The positives of the corona virus

[Doubletrouble99]

Can you think of any?
Mine are mainly to do with climate change and reducing our carbon foot print.
So fewer going on cruises and flying would be great for the planet.
Less reliance of far eastern goods would also be great.

I hope there will be much more appreciation for the NHS and all the caring services and much more money will be put into it. I feel that the way our system works will show up the US system and nullify any idea anyone had of us handing over parts of the NHS to America in any deal.

I’ve been out shopping a bit and it’s quiet, which is great if you’re an introvert!

The empty toilet roll isles will be something to tell the grandchildren.

• Overpopulation is killing this planet and it's inhabitants.

But nobody will sign up to a Government sanctioned child limit.

Good job given that global population increase isn't because more children are being born.

Good point titchy

No one would sign up because there's absolutely no reason to enforce a child limit. Birth rates are falling all over the world and have been for years. source

More on this: ourworldindata.org/peak-child

Which is why the older generation are an economic problem, and why STate pension age keeps going up, there’s not enough working people to pay for pensions and healthcare for the elderly.

Many work places including the HoC change their working practices to more remote working/voting which can only be a good thing for women who tend to do the majority of the caring in our society. Might also mean Dads and their employers realising that being home with their children has advantages and that they don't need to be out in an office/traveling or at meetings to be productive.

cormorantyes both very good points!

So the Corona virus could fix a massive global issue.

I think the benefits will mainly be environmental. NASA took photos of the pollution over Wuhan in Jan 2019 and again in Jan 2020 - it was horrendous in the first and almost nonexistent in the second. Worldwide, air travel is massively down, industrial output is down, consumption of everything but food and anti-viral products is down, vehicle use down - but of course it won't last. As soon as the threat has passed (as with 9/11), things will shoot back up again and possibly worse than before to make up the shortfall. If the world's population takes a hit, then again the benefits will be environmental and economic. And if this crisis shows up Trump for the fucking moron he is, that truly would be a silver lining.

Not seeing many positives - I think it's going to be horrendously expensive so along with Brexit the Gvt is in for a hard time. It will prove a good reason for putting up taxes. Of course, it might also make the Gvt more inclined to privatise chunks of the NHS to get it off their hands

One positive might be that it shows how upset pp will be if/when there are interruptions in supplies due to lack of trade deal with EU. Might be an important warning to Johnson that, whatever people said before about accepting brexit might be 'bumpy' they actually will have no tolerance for disruption to their normal lives.

LittleRootie, First of all the Gov. can get loans at the lowest rates ever at the moment so why would they put up taxes? The Tories are adamantly against raising taxes so I feel your argument is nil and void. Also why would this signal the privatisation of the NHS? The fact that we have an NHS and not a privatised system is a massive plus in a situation like this. If anything it shows up the likes of the US and it's totally disjointed health offering where people are reluctant to go get tested as they can't afford it, they also can't afford to be off work because sick pay is virtually non existent in many sectors. So the opposite will happen.
Why do you think people will have 'no tolerance for disruption to their normal lives'? In a situation like this with a virus why on earth would people have no tolerance? We would have no choice, you can stamp your little foot as much as you like but you'll just have to manage the best you can.

First of all the Gov. can get loans at the lowest rates ever at the moment so why would they put up taxes?
Oh, I dunno, maybe because we're already up to our eyes in debt and the Tories promised to tackle it (even though they were the one's who've nearly doubled it)?

The Tories are adamantly against raising taxes so I feel your argument is nil and void
Tories are always 'against' raising taxes in their manifesto, once they're in again they tend to change their minds. I'm sure they'll be very very sad about having to do it, if that's any consolation.

The fact that we have an NHS and not a privatised system is a massive plus in a situation like this.

Not to this Gvt, it's just more evidence of the burden it creates. If it was privatised then private companies would pick up the bill (via their 'customers').

In a situation like this with a virus why on earth would people have no tolerance?

Do you take any notice of the news? People are panic buying, stockpiling, stressing about disruption to their lives. People do not respond well to change, particularly if it has been caused unnecessarily and if they were led astray as to the ultimate benefits.

LittleRootie - we are not up to our eyes in debit. In 2009/10 government borrowing was 10% of GDP. It is now 1.5% and is the lowest since 2001.
When have the Tories 'changed their minds' about putting up taxes?
The NHS has had private businesses running parts of it for many years that has nothing at all to do with us changing the way we, as citizens are entitled to 'free treatment' or the whole philosophy of our NHS.
Idiots panic buying has nothing to do with the public's 'tolerance' of a situation. So you think that the measures suggested by the government to reduce the spread of the virus are unnecessary, and that people will not respond well if they were led astray as to the ultimate benefits!! What are you on about?

Office for National Statistics 2019 Report

From the report:
General government gross debt was £1,821.3 billion at the end of the financial year ending March 2019, equivalent to 85.2% of gross domestic product (GDP) and 25.2 percentage points above the reference value of 60% set out in the Protocol on the Excessive Deficit Procedure

Idiots panic buying has nothing to do with the public's 'tolerance' of a situation

Of course it does, it's a very clear illustration. I'm on about Brexit, what are you on about?

There are different measures of UK debt but the country is in debt to the tune of around £65,000 for every taxpayer. And the debt has about doubled in the last 10 years.

The tories have reduced the deficit but there is no way it can be claimed we are in a good economic position. 10 years of austerity to get the deficit down, but we are still borrowing every year just to break even. And now with election bribes the debt will go up. I suspect the economic effect of coronavirus will be bad for the short term, but in the long term could be positive, if as it seems it is the elderly that die. Horrible way of looking at it though.

LittleRootie. The point about borrowing and debt is that borrowing refers to the amount new borrowing (the defecate)as a % of GDP each financial year. At the moment the Conservatives have got that down to 1.5% of GDP in the last financial year. The last Labour government was borrowed 10% of GDP in the last year it was in power.
The Debt, which is what you are quoting is the cumulative debt that all successive governments have to service. So the current government are still paying back the loans of the previous governments but by borrowing less each year they have reduced the burden.

Oh and I'm on about the current crisis re the corona virus Rootie. as per the title of the thread not Brexit.

But double trouble the debt has doubled under the tories. And is still going up year on year. This is so unfair on future generations who will have to pay for it. The tories had a fiscal policy to reduce the debt, but that’s gone out of the window since brexit, and especially under Boris.

Doubletrouble, you are playing with words to try to cover up the truth. It doesn't work when the gov does it and it doesn't work here - since 2010, despite a failed and very damaging policy of austerity, the Tories have massively increased our national debt.

The thread title asks for positives of the virus and I suggested that one might be the warning to Johnson, so I am not off-topic.

Snowy -- The national debt has not doubled under the Tories. Annual borrowing has done down from 10% in 2010 to 1.5% of GDP last year.
The Tories have a policy to reduce borrowing which they have done . They can't do masses to the national debt. as much of it is historic taken out when interest rates were much higher, we are still having to pay back the debt from the labour years.

It's going to be a good week for the government to push through a shite budget.

Only a plus for full on tories, of course.

Perhaps you missed my post from the Office of National Statistics Doubletrouble? You might find it helpful in clearing up your confusion:

General government gross DEBT was £1,821.3 trillion at the end of the financial year ending March 2019, equivalent to 85.2% of gross domestic product (GDP). General government DEFICIT (or net borrowing) was £25.5 billion in the financial year ending March 2019, equivalent to 1.2% of GDP

DEFICIT (or net borrowing) measures the gap between total revenue and total spending. A positive value indicates borrowing while a negative value indicates a surplus.

DEBT represents the amount the public sector owes to UK private sector organisations and overseas institutions, largely a result of government financial liabilities on the bonds (gilts) and Treasury bills it has issued

While borrowing (or the DEFICIT) represents the difference between total spending and receipts over a period of time, DEBT represents the total amount of money owed at a point in time

The DEBT has been built up by successive government administrations over many years. When the government borrows (that is, runs a DEFICIT), this normally adds to the DEBT total. So reducing the DEFICIT is not the same as reducing the DEBT.

Two possible good results.

• people will be forced to work from home. Up to now wfh has had lukewarm acceptance from bosses who are too

lazy to learn how to manage people remotely. Now they will have to, people will get used to it and will expect to do it in future - the genie out of the bottle. Everyone works from home one day a week average - 20% reduction in traffic, train overcrowding, car emissions, stress.

• secondly companies realise they don’t need such large offices/car parks & can cut costs by using more hot desking, freeing up buildings for conversion to housing.