dismissal of the potential for mental health problems in some young people ignorant and offensive. Not all of course and most will be fine, but some won’t be. And not because they’re snowflakes or not resilient, or their parents are mollycoddling them, but because mental health illnesses are actually real things and like other people in the population children can get them.

@alsohuman, I was a kid in the 60s and I can assure you my life was nothing like this. I went to school. I played out with other kids, we'd hang round cricket matches hoping to cadge a bit of cake. There were football clubs, scouts and guides and church youth groups. We would disappear for the day on our bikes with a picnic. There were Sunday School trips , visits to the library, food shopping trips with mum. In the summer there was a great play scheme with free swimming, cheap cinema, drama workshops, sports etc. And I was a very ordinary kid from a working class background living in a village. So how is what kids are currently experiencing remotely like that?

They can actually, in general. It is some that are being ridiculous
It's not ridiculous for local businesses affected by lockdown to be limiting customers and having social distancing. From that, it's not ridiculous for those businesses to want 4 paying customers to be coming through the doors instead of a family of 4 who decided their two children needed a change of scenery.

I highly doubt people running local businesses are thinking 'my business could fold, that will put several people out of work, ahh don't worry though, paying customers should wait whilst the Jones Family have their little family outing. It doesn't bother me one bit if several people who were about to shop her leave. The most important thing is that the Jones children get to wander around my garden centre instead of the whole local area available to them'.

In which case, wouldn’t “one customer per household please” be a more effective rule than “no children”?

@SudokuBook conversely there will also be a number of children whose mental health will have improved in this time eg children who normally struggle with school, who are now able to relax at home and do their studies there.

one age group don't have more rights than another

It seems they do. MN was hysterical a few weeks ago because over 70s wouldn’t do as they were told and stay at home. Nobody gave a shit about their lives.

Your childhood was very unusual in the 60s @countrygirl99. None of my contemporaries - born early 50s - had a childhood anything like the one you describe.

No evidence of this and one age group don't have more rights than another

No one has a right to go into a shop though. They are private businesses and they can choose who goes in. At the moment they are choosing to maximize the number of paying customers. If numbers are limited it makes sense for them to choose 100 paying customers rather than 33 paying customers, accompanied by children.

but because mental health illnesses are actually real things and like other people in the population children can get them

Posters aren't taking about children with mental health illnesses though are they? They are talking about children who are bored, or toddlers that they want to take out somewhere. My post was aimed at the people saying the kids were fed up going on walks or going to the park again - we would have been bored walking every day for two weeks on holiday but it was the adults who made it not boring by firing our imagination.

In which case, wouldn’t “one customer per household please” be a more effective rule than “no children”?

That's what supermarkets in my area said - cue outrage because children weren't allowed in. Basically, it's saying the same thing.

"MN was hysterical a few weeks ago because over 70s wouldn’t do as they were told and stay at home"

To be fair, the over 70s weren't told to stay at home - there are no age groups on the shield list. They were OK to go out for their daily exercise and go to shops just like everyone else.

I agree that some people were ageist in trying to impose stricter restrictions, but I thought that came from ignorance of who the shielded really are. Because now that is better known, those awful threads seem to have vanished

There's not denying children have had/are still having a hard time.

But this thread is coming off as entitled parents with no apparent desire to actually understand why businesses are asking for no children.

If you care about your childrens future then you need this country's economy to get back on it's feet as quickly as possilble. That means non essential businesses opening to adults - the ones with the spending power. When numbers are limited they want adults through the door making their purchases reasonably quickly and leaving so the next person can come in and spend.

They aren't open to be childrens entertainment, or a nice day out, or for something different for the children to do. They aren't there to give you your free fucking coffee you're owed (are you serious right now?), or so that your husband can take the kids and give you a break (he can do that by taking them to a park, or actually just taking control of them in your own house while you have a break).

These businesses are desperate to stop going under, to save jobs and businesses, so that in the future your children will still have shops to visit and businesses to work for.

I do think it sucks for lone parents who can't then take advantage of these non essential shops, but for now, for the greater good, that's how it is.

No one has a right to go into a shop though. They are private businesses and they can choose who goes in. At the moment they are choosing to maximize the number of paying customers. If numbers are limited it makes sense for them to choose 100 paying customers rather than 33 paying customers, accompanied by children.

So where are all these garden centres with enormous queues to go in?

I wouldn’t have bothered going without dd we bought some stuff so we could plant it together, so she is a paying customer.

And actually you are wrong re rights the equality act stops shops from excluding some customers.

@alsohuman I'm sorry that you and your friends must have had such boring childhoods but my life was very ordinary and not at all unusual. Only the very few kids with very uptight (can only think of 1 family at primary whose family were in some wierd sect) parents or severe health issues (again only 1 kid at ordinary with post measles brain damage) had a different life where I come from.

@Teateaandmoretea did your daughter pay separately to you, and not just pocket money type purchases. Shops want as many adults from different households in so they can maximise their income. Garden centres have evolved over time to make them more than just a place to buy plants to encourage families in normal times, so cafes, play areas etc. However, these are not normal times, they are restricted to how many people can come in, many of them were shut for weeks. They need to shift as much stock as they can, a couple of packet of seeds paid out of a child's pocket money is not going to cut it. The cafes, play areas are shut/off limits at the moment, so they are not the family fun places they used to be. In a day with social distancing in place they may only be able to have half the number of households they used to have come in. If people take their children (or partner) this will restrict the number of households who can come in even more. Why can't people understand this?

So where are all these garden centres with enormous queues to go in?

I don't know - all of the shops here have had queues to go in. B and Q here has had queues throughout, our local garden centre has had a queue every day. I suppose it depends where you are and it's an individual decision isn't it? If a centre feels it can be Covid safe and admit children and is either not busy or isn't bothered if other customers queue then they'll let children in - there isn't a law against it.

I wouldn’t have bothered going without dd we bought some stuff so we could plant it together, so she is a paying customer.

I wouldn’t have bothered going without dd we bought some stuff so we could plant it together, so she is a paying customer.

But you and your DD were one transaction, despite taking two spaces. They could have got two paying customers in in place of you and your DD.