My work won't pay or furlough me.

[Mammatomyboy16]

So I have a 13 month old son. My dad looks after him when I go to work. Since we went on lockdown my dad hasn't been able to look after him as he's classed as vulnerable. Over 70 and has diabetes. I'm a key worker so haven't been able to go to work. My partner is also a key worker so can't stay off and look after our son.

I've taken some weeks timebanking, holidays and 2 weeks we had to self isolate as my son had a high temperature but he was fine.

Anyway, my work won't furlough me. They've said if I don't come back to work next week I won't be getting paid. I've told them the only way I can come back to work is if my dad comes back and looks after him, which is risking his life and my sons life. I am furious with my work. They have furloughed other people which I understand as they live with someone who's vulnerable. But because I don't live with my dad I won't be furloughed.

I can't afford to not be paid. I can't work around my partners hours as he gets in so late from work everyday.

I don't know what to do!

Can you imagine if all the NHS frontline workers that have children at home demanded furlough due to caring responsibilities? Said actually no I’m not sending my child somewhere that puts them at risk and not risking bringing this home to them, no I’m not willing to move out the family home and only see my kids via video chat for the foreseeable future so that I can do my job. We’d all be in huge trouble then! Furlough isn’t designed for essential workers, they are essential and so have to get on with it some way or another. None of this is fair.

not everyone can work the 20h in the evening or weekend though 🙄🙄🙄

I used to work 20h in two different companies. Mine were bound to business hours. The companies were close in the evening and weekend. I could only do them during the day.

They can only furlough you if they would normally have no work for you and make you redundant. That's the rules. If you are a keyworker, I presume they have work for you to do, but you are saying you cant do it.

bird But that isn’t the case for the OP. She works in a supermarket with obviously longer working hours.

oh, I missed that nick. Agree, if childcare is so prohibitive, then it is easier to change hours.

The you need to look for another job, or you and your partner looks for other jobs that will fit around your childcare.

I did, I work evenings/nights and weekend for 7 years until I then changed my job again to then suit family life once their children were at school age.

If you, your partner or your father took seriously ill then you’d need to find alternative employment/childcare.

I do agree with the poster that to have children you need to be able to afford them, not jus constantly life on the breadline which isn’t fair to the child nor the parents.

I’m Not saying this is you OP, however employees forgot their employer doesn’t fit around them, you as an employee fits around your employer, yes it’s hugely beneficial if you have an employer who wants their colleagues to have a work/life balance however this is a benefit not a right.

So many errors

I can understand why so many posters are frustrated with you OP.

You've been lucky having access to free childcare and I'm glad to up until now that's worked out for you, your father and your son.

However, as many other posters have said there could have been other reasons you father couldn't provide childcare, what would you have done then?

As stands you actually do seem to have other options (other family, changing hours, paying for childcare etc) but you don't like those options.

So you want to be furloughed instead and are misguidedly raging at your employer when they haven't done anything wrong.

You seem to be of the mindset that furlough is your childcare contingency plan.

It's not and in any other circumstances your father could not provide care it wouldn't be on the table.

The reality is that this should really be a wake up call that you need a proper back up plan going forward.

So you have said if your dad could not look after your son, you would either work full time to afford childcare, quit work to look after him, or ask other family members to look after him. The time has come where your father cannot look after your son, and neither can other family members. Therefore, your options are to work full time or stop working (temporarily in the form of parental leave, or quit).

OP, these are your options.

I agree, before you had your son, and before your father offered to mind him, you would have had to pay for childcare. Surely you would have worked out that you could afford to do so. So what is the issue now?

I think it’s lovely that your son and father have such a lovely bond. And I would also do the same if my circumstances were similar, but you always need a back-up option.

Before covid-19, situations with your father could have changed, upsetting your childcare arrangements. If you cannot afford to stop working or pay for childcare, you cannot afford children.

Hopefully @Mammatomyboy16 has flounced off chastened rather than petulant.

I'm not especially saying the 2 scenarios are comparable, more using what happened to us as an illustration of how your perfect planned life can be taken away leaving you in difficulty. People have their children based on their current and foreseen circumstances at the time. Who can honestly say they thought say 6 years ago about what they'd do for childcare in the event of a global pandemic? The OP is in uncharted waters as we all are and deserves a the online equivalent of a cup of tea and a chat not a bollocking.

Who can honestly say they thought say 6 years ago about what they'd do for childcare in the event of a global pandemic?

Yes I agree that barely anyone would have said that specifically about a global pandemic.

They should however have accepted the fact that when you have children there are a multitude of reasons that you will always have to weigh up the income of a job versus the outgoings of childcare.

If the job can pay for full time childcare that's that - sorted. But if for some reason a job can't pay for childcare (through illness / redundancy / global pandemic, whatever) then stay at home parenting it is. If the job can pay for some childcare but not all, then part time work it is.

OP said if her dad could no longer do the childcare then it'd be fine because she would sort something else out.

So why has she made a thread about it and then lashed out at people saying... well sort something else out then as you said that would be fine.

I'm not going to judge you for using your dad as childcare. In lots of communities and families, that's entirely normal. Really patronising of some pp actually, to suggest that he's not up to it at 70.

But you haven't got that option any more sadly, or for the foreseeable future. Your company are sticking to the rules, and they're right to. They can't say that there's no work for you, because there is. And they can't say that you don't have childcare, because there's childcare available for keyworkers.

I fear your choice will be to pay for childcare, for now, or take unpaid leave. I'm so sorry it has come to that, but lots of us are having to make similar hard choices.

There won't be many people coming through this completely financially unaffected.

@rawlikesushi has explained this perfectly:

Your company are sticking to the rules, and they're right to. They can't say that there's no work for you, because there is. And they can't say that you don't have childcare, because there's childcare available for keyworkers.

I fear your choice will be to pay for childcare, for now, or take unpaid leave. I'm so sorry it has come to that, but lots of us are having to make similar hard choices.

There won't be many people coming through this completely financially unaffected.

So why has she made a thread about it and then lashed out at people saying... well sort something else out then as you said that would be fine

Because in normal times her alternative options would be far greater than they are now. She would be fine. She would find childcare.

Right now her options are exceptionally limited, perhaps non-existent. Her employer expects her to snap her fingers and come up with something out of thin air.

Like billions of others - and hundreds of governments - around the globe, she didn't have a plan for childcare during in a pandemic.

For that she is getting an unmerciful and completely unearned flaming here.

Right now her options are exceptionally limited, perhaps non-existent.

No, she has said that she has other family she can ask (but she doesn't appear to like them very much), and there are child-minders she qualifies to use (but doesn't want to pay for) and she can work at weekends when her husband is home (although I think she'd prefer not to).

She is angry with her employer, because she wants to be furloughed instead and paid, but they won't play ball. Because she DOES have options.

Pandemic aside, what would you have done if your father decided he didn’t want to look after his grandchild anymore? Or if he became ill?
I think your options are quit, work more flexibly or pay childcare.

You don't know the family situation. Not everyone can manage a toddler, and people sometimes keep a tab, meaning they will expect a massive favour in return. Or they'll try it for a week and then announce they can't do it after all.
And there is this: I have other people who can look after him and have asked but unfortunately haven't bothered to come and see my son most his life and he isn't comfortable with them and screams the minute I leave the room. And I don't feel comfortable doing that.

You don't know if the childcare theoretically available is available for her, in her area, working part time.

You don't know if her employer insists on her being there on weekdays, not evenings or weekends. Are you expecting her employer to rejig everyone else's hours and days to accommodate her?

Staticelle Tue 28-Apr-20 16:12:56

The main reason for furlough was intended to be to keep businesses afloat, if it's being used way beyond that no wonder we are headed for such economic doom. And yes, in many cases feeling hard done by because you can't be furloughed is entitled
No, the reason to furlough is to avoid a situation developing in which people who can't afford childcare, or live in an area where childcare is scarce or non-existent (because childcare workers get sick too, and so do their family members) and can't afford to stop working are not forced to go to work and spread infection.

People are talking about furlough here as if it's a paid fucking holiday.

It's there so that a deadly virus will not kill hundreds of thousands of people and destroy the economy too.

You don't know if her employer insists on her being there on weekdays, not evenings or weekends.

She said she could work weekends.

@mathanxiety The government guidance for employers is pretty clear it's for employers who can't continue normal operations, and that it may also be used where childcare isn't available. Neither of these apply in the OP's case.

Also, not sure how it's relevant, but being furloughed is pretty similar to a paid holiday. You're paid and you can't work...

Well you're a delight OP..

You don't know if the childcare theoretically available is available for her, in her area, working part time.

If the OP had come on and said my employer won’t furlough me. I have no childcare due to 70 year vulnerable dad not being able to AND there are no available keyworker childcare places for a child his age in my area then the replies would have been very different.

So many people speaking confidently of available childcare without knowing one thing about where the OP lives, what the childcare situation in her area is - you would almost think there wasn't a pandemic.
About half of childcare providers appear to have remained open since the lockdown began in March, with access restricted to the children of key workers. Many report a shortage of personal protective equipment and cleaning supplies, similar to schools and care homes.
www.theguardian.com/education/2020/apr/24/childcare-industry-crushed-by-coronavirus-crisis

On the subject of furlough:
Being furloughed involves arranging a basic income for people so they don't have to go out to work for money and spread infection.

One day, maybe when you are celebrating some dear relative's 99th birthday ten years from now, you may come to appreciate the fact that millions of people could afford to stay home and not go out coughing and hacking to scan your groceries or drive your bus for you.

@mathanxiety Have you RTFT or are you the OP with a nc?

@mathanxiety Have you RTFT or are you the OP with a nc?

1. OP has said she doesn't WANT to use childcare
2. Not relevant in this case
3. Also irrelevant