Shocked by the news coming from care homes

[YogaFaker]

It seems that really vulnerable old people and those adults with conditions that need round-the-clock care are the sacrificial lambs in this government's inept non policies for dealing with COVID-19.

I find this shocking, really shocking. People are of value whatever their age. Yet the policy seems to have been to let them die, if they contract C-19.

There was a thread here or on aIBU which made claims for the preferential treatment of elderly people in this pandemic. I don't think so. The vulnerable elderly have been totally let down.

Shame on us.

Dad has a DNAR in place and has done for a good while now. It’s something he’s always said: he doesn’t want to be “kept alive” with no quality of life.
But there’s an enormous difference between DNAR and DN attempt to prevent CV-19 infection.

why we are prolonging lives of people who have no real quality of life.
Who decides who has quality of life though? There are people with severe learning disabilities, that to those who don't know them, are assumed to have no quality of life, when in actual fact they have a great quality of life. It comes down to the value we place on the lives of people. It seems some people's lives are "worth" more than others.

Why is anyone surprised and honestly, a bit thick about thus? Why would you think the heirs of those who stole off and slaughtered millions last century would care?

Toothfairy,

Most societies do put different values on different lives and stages of life.

I think that our fear of death and sweeping it under the carpet leads people to think life is eternal. I very much doubt most people in cars homes want to keep in living forever and certainly believe that their own lives had more value when they were living at home, having an active work life and contributing to the community.

A lot of people (count me in on this one) would do anything to never be in a care home including voluntarily calling it a day. It is a scandal that we deny assisted dying and speaks to our fear of death, even vicariously by allowing someone else to peacefully end their own life.

A lot of parents of children/adults with disabilities are terrified that their child will get COVID and not get treatment because their is less value placed on their lives. The original guidance around priority of treatment put people with learning disabilities just above people who are terminally ill (and therefore lowest priority).

I don't think it is so much that there is less love or care for our older adults but more the issue of where is the best place of care for them should they contract Covid-19. Our hospital admitted 3 people from 2 care homes the other night - one was a man of 98 who had severe dementia and prostate cancer with bone secondaries. He was in a single room with excellent care from community nurses for pain relief and the care home staff. Even without CV, he was likely to not survive the week. But with the politics around this, the GP crumbled and admitted him to hospital - he spent 2 hours in A&E before being transferred to a ward, surrounded by strangers, his syringe driver needing changed and then died about 11 hours later with no loved ones present. If he was my relative, I would have begged the care home/GP to allow him to die in the bed he had slept in for the previous 18 years or so.

The other two patients were also very elderly with multiple other morbidities and are unlikely to survive more than a few days even with "hospital care".

There are of course elderly people who will do well with the virus but the majority of them will not be in care homes. Most are in care homes/social care because they are frail elderly.

@YogaFaker
There was a thread here or on aIBU which made claims for the preferential treatment of elderly people in this pandemic. I don't think so. The vulnerable elderly have been totally let down.
Shame on us

I honestly believe that the biggest majority of health care professionals treat all patients with their best interests at heart. I believe that we would be letting down frail, elderly people MORE by aggressively treating them in a noisy, scary, alien environment for a disease they are unlikely to survive as opposed to helping them have a good death in a care home.

There is no magic cure in a hospital - what do you think will happen if they get admitted to hospital? Many cannot have high flow oxygen owing to pre-existing conditions that mean oxygen could do more harm than good. Ditto fluids - giving IV fluids to some of the frail elderly could put them into heart failure or worsen existing heart failure and lead to death. You are putting them into a high risk environment where they could attract any number of infections. The change of environment is enough to put frail elderly into an acute confusional state. They will not be being cared for by staff who have come to know them, their likes and dislikes, how they like to be positioned etc.

The poorer run care homes will want to dump them in hospital as they will be a cost they don't want to incur. Most care homes are private businesses thanks to Thatcher privatising care of the elderly.

It is not just as simple as them being "sacrificed".

As I keep saying, my concern is not for care and medical staff, but government policy.

And I don’t think I’m alone in this - representatives of UK care homes are saying this, as are care home staff themselves.

Apparently some NHS trusts are trying to get care homes to take patients from hospital who have/had Covid-19 to free up beds which is just putting all the other residents at risk.

Yes DP's daughter would confirm this and lots of people have died since. I can see tge need to free up beds, but I wonder if the patient was tested on discharge and if they were isolated with their own staff with PPE in the care home. Probably not.

I like what @larrygrylls posted.

I was thinking care home staff could be paid as well as the oil rig workers. Do live in shifts for 3-6 weeks on, and 3-6 weeks off.

That live in system would cut disease risk a lot.

anyone up for being taxed so much that the care home sector could afford that?

I think it works out to hourly wage around £25.