Is it just me, or is this working from home with children completely unsustainable?

[Lovemyphone]

I'm terrified that the schools will remain closed until September.

I'm wfh with two dc. Youngest is 4, as the weeks go by it's becoming more and more unbearable and I can't do it much longer. I'm on my own because dh is still out at work. My employer have been pretty good and taken a 'just do what you can when you can' approach. But the work is picking up again, at the same time the dc are climbing the walls now.

I can't even make a phone call or do an online meeting without constant "mummyyy", or one of them hurting themselves, or asking for snacks, or trashing the house.

Surely it's neglect to essentially leave your children unsupervised for 7-8 hours a day? Which is essentially what you're expected to do.

Is anyone else in this position and just cannot possibly see how this can go on?

However, moving in with family or having them move in with you is still an option.

If you have room. It’s not a realistic feasible option for a lot of people.

I think what's actually unsustainable is families of two full time working parents (as we are). Doesn't work in a crisis.

Hadn't seen your latest comment @Therabble - I complete agree - my mum is local, isolated as a household with her DH, and desperate to help. No idea why they can't ease restrictions - like someone said up thread, it's like this situation has gone completely under the radar at government.

Ok, many SAHP's, many furloughed, many p/t.... but x2 working f/t parents should have had some consideration/legislation applied, e.g. paid leave to care for children. It does border on neglect, and yet the the government have the brazenness to issue guidance on how to homeschool effectively - chance would be a fine thing!!

It’s a nightmare I agree. DH has been redeployed in a key worker role (but wfh) and I am part time And wfh, and my boss is VERY flexible. And it’s STILL very hard work. We have a 5 year old and a 2 year old. I feel constant guilt that the 2 year old is being neglected and the only saving grace is that hopefully he won’t remember much of this. I am utterly fed up of lockdown now. although obviously I understand the necessity, it’s not a sustainable situation for much longer. I am not worried about the 5 year old’s education but I am about socialising - it took a long time to settle him in when he started last September so he is going to find it very difficult to go back to school after being out of it for so long. I feel particularly frustrated that there doesn’t seem much risk for children yet some businesses are due to reopen next week - what are people supposed to do with their children if their employers are expecting them to get back to work?!

Fortunately my household is unlikely to have two working adults much longer as due to behaviour under lockdown I may well leave DH. Does that mean I should make myself unemployed in the interim?

It's bloody impossible. We are only coping because I am part time.

My work suggested that if we couldn't cope then we could use a combination of annual leave and emergency parental leave - which might work if we knew how long this was going to go on for, but otherwise is unhelpful.

My god did I need to read this this evening. I cried in my work zoom meeting yesterday as I was just so stressed. Single mum (since February so that doesn't help) 2 DCs - 9 and nearly 5. I work FT and work is busier than ever and a really crucial time for us so I feel a huge amount of responsibility to not let people down. I can't take leave or be furloughed as literally noone to do my job when it's this busy. I feel like the worst parent ever at a time when my kids have so much going on and I should be being the best mum. Got no family around to help even if they were allowed. The only person I could call on is my dad who lives 3 hours away but he had a heart attack a few months ago so is high risk. Just feel like a massive failure on all fronts.

I think what's actually unsustainable is families of two full time working parents (as we are). Doesn't work in a crisis.

I disagree - the benefit is that in a crisis, one of you can quit if needs be, and you've still likely built up extra savings and both will still have recent cvs and contacts. Single income families have put all their eggs in one basket - when a crisis like this one then wipes out the breadwinner's job or entire industry, they are totally screwed. As we discovered when my DH became unexpectedly very ill, even expensive and good quality income protection insurance is hard to claim and covers less than you'd expect (and many people don't even have that).

Oh yes, my work has suggested similar beela. If I knew when it would end I might take some parental leave but a week off seems meaningless if this is going to carry on for another 4months. Plus I might need to save it for the summer if they end lock down before opening schools

So glad everyone else is feeling the same way. I am taking a lot of time off at the moment and Tired from working evenings and weekends. If schools only go back PT how can I feasibly have a job? Hate the thought of giving up work, my financial independence, my feeling of contributing to society. There should be a bailout for parents too. I am just a moany middle class mum but there must be low paid mums in my position who have already had to quit their jobs because they don’t even have the opportunity to work from home, yet I haven’t seen their stories reported in the press. What about increasing child benefit or paying it to mums of all age children. Or paying Statutory Maternity Pay to parents who have to quit work temporarily to look after their school age kids (With similar rights to keep job open). We are incurring significant economic cost (potentially long term) but at the moment this is invisible.

@GoldenOmber - I read this and it so perfectly summed up how I feel about the situation that I cried. Again.

I think we're just invisible. Honestly I think a huge proportion of the country does not realise what this is like for WFH parents and our children right now

And I’m so sorry for all of you - especially the ones who are single income families or main breadwinners. It’s horrible enough with us both F/T and I can’t imagine the extra pressure. I’m so close to giving up, but also feel like any job should be cling onto like a life raft. Meanwhile my kids need me and I just don’t have anything left to give.

Would disagree with a couple of the posts regarding people with kids over 8 struggling far less. Mine are 7&9 and whilst yes they can be left safely whilst I work you then have the added constant guilt and stress as regarding the endless schoolwork they are expected to crack on with unsupervised- it just doesn't happen so there won't be any students of the week awards being dished out for my two anytime soon either. (Agree another ridiculous idea). Think it's safe to say most of us on this thread are really hoping Boris doesn't opt for the easy populist choice come Sunday.

Do we think the gov will announce that families can blend households / grandparents can see grandchildren from next week?

No, but people will be doing it. I am outside the UK and there are no "rules" here about what you can and can't do---it's up to us to decide. I have been voluntarily socially distancing since March. But if the daycare does not open a few weeks from now, I'll be getting together with a friend and doing an informal nanny-share. Most people are going to start doing similar, I reckon.

We get a lot of claptrap about protecting the vulnerable when what they really mean is looking after the elderly voters who swept them into power and have already fucked our children over by voting for Brexit. Now they expect (not always with a whole lot of gratitude) that working parents and kids make vast sacrifices for them as they sit in their large expensive houses (which none of us will ever be able to afford) ordering their Ocado shopping, pottering about gardening, drawing down on their vast reliable pensions, and generally carrying on as normal (for a retired person). Talk about generational inequity!!

Totally agree.

There needs to be some serious gouging-out of pensioner wealth after all this is over.

@littlebelina exactly. It's like giving you £100 to live on, but not telling you whether it needs to last 1 week or 6 months.

I'm just still incredous that this is expected of us and there seems to be no solution other than suck it up.

@meringue33 exactly. I’m seriously considering handing my notice in. My mental health is declining. I cry at the thought of trying to work!

And even if there was some generous scheme to enable parents to take paid leave to look after children for the duration, do I have any confidence that people who took advantage of that wouldn’t be first for the chop when companies are restructuring afterwards?

Makes me sad to read all these messages. You're all doing such a good job but it's so hard being asked to do the impossible. Also makes me feel comparatively lucky - at least here we could just about get by without my income. I don't particularly want to give up my job - meant to be restarting my career after taking couple of years out with my son. Not keen on being financially dependent - that brings problems of its own in the long run. But I feel I'm being backed into a corner if this goes on much longer...

Hats off especially to the single parents - I've always thought that you deserve a medal rather than the usual single parent 'bashing' (for stepping up and taking responsibility, often in financially difficult circumstances ) and even more so now. You are amazing.

@Kokeshi123, agreed. We want to follow the government rules but if they do not give us any indication whatsoever on Sunday on what is being thought about for those of us who are trying to look after children and work at the same time, then we will be taking our parents up on their offer to look after the children.

The last thing I want is to put them or us at risk, but we are all minimising our contact with the outside world as much as we possibly can and each day just gets harder. The children miss their grandparents and quality time for them is seriously lacking right now, our careers are suffering and we are constantly bickering between the four of us because we are all so stressed and worn out. We need some sort of idea on timeframes as if we just get yet another "3 week lockdown extension" I will cry.

My neighbours were all out partying on the street last night which just makes this so much more frustrating.

I have found my clan. Ages 7 and 4 in my house (y2 and nursery). Both DH and I wfh full time, and to be honest the 7 yr old is primarily minding the 4 year old while we work. Luckily, they get on really well. They eat a lot of snacks (and I mean LOTS) and spend pretty much all day on you tube or other screen time while we work. They do have a great garden with sandpit and flow in and out, but keep gravitating back to screens unless I’m out there with them (impossible while working). I think we get maybe 15 -30 minutes of school work in a day if we are lucky. School have been great in fairness, setting a variety of interesting tasks every day, but obviously DD needs help and encouragement to do the tasks and we are simply too busy.

As with the rest of you, I feel I am failing in work due to never really settling to a task and concentrating from the interruptions; and failing at looking after them and most definitely failing on the education front.

I try to make up for it on non work days (I do 4 longer days) but mainly that means doing stuff with them together - getting out for a walk (too busy on work days), craft etc. As it’s not fair on the little one to have Yet another day being ignored while I try and get school work done with the eldest.

House is difficult to keep on top of, 4 people in it all the time cause so much more mess and dust, and eat so much and so often it’s untrue. When I used to wfh before this, on my own, it was bliss!

DH is doing his best and we are splitting 50/50 but we are both so busy. It’s very hard.

Really feel for those single parents and those with kids who are not getting on so well.

Could Mumsnet do a campaign about this or even just some press to change the messaging out there. What I get from the media is “oh it’s hilarious, kids are driving mums up the wall”, “gin o clock” and “here’s some crafting ideas.” My kids are not actually annoying me at all. They are great. I’m loving the daily walks etc with them. What I’m upset about is the prospect of having to quit the job I love purely because I’m a parent, then being unemployed and on the wrong side of 40 in a bad recession. Something else MN could consider doing (if the government fail to) is commission an economic impact analysis looking at the cost to women and the country of women being pushed out of the workforce like this. By the way we are not alone. 35m children globally were unsupervised while their parents worked... before C-19. So that’s something else we need to look at fixing after.

Could Mumsnet do a campaign about this or even just some press to change the messaging out there. What I get from the media is “oh it’s hilarious, kids are driving mums up the wall”, “gin o clock” and “here’s some crafting ideas.” My kids are not actually annoying me at all. They are great. I’m loving the daily walks etc with them. What I’m upset about is the prospect of having to quit the job I love purely because I’m a parent, then being unemployed and on the wrong side of 40 in a bad recession. Something else MN could consider doing (if the government fail to) is commission an economic impact analysis looking at the cost to women and the country of women being pushed out of the workforce like this. By the way we are not alone. 35m children globally were unsupervised while their parents worked... before C-19. So that’s something else we need to look at fixing after.

Great post.

How can we get someone in power to listen to us? I thought about writing to Downing Street but would there be any point? It needs a media campaign really.

It's gone on long enough. It was ok for a few weeks as an emergency, but it just can't go on.

@meringue33. I agree about a campaign. I'm normally a pretty quiet, unpolitical person and this is the first time in my life I've felt politically angry! (Was sad about Brexit and voted remain, but accepted basic democratic right of majority to prevail).

Here, that's not the case. 50% of the population is under 40.5. Tory voters are, however, predominantly elderly. So are most politicians. They don't get it. Boris might be a new dad but he is significantly older than the average person in Britain. Also, other than the vacuous Priti Patel, no women seem to be involved in any of the political decision making.

This chart shows how age-skewed the Tory vote is. Covid-19 (unlike flu) is also very age discriminatory.

Old people with reliable pensions don't face losing their source of income if they aren't able to manage an impossible task (WFH with little kids). The burden is being placed on the young to perform a task that, with the best will in the world, may be impossible: saving elderly people from contracting covid-19, and then from dying from it. The first of these is weakly possible in lockdown (but care homes). The second is a result of having no effective medical treatment nor one soon in sight.

If human trials of a vaccine had already worked and we just had to wait for production to be scaled up and it rolled out, that would be a very different story. But we aren't there.

Eventually we will have to stop lockdown. That's not negotiable, barring a miracle cure. What is negotiable is whether a little or a lot of damage is done to our children's future.