Is the penny finally starting to drop about anti semitism and hate marches?

[mids2019]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2026/may/04/starmer-c al l-society-response-rising-antisemitism

I think we are now seeing the cumulative impact of the anti senitism that has built up over the last 3 years where there has been a permissive environment with politicians hesitant to intervene in events in the streets that have incubated anti Jew sentiment.

All political parties apart from the hate apologist Greens are now waking up to the fact we need better policing and perhaps legislation. I for one will acting a vote for a party that recognises hate marches for what they are and also willing to tackle the vile posts appearing on social media (and Labour have reacted too late too little). Enough is enough for a Jewish community that lives in perpetual fear.

I would like them to speak out against the marches but by voicing also an understanding of why people are protesting and not just in the context of concerns about rising antisemitism. They could point out what they are doing to support Palestinians, as well as supporting interfaith work in the UK.

At the same time as speaking against antisemitism- we need to hear that no racism is acceptable and we need to embrace living in a multicultural society.

I completely agree about concerns about what is driving some of the racist rhetoric on line and thinking about funding of this and responsibility of social media companies is important. We need to address issues about bots so that people are clear when they are engaging with fellow humans or not.

The debate about bots - what can bots really do though beyond performing very basic functions such as sharing posts or "liking" posts in favour of Israel?

You can't have a proper discussion with a bot - it's why people find it so frustrating when companies use bots to supposedly help you with an enquiry. They never are that helpful because there's no human brain there and thus no complexity.

It's also very obvious when you're "talking" to a bot.

As for influencers, there are also concerns about Iran's network of influence in the UK, so that cuts both ways as this article explains:

As counter-terrorism police arrest four people today on suspicion of spying for Iran on London’s Jewish community, political focus is intensifying on the spread of Tehran’s tentacles of power across the Western world.

A group of Labour MPs have already written to the government asking for a clampdown on charities that could be operating an Iranian “influence network” in the UK. They warned that a web of such organisations appears “to be actively promoting the Iranian regime’s ideology and interests”.

One of the charities cited by the MPs is the Islamic Centre of England. “Based in the affluent north-west London suburb of Maida Vale”, it has been “accused of being an outpost of the Iranian regime” and has been under investigation by the Charity Commission since 2022.

theweek.com/politics/irans-network-of-influence-in-the-uk

And from the Telegraph:

A group of Labour MPs have warned of a web of organisations that “appear to be actively promoting the Iranian regime’s ideology and interests”.

In a letter to Dan Jarvis, the security minister, the MPs argued that proscribing the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC) was an “important step” in limiting the regime’s ability to repress and kill protesters in Iran.

They went on to list several charities, which they alleged are part of the Iranian regime’s “influence on our shores”, arguing that the response of the sector watchdog, the Charity Commission, had been “inadequate”.

One charity cited is the Islamic Human Rights Commission (IHRC), which describes itself as a campaign, research and advocacy non-profit which “struggles for justice for all peoples”.

Set up in 1997, it has special consultative status with the economic and social council of the United Nations. It has been under a statutory inquiry by the Charity Commission since last October.

It was criticised in the 2023 independent review of the Prevent counter-terror strategy by Sir William Shawcross, who described it as an “Islamist group ideologically aligned with the Iranian regime, that has a history of extremist links and terrorist sympathies”.

The official report notes: “Several senior figures within IHRC have espoused support for violent jihad, expressed sympathy for convicted terrorists, and advocated for the extraction and eradication of ‘Zionists’.

“Campaigns have supported high-profile associates of a number of terrorist or extremist groups such as al-Qaeda and the Taliban.”

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/02/28/shut-down-iran-propaganda-network-operating-uk-starmer-told/

Interesting reading. Tentacles spreading

"It was criticised in the 2023 independent review of the Prevent counter-terror strategy by Sir William Shawcross, who described it as an “Islamist group ideologically aligned with the Iranian regime, that has a history of extremist links and terrorist sympathies”.

The official report notes: “Several senior figures within IHRC have espoused support for violent jihad, expressed sympathy for convicted terrorists, and advocated for the extraction and eradication of ‘Zionists’.

“Campaigns have supported high-profile associates of a number of terrorist or extremist groups such as al-Qaeda and the Taliban.”

Extremely worrying what walks within our country, hoping to bring down freedom to replace with oppression.

@twiglets A quick google will tell you:

Politically motivated bots promote hate by using coordinated networks to flood platforms with inflammatory, repetitive, and polarizing content. Social media owners profit from this through an engagement-driven economy where user anger, comments, and shares maximize ad exposure and keep users scrolling longer.

That is skating the surface. Have you ever wondered why Musk supports TR?

It is very much to do with how the press depict things. There was an attack on a synagogue in the UK on the 5th May. Shocking! And everyone came out and said how awful it was. Not much follow up when it turned out that it was a former synagogue and had been sold to a muslim Somalian organisation. And one of the attackers was called Moses.

I'm not denying that bots exist - they will exist both pro and anti Israel and pro and anti Iran & their proxies.

My point is bots aren't sophisticated and can only perform basic functions. So it's pretty easy to tell if you are engaging with a human or not as engaging with a bot is a soul destroyingly boring and repetitive, to use your word.

Promoting hate for the benefit of SM owners is quite an achievement for a ‘basic function’.

Iran will also be funding bots to perform basic functions which will promote hate.

It would be pretty hard to mistake a bot for a person as per the concern of @Islandsofsand that We need to address issues about bots so that people are clear when they are engaging with fellow humans or not.

Both sides in any war these days will be using bots as part of their propaganda and also AI:

A new feature of this conflict analysed by BBC Verify is the emergence of AI-generated satellite imagery.

We verified multiple real videos showing Iranian drone and missile strikes on the US Navy's Fifth Fleet headquarters in Bahrain on the first day of the conflict.

A fabricated photo, shared on X by the state-linked newspaper The Tehran Times, began to spread the following day and claimed to show extensive damage to the base.

The fake appears to be based on real satellite imagery of a US naval base in Bahrain taken in February 2025, which is publicly available online.

According to Google's SynthID watermark detector, the fake image was generated or edited with a Google AI tool.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckg8wvz427vo

They don't have to be sophisticated and engaging though to spread their message.

45 'bot like accounts' collectively produced 610,000 posts in 1 month that were seen by 4 billion people. The problem is that people see these messages like all of this population replacement theory nonsense and see it enough times by what they think is enough people that they start believing it and believing that it is some kind of 'silent majority' position, that they are part of some kind of movement. If enough people start to believe that then that becomes the reality.

These bots don't have to be engaging or sophisticated to spread hate, all they have to do is spread enough of it that is seen by enough people who are susceptible to it.

www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0802/1463231-disinformation-coolock/

You don’t give people credit for forming their own opinions?

A lot more pro Palestine stuff available to read online than pro Israel stuff. But you have to assume people have brains to read enough to form their own opinions.

That's interesting, we need to give people credit for forming their own opinions when it comes to bots spreading racist conspiracy theories online yet pro Palestinian marches in London which are seen by far less than 4 billion people per month need to be shut down because they are influencing a rise in antisemitism?

That's not why the pro Palestinian marches should be moved to static demonstrations now, in my opinion.

It's because lots of Jewish people have spoken out to say they no longer feel safe in the community while the marches are happening, and even lots of non Jewish people have said they find the ones in big cities threatening.

Also, they have to be policed so heavily and so frequently, because of the extremist element who end up hijacking them, leading to trouble/arrests.

You have agreed vociferously though that these marches are causing a rise in antisemitism? You called me 'disingenuous' for asking for proof of a link between these marches and the rise in antisemitism in the UK. Now though you are saying that we need to give people credit for making up their minds?

I don't know, seems a bit mad to be like people are just forming their own opinions on the topics bots who are solely created to spread racist conspiracy theories far and wide but then to insist that protests are to blame for the rise in antisemitism in the UK. Maybe you've changed your mind since then though and now you think people are just making up their own minds from what they can see and read(including what they can read from bots spreading antisemitic conspiracy theories)?

Feel free to disagree, but I don't remember seeing anyone say the marches cause the antisemitism. Just like what Israel does doesn't cause antisemitism. Antisemitism is something the antisemite feels in their heart. In the same way that anti - black racists use black crime rates to excuse their existing hatred.
People are concerned that the antisemitic elements in some of these marches and in the general population are emboldened by some of the rhetoric. Globalise the Intifada etc. It contributes to the general climate but the marches wouldn't cause someone who wasn't a racist to become a racist- I think we can all accept that? The problem as always lies within the actual racists themselves.

Feel free to disagree, but I don't remember seeing anyone say the marches cause the antisemitism.

I think hanging around antisemites can cause antisemitism to spread. I think there's a well-trodden pathway from 'what's happening in Palestine is awful' to 'What Israel is doing in Palestine is awful' to 'Zionism is awful' to 'Zionists are awful' 'to 'Zionists control the media and the government and want to take over the world' to 'Keir Starmer would support Israel wouldn't he, his wife's Jewish'. The marches certainly give an opportunity for people who merely think that what's happening in Palestine is awful to be put in contact with and for want of a better word groomed by people with more extreme views. Social media is probably more effective at it, but walking along with a group of people chanting and then joining in with those chants can be quite exhilarating.

I don't think that guy who 'workshopped the chant' "put the Zios in the ground" started out like that.

It's tricky isn't it.

I can see the pathway you speak about, and I can also see a pathway for vulnerable people ( such as the Golders Green stabber ) to become radicalized especially when antisemitism seems to be acceptable as long as it's referred to as antizionism. But I think most people are capable of critical thinking and nuance and can avoid their deep distress at what they see Israel doing becoming full fledged antisemitism. Some, but not all. I guess I believe those who allow their critical of Israel stance to blossom into hatred were the ones that were carrying the hatred all along anyway. They are now just more emboldened to speak- and act ( as we've seen in recent antisemitic violence ).

Its really hard ( but important ) to unpick.

I do think humans are prone to racism as a logical progression of tribalism. And I think its important for everyone to be aware of that and deeply question themselves.

I agree that attending a march wouldn't make someone "turn racist" that didn't have racist tendencies before. Sometimes we see on MN people who seem very decent say that they have attended pro Palestinian marches for good, decent reasons. They want to show support for the people of Gaza which is fair enough, and don't want to associate with those calling for death to the IDF or Globalise the Intifada or whatever.

It's more the accumulation of marches almost every weekend that has become a problem in the UK I think and the scary element within them that will shout hateful phrases. They are the ones who seek to turn what should be a peaceful demonstration into something much darker.

I can't want the marches banned or even made static. I know you disagree. I think they are a bellweather for the climate of the nation. I think its important we see it and its out there in the open.
I just wish the tone was different. I just wish they'd more frequently call for Hamas to fuck off which would be the best thing for Palestinians. And also that they'd stop shouting hateful things ( the proportion of them that do whatever that proportion is. )
Basically that they think more like me 😇. Which is the problem with banning marches isn't it? Banning people who think a different way to the way I do.

Yes I would like to see them made static but I see your point too.

I don't think we can ban marches but we can change the way they operate so they cost less money to police and don't intimidate so many people.

Would have been good if the TR one could have been contained a bit more too, but at least it is - what, an annual event? It's the regularity of the pro Palestine marches - the cumulative impact - that is making some question whether there should be a temporary ban.

I don't like to think of people being intimidated by them either. I want them to stop but of their own accord.

That would be good if some do and who knows - maybe some who have attended these protests for purely peaceful reasons (most participants I assume), are listening to what the Jewish community are telling them and moving to other forms of peaceful protest.

List of relevant London demonstrations more recently ie since 2021
( obviously there are others around the country )

London Pro Palestinian marches
( some also for specific related causes eg. against Israeli detention, Palestine Action proscription and in support of the humanitarian aid Flotillas )

2021 - 4 and 1 static demo
Info missing for 2022
2023 - 9 and 2 static demos
2024 - 7 and 7 static demos many of them sit ins at various Unis
2025 - 7 and 13 static demos including students at 4 London Unis walking out and PAction awareness etc
2026 - 5 and 2 static demos including against PA proscription as a terrorist organisation