My cynical view on why they are making sure they open primary schools ASAP

[DebbieFiderer]

It's simple really - if they get primary school pupils back before the end of the summer term then it is business as usual in terms of childcare and they don't have to keep schools open over the summer holidays for keyworker children. Anyone else think I am right, or am I being overly cynical and they genuinely think it's the right thing to do for the kids?

Please please please can those parents saying their DC's schools are doing little/nothing SPEAK to the school! You might feel that your complaint will make little difference, but I seriously doubt you'd be the only one.

DH and I are both teachers. I work at an independent secondary school and am teaching my full timetable and doing many of my other duties - I've just got off the phone from doing some careers?advice for one of my pupils, and am killing 5 mins on mumsnet before the next one is scheduled. My school has instructed me to run as normal (but with lots of leeway for some kids that can't complete work right now). My DH has been given no support and no instructions from his (state) school, and they don't have a platform for online learning. It would clearly not be appropriate for him to just start contacting his students unless that was school policy. So SPEAK TO YOUR KID'S SCHOOL! There is a vast difference between what different schools are doing, and teachers will only do what they are told to, because to do otherwise risks putting you on the wrong side of safeguarding policy.

It would also be useful for me to get feedback from parents about what they want. Some parents want more work (to keep their quite motivated kids occupied and educated), some want less because their darling teenagers are..... teenagers. Working parents don't always have the time or energy to battle recalcitrant kids. But I don't know which families fall into which category without them speaking to me.

Personally, I hope my DD (3yo) will be able to see her preschool class before the summer starts. The risk to young children is low, and she misses her classmates terribly. Her class has a teacher who I suspect will shield, but 3 younger TAs, so I hope they will be able to offer some provision.

Regarding second/subsequent waves - we surely won't know when we are approaching herd immunity (yes, I know there's no absolute proof that people become immune, but let's assume that's this virus is similar to most others and that infection means you are less likely to contract it again) unless/until we have wide-scale antibody testing. It's not likely we'll have this for some time, so let's consider both options:
We ARE approaching herd immunity: logically, it would be best to have any second wave during the summer months - lower viral load (UV light, fresh air), fewer other viruses for the NHS to combat. So schools should trial reopening.
We AREN'T approaching herd immunity: then there will be several more waves and will need to have quite strict social distancing for really quite a long time. In which case, do people really want schools to stay closed for another year or more? Is that in the interests of children?

I can't help thinking that if all these parents were a bit more used to spend time with their children, things wouldn't come as such a shock and they would manage a lot better than just rejecting the idea.

@foggybits

Businesses taking the biggest hit will be those in the most affected industries. You could have all the parents who work in hospitality & aviation back in work tmw, they will still be facing potential redundancies

I don't know whether you are deliberately constructing a straw man or whether you are missing the point I am making. I have earlier stated that multiple industries are facing an existential threat because of a collapse in demand. This has been caused because of lockdown. If people do not return to work, return to patronising local businesses, there will be bankruptcies.

One of the industries facing an existential threat is the 'hospitality' sector. Presumably the government is planning some kind of resumption of restaurants, bars, etc, but it is very hard to see how the previous paradigm is compatible with social distancing. Many businesses will fail. The entire tourism sector, which is a key industry in Club Med, is facing an existential threat. Ditto airlines. There is a glut of supply and no storage, from oil to tulips. I can't predict what will happen in the UK, but one thing is crystal clear. If the current situation continues, the carnage in the economy may dwarf the carnage caused by Covid. Children returning to school is a symbolic as well as practical policy

I can't help thinking that if all these parents were a bit more used to spend time with their children, things wouldn't come as such a shock and they would manage a lot better than just rejecting the idea.

Ffs

It’s the ‘doing a full time job on top of looking after children’ that’s the problem.

My children need proper care. My work needs proper focus. Not being a superhuman, I can’t do both.

It would also be useful for me to get feedback from parents about what they want.

my very personal feedback is that I would like LESS of set work and MORE self projects. There are enough resources to occupy those who need very structured work everywhere, but I personally find it easier to let mine do their own research and present them in their chosen form when they chose the subjects they are interested in. General knowledge is never wasted anyway.

That applies to any age group btw.

My children need proper care. My work needs proper focus. Not being a superhuman, I can’t do both.

none of us can, you just alternate depending on your work requirement. Some have to work 9 to 5 or 6 Monday to Friday, others have more flexible hours.

I would do a lot less if I was stuck in hospital for me, or one of my kids.

Teachers are in exactly the same position of needing to care for their children and do their work as well.

plus teachers also have to do shifts at schools to care for other keyworker children..

Tell you what, you all crouch in a foxhole while the rest of us put the economy back together. You can all crawl out in 12 months when its safe!

Teachers are in exactly the same position of needing to care for their children and do their work as well.

Yes, but some aren’t doing very much (my sons teacher posts 1 work sheet and one video a week).

Now I know many are doing a lot more, but there are zero consequences for my sons teacher. She’s on full pay for her minimal efforts. Yes I’ve emailed, got a few platitudes, nothing more.

My sector is fighting for its life and I’d be gone so quick if I dropped the ball like that.

Comments like "people need to look after their own kids" - threads like this are really making me reassess my former good opinions of teachers.

Wanting to send kids back to school is about education and social needs not childcare for the most part - I'm worried sick how far behind mine will fall on their one crap worksheet a week each for English and maths and no virtual engagement of any kind.

I'm working 9 hours days at home desperately trying to keep my job, and whilst I do what I can I cannot teach them to the level they need to be.

BillywilliamV

you do realise that most of us are working don't you?

People currently at loss with their children because they never had to entertain them or spend any time with them are the ones struggling and complaining the most though. It must be a shock I give you that.

Comments like "people need to look after their own kids" - threads like this are really making me reassess my former good opinions of teachers.

why?

Who said it was teachers with that opinion? I am not a teacher for a start.

@bovaryx

Your earlier points said they below

And they can't grasp that no country can bankroll its citizens to stay at home for the next X months or years until a vaccine is developed.

People need to return to work which means primary school children, the demographic least affected by the virus need to return to school.

These are the points I challenged & then you started talking about symbolic etc etc.

Oh well looks like furloughing is not ending any time soon after the latest update.

My sector is fighting for its life and I’d be gone so quick if I dropped the ball like that

@LaurieMarlow

You just highlighted the chasm between the private sector and the public sector in the UK. Stuff in the state sector that is greeted with fawning applause would result in a disciplinary and fired in a multinational. My bet for Scene Two? Strikes and refusal to return to work. If the economy is not on its knees by 2021? It will be a miracle.

Maybe children are going back gradually because that is what is best for the children?

Just a thought.

Oh well looks like furloughing is not ending any time soon after the latest update

Oh well @foggybits, by the time you've actually grasped the true cost of furlough? It will be too late.

Tell you what, you all crouch in a foxhole while the rest of us put the economy back together. You can all crawl out in 12 months when its safe!

I don't understand why debating about schools returning equals not working & wanting to hide forever.

I work p/t 14 hours so it's not hard for me to catch up. DH still doing 8 hour days & overtime when needed & performing as before. Both private sector, both told to wfh till the autumn, 1 higher rate tax payer (I would be if f/t). Still paying a childminder a retainer.

On a separate point, I do find schoolwork hard as we have quite a lot.

@BovaryX take it up with the government I'm not a civil servant & not involved with policy.

Why do you think the government has extended it?

I'm well aware we are in for a great deal of economic pain.

Maybe children are going back gradually because that is what is best for the children?

in small groups, with distancing, not allowed to go near their friends, none of the activities and fun stuff that are part of a normal school day? I doubt it.

People currently at loss with their children because they never had to entertain them or spend any time with them are the ones struggling and complaining the most though

Okay, so this afternoon DH has back to back presentations. Out of action for childcare.

I have a 2 hour meeting.

I have to hope that my 2 year old and 6 year old will sit in front of tv for that period. They won’t, but that’s the best case scenario.

I’d love to know how ‘spending more time’ with my children previously would help me handle this situation better. Can’t wait for your suggestions on the topic.

@foggybits

I am not in the UK. The attitude towards lockdown and its economic effects does not bode well for its ability to recover from this crisis.

So why do you think it's been extended?

one I've seen plenty of vitriol from actual teachers on here in that vein.

And that it what I am basing my opinion on, that and some (note SOME) of the teachers who I know who are doing the bare minimum and actively fighting a return to work because the bottom line is they are enjoying an extended holiday. What you could absolutely not get away with in the private sector. But no it's all about parents who can't be bothered to look after their own kids

LaurieMarlow
I don't know your kids, that's the point.

I only know that when I need mine to be quiet for a couple of hours in front of a movie - which a 2 year old just won't, I am not sitting on MN at lunch time but I am trying to tired them out outside. The way I do when we go for a long haul flight.

Now I am sure there are a million reasons why that won't work for yours, but I know how I have to handle mine.

Plus I didn't accuse YOU of being one of these parents always moaning that the weekends, let alone the holidays, are too long. Just pointed to the hundred of threads we have about it.