For those who want schools to go back..

[pfrench]

.. tell us how you think it should work. Primary or secondary.

In your ideal world.

How would social distancing be adhered to?
How about drop off and pick up?
How would classrooms operate?
How about lunchtimes and breaktimes?
What about after school childcare provision?
What about staff who are sheidling?
What about children who are sheilding?
What about staff who have family members who are sheilding?
Should only some children go back? Who should they be and why?

So many education and school experts on here, it will be interesting to read your safe solutions.

It’s really, really simple.
Open up the schools next month. Increased hand washing. Require that all children are temperature checked before they come in - anyone with high temperature or cough stays off and isolates. Any parent who doesn’t adhere is fined.
Reduced class sizes is pointless because children won’t maintain 1m apart anyway. Besides the developmental damage that would cause is not something we want in our future generation.

Those parents who are still fearfulً, and those who genuinely have a reason to fear - the shielding group - can... wait... home school!!! For as long as they like! No government intervention necessary. You can in fact choose to home school your child for any reason, not just coronavirus!

So that’s my solution. Open up the schools so that those who need to can go back to work and their children get an education (and society avoids a severe economic depression) and those who are not happy with that can home school their kids.

I dont think its really simple.

To all intents and purposes impossible to socially distance in a school. Hell even thinking about handing out books and worksheets etc is difficult.

to minimise transmission there needs to be effective testing or track and trace

most schools due to safeguarding have only 1 entrance and it will take quite a while to temperature check every child.

id estimate there are about 25 to 30 sinks for 900 pupils. We would go on and on about washing hands for long enough but realistically few would have.

even before lockdown when people were told to self isolate you had parents keep people home but you also had kids coming in to school with persistent coughs or where other family members had temperature or persistent coughs.

I will go back when asked to but lets not pretend the risks of transmission are easily controlled; people would not be minmising these "simple" challenges if the effect on the children were so small. I myself have asthma and middle aged and carrying a few stone more than i should - will i survive an infection? used to think so now not so sure.

I agree with you for the most of that @Winterrain30

Winterrain30
Can you give supporting evidence for getting schools fully open, because I would love that. I hate working the way I do.
Or is this just what you, what I, what most people want to happen?

To the poster who said that parents would keep off a poorly childnor we should temperature check them, I had several children in the last week that we were open who became unwell during the morning and then happily told me that they had been given calpol before coming to school as they had had a temperature before school and one who told me how tired she was as her brother had kept her awake all night coughing. and no,not all of the mums were working either.

news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-no-more-pupils-until-track-and-trace-goes-national-school-unions-insist-11985520

Looks like it could be a while before schools reopen

@Parrotsandpussies I’m sorry I don’t mean to sound cruel. Put there’s other things in the world that you can get from a child other thean COVID! Even if a vax is produced it doesn’t mean teachers have a guarantee of not getting COVID!
Teachers are being quite unfair as other job sectors are having to go to work feeling anxious.
I hope by September the GOV give you a choice to teach or resign!!
As I think it’s unfair to say the least.

@scunnymum so in around 5 months time.... the company you work for are they going to be providing MORE staff so you can SD???

I don’t think many employers are going to pay out for extra staff after this pandemic!

It's starting to get a little ludicrous now with teaching unions dictating national policy. Stating schools can't return until track and trace?! What if supermarket workers or doctors or council staff said the same thing? Perhaps saying school won't be normal until track and trace is fair enough but they need to get back closer to normal. Surely as people with a stake in society teachers understand the need to get back to work and the important role they play.

So... it could be months and months and months before schools go back, if this plan is followed?

I said this on another thread, but we may have to get the private sector involved. Allow holiday clubs to open, get the kids at spaced out desks in the holiday club facilities (use currently-disused sports facilities and conference venues and gyms etc. as extra facilities if neceesary---the government is going to have to bail these industries and venues out anyway, may as well command the use of their facilities for a bit), where they sit and do their schoolwork packs/online lessons and are supervised (by young, healthy, low-risk holiday club staff) while parents work. No, it's not brilliant but parents need to work.

Holidays clubs are a good idea I think they should open them to all parents and increase the number of children each week to see how it all goes.

Reading with interest. Really hope they can reopen primary schools. I'd be happy with kids in school 2 days a week - yes partly because wfh while home schooling is challenging to say the least (6 and 9 year old) but more because the 6 year old is in tears most nights over missing her friends, her teacher and school. Yes, she wont be able to see all her friends but as long as she has something approaching "normality" I think she'd be happier. She does talk to close friends online and we would continue that and potentially see them for a walk (if that is relaxed).

My worry is if some years go back first - explaining to a 6 year old why her sibling can go to school and she can't!!! Or if they go in on different days - practically mean's all parents will be out and about more, which seems counter intuitive!

Reduced classes in senior school just won't work, it would be a logistical nightmare. 10/15 pupils in on day one out of a firm of 30, 5 do history as lesson one, 10 do geography, lesson 2 is french so 5 of the geography class do that, the other 10 are split between RE, PE and Art, lesson 3 they mix up again for sciences.....and it goes on. It just isn't practical.

I'm not particularly worried about sending DS into school but there are so many things that would need clarification first.

An example is, pre lockdown if you showed symptoms, a cough or temperature at the time, you had to stay home for 7 days and family members for 14. If that continues, unless testing is made much more accessible and results much more quickly obtained, there will be pupils off constantly. So, if classes are split what happens when 5 of the 10 allowed in are off with symptoms?

I think most teachers would be happy to go back with the protection shopworkers have

• so that's plastic screens, social distancing at all times with controlled movement, adequate hand washing, and no speaking to anyone at close range for more than a minute or two.

Or the same protections offered to care workers who do work at close range for more than 15 minutes at a time

• adequate hand washing, simple surgical masks, apron, gloves

Or maybe we do the same as Daffodil - Yeo in going to concentrate on home educating my 3 kids and stop replying to emails, setting work, and generally being more available than I would be normally as I'm supposed to only work 1.5 days a week...

Or resign. Well actually.... Seriously considering it as I am so fed up. Happy to go back to my previous career in financial services which paid a lot more than teaching ever did, for fewer hours. I'm a science shortage subject teacher which is difficult to recruit and more difficult to retain.

There's no way the government will allow children, particularly those most vulnerable, 6 months (from March to September) hidden away from anyone other than parents. Especially as September won't necessarily be any better and they can't confirm a safe start then either. They know that without the school routine, people can't work and they don't want that either.

I think they will step around the unions and the teachers and start saying that x, y and z can open and is needed, therefore the children of those employers will also require a school places (not as school school, the childcare school of current). That will increase numbers and desensitise people to the perceived threat and get people thinking about problem solving rather than worrying about it from home.

I think it's a real shame and disservice to all the great teachers out there but I agree, the current stance and union involvement just make them look precious and that it's alright for all other key workers to get out there but not them. But I really don't think that is true or what teachers really think.

It’s really, really simple.
It's really really not.
Open up the schools next month. Increased hand washing.
Where?
1200 (secondary school children) washing their hands ? Toilets have 10 sinks in girls 10 sinks in boys (2 bathrooms each) 40 sinks in total. No sinks in classrooms.
Require that all children are temperature checked before they come in - anyone with high temperature or cough stays off and isolates. Any parent who doesn’t adhere is fined.
How can this be monitored?
Not all parents will do this and who will 'fine' them?
Reduced class sizes is pointless because children won’t maintain 1m apart anyway. Besides the developmental damage that would cause is not something we want in our future generation.
Developmental damage? WTF?

Those parents who are still fearfulً, and those who genuinely have a reason to fear - the shielding group - can... wait... home school!!! For as long as they like! No government intervention necessary. You can in fact choose to home school your child for any reason, not just coronavirus!
And give up work?! Easy.... Oh...Where do they get money to live?

So that’s my solution. Open up the schools so that those who need to can go back to work and their children get an education (and society avoids a severe economic depression) and those who are not happy with that can home school their kids.

Best e-mail Boris with your suggestions then.
You really should be in Government you know. or maybe not.

And that with other key workers, they had to be at work to sort the PPE, the plastic screens etc - I guess most people are assuming that this is being sorted over the lockdown in schools while there is time to get plans organised??

@WhyNotMe40 it’s better you leave if you have other skills and get paid more money go for it.
Nurses too have left there profession.
You can’t compare a Care worker who does personal cares for longer than 15minutes to teaching children.

It’s not that we are against teachers wanting to protect themselves and other staff in the building... it’s simply not possible!!
What exactly do you expect the government to provide you with???
Supermarkets have a screen up at the till as it’s a totally different situation and much simpler to minimise the risk.

The problem is that the conditions that enable other workers "go back" (we are still on school on rota and working from home as well) are not practical in schools. Just getting 1200 students through the toilets without it being a free for all during lessons is impossible (free for all during lessons not possible due to safeguarding, vandalism, etc)
Hand washing facilities in schools are woeful.
34 students in a small room with only 2 windows that can be cracked would create an awful large viral dose from just one asymptomatic student breathing for one hour let alone 5.

I personally think uptake will be very limited initially regardless and then as soon as a few start going back more parents will get FOMO or feel safer and numbers will increase rapidly.

A 32 page thread on teachers and their safety concerns, but when there was a thread about retail workers it only lasted 2 pages, yet they're obviously more at risk. No one gave a damn about them and their thread, but then they aren't constantly complaining all the time I suppose

My local supermarket has the staff wearing gloves and masks. There is full plastic between them and the customers, card payment only, detergent spray the bagging area after each customer, only x number of people allowed in the store at once.

I would say the safety of those members of staff has been carefully considered.

The difference between supermarkets and schools..

How is this...

.....going to get these into lesson all at the same time?

@nellodee is that what you are expecting schools to do?

It’s not that we are against teachers wanting to protect themselves and other staff in the building...it’s simply not possible!!What exactly do you expect the government to provide you with???

The limited number of schools that have risked reopening, have taken measures such as

Class sizes of no more than 8/10 including staff.
Masks
Thermometer checks
Deep cleaning between different groups
Lunch at home
Staggered starts/pick ups