WM police at fault for banning Israelis in Birmingham

[mids2019]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cze83gw4w2xo

This quite frankly stinks. It seems to me the police have succumbed to local anti Semitic politicians and a vocal Muslim majority in the local area of the stadium to ban Israeli fans with what looked like fabricated reasons.

If the West Midlands Police have the intelligence they say they have on the potential threat, it shouldn't be a problem for them to provide it.

Would be good for them to provide the evidence anyway because as things stand at the moment, it looks like they may have just bowed to local pressure.

I don't personally put a lot of faith in police honesty based on a personal experience so think it's good that they should be made to provide proof of their claims.

Perhaps WMP had some sort of dodgy dossier given to them, it's important to know what info was acted on and where it came from. A bit of sunlight.

We are in a no trust society now. The Police and media have themselves to blame.

The club's fans have a reputation for violence in Israel - like Millwall back in th 80s. It's perfectly reasonable to have decided they were a risk.

Absolutely.

I remember a time when society used to trust the police and BBC as institutions but those days are long gone.

I think that given the reputation of the fans, the political situation with Israel and Palestine, and the ethnic and faith background of many people in the Aston area, it was the correct decision. There was a total recipe for trouble of some sort and I think that police have got enough to do. Policing that sort of event takes officers off the street, and Birmingham has crime enough, they are supposedly increasing police presence in the city centre following the murder of a woman waiting at a bus stop a couple of weeks ago.

Where did you find information stating that? They’re not on any published list of dangerous football fans like other countries supporters are.

Do you think that attacks on them in Amsterdam were defensive then?

What reputation? What was their reputation before Amsterdam?

What has the ethnic and faith background of people in the area got to do with a football match?

Who do you think needed protecting?

They've had a reputation for thuggery for years.

In 2020 and 2021 they attacked anti-Netanyahu demonstrators in Israel with bottles and bats. There's been frequent violence between them and a rival Tel Aviv team.

Maccabee 'ultra' fans hospitalised a bloke in Athens for having a Palestinian flag in March '24. A match held in Italy was behind closed doors because of the risk of violence.

In Amsterdam they went to a squat where pro-Palestinian activists were living, ripped down the flags, tried to get in and chanted "Death to Arabs". They kicked in the door of a woman who had a "free Palestine" poster in a window. They attacked Muslim taxi drivers. They went through Amsterdam looking to start violence.

This was the night before the match.

Yes, there was disgraceful violence from Muslim taxi drivers and lads on scooters the next night. And also some more from the same 'ultras'.

The Maccabee 'ultras' shout chants about killing Arabs and raping Arab women - there is a lot of footage over recent months of this according to the police.

This isn't an antisemitism issue. It's a football hooligan issue.

Does anyone remember the times the left said there were no no go areas in the UK?😂

This was more about the fact the fans were Israeli than any perceived reputation of violence when we all know every football club in the world has its share of idiots.

The police should be honest and say they had no means to guarantee the fans' safety in Aston which is a really scary admission by.a major police force. There was also the input of a number of Muslim Birmingham MPs to ban the fans, not out if a safety, but as a confirmed intent to 'punish' Israeli sport as a result of conflict.

It is a slippery slope from saying Israeli fans aren't safe in Birmingham to Israelis aren't safe to Jews aren't safe. I think we deserve answers.

This was more about the fact the fans were Israeli than any perceived reputation of violence when we all know every football club in the world has its share of idiots.

No it wasn't.

You are sounding like you are trying to make a political point here rather than actually going on the police intelligence.
It isn't that uncommon for travelling fans to be banned.
Indeed, after the fans behaviour in between the announcement and the actual match, the fans rioted and caused all sorts of issues at another match, and the club itself made an announcement they would not take any tickets offered as they didn't want those fans traveling in their name.

Perhaps try basing your posts of facts rather than trying re-stir up trouble because of your own bias.

It is a slippery slope from saying Israeli fans aren't safe in Birmingham to Israelis aren't safe to Jews aren't safe. I think we deserve answers.

That's not what the police said. There was a significant risk of violence - not just to Israeli Maccabee fans, but from them. They have a track record of violence and disruption going back years. They whip up racial hatred and attack people they perceive to be Musim or pro-Palestinian.

In no way was it the police saying "we can't let Israeli people in Birmingham because the Brummies will harm them," like you're implying. It was "at a time of heightened feelings, it would be dangerous to let a group of violent football hooligans who chant anti-Arab racial hatred come over to stir up trouble."

Perfectly sensible, I'd have thought. If you don't want to be banned from matches, don't be a violent thug.

Other posters have explained here about the reputation of the travelling Israeli fans, so I’m not going to repeat, but, yes, a risk of violence to both the Villa fans and in the community. Plus if they had been allowed to travel and attend there would have been a huge risk of backlash within the community within Aston and more widely in Birmingham. I recall there was some trouble as it was. As I say, Birmingham has its own troubles aplenty, it doesn’t need any more being brought in from travelling football fans. Police are stretched enough. There are police having to patrol bin collections for heavens sake! Let alone little things like knife crime (sarcasm intended). It was absolutely the correct decision.

Maccabi Tel Aviv fans were seen firing fireworks at their manager’s apartment last night

https://x.com/i_ammukhtar/status/1995238175669956887?s=46

Presumably this was due to their recent poor form. Please explain why so many people are determined to defend this behaviour?

Got a better source than this? As this is just what a guy on X is saying & he has a very obvious anti Israel agenda based on his other posts.

We don’t know who are the people setting fireworks off or who they are targeting or why without more reputable verification.

This again. They didn't "attack muslim taxi drivers". Those taxi drivers had organised a pre planned "jew hunt" of maccabi fans. That's why some of them went to jail. Why do people continue to spread lies about this when the evidence is all out there.

MTA has been charged by UEFA after their fans were racist in Stuttgart.

Please tell me how this continued behaviour is actually just anti semitism?

https://x.com/robharris/status/2001344992636465446?s=46

Following on from Stuttgart, where MTA fans picked up a fine and a ban, it looks like the West Midlands police were right all along. Well done to them for resisting the political pressure.

From Joshua Rozenberg (previously legal correspondent at the BBC for many years)

The West Midlands chief constable Craig Guildford will again face searching questions from the Commons home affairs committee this afternoon about arrangements for policing a Europa League match between Aston Villa and Maccabi Tel Aviv last year. Birmingham City Council representatives will also give evidence to MPs.
Supporters of the Israeli club were initially banned from attending the match on 6 November after an assessment by the local safety advisory group. West Midlands police claimed Maccabi Tel Aviv fans who had attended a match in Amsterdam a year earlier had thrown passers-by into canals and attacked Muslim communities, requiring the deployment of thousands of Dutch officers.

Craig Guildford giving evidence to MPs last month
Guildford stood by the allegations even after police in the Netherlands dismissed them as untrue or misleading. At what was meant to be a one-off evidence session before the committee on 1 December, said he believed the account given by his chief inspector.
Guildford was also questioned about a police intelligence report that referred to an entirely fictitious match between the Tel Aviv club and West Ham. Asked whether the report had been created using AI, he blamed the false reference on “social media scraping”.
The committee chair, Dame Karen Bradley, put questions to Guildford’s assistant chief constable, Mike O’Hara:

But this was not true. In a letter to the committee sent on 19 December, Guildford said:
We can confirm that there is no documented feedback from Jewish representatives prior to the decision being communicated which expressed support for the ban on Maccabi Tel Aviv fans…
ACC O’Hara and I would like to take this opportunity to formally apologise to the Home Affairs Select Committee for any confusion caused and would like to reassure you that there was never any intention to mislead whatsoever.
Two days ago, the Telegraph reported that three of the eight Muslim organisations that the force had consulted as part of its community engagement drive had hosted preachers who promoted antisemitic conspiracy theories or called for the death of Jews.
The Sunday Times accused West Midlands police of producing false evidence to justify banning Israeli fans from the away match. The force was said to have drawn up the intelligence after the local council said privately it had been challenged over the decision and needed a “clearer rationale”.
Leaked minutes from a safety advisory group meeting said the police had initially agreed to operate on the assumption of “no away fans” in what was described as “the absence of intelligence”.
A summary of a closed-doors meeting on 7 October reported by BBC News said that the force’s preference had been based on what one officer described as “conversations with piers [sic] and my professional judgment”.
The Sunday Times said:
The force only produced significant and “new” intelligence about Maccabi’s fanbase after a Birmingham council staff member confided that they had faced questions and been asked to obtain information to pre-empt criticism or claims of anti-Jewish sentiment.
Nick Timothy, the Conservative MP for West Suffolk, said the new paperwork showed West Midlands Police had invented its claims to fit a political decision made in response to local pressure.
He wrote:
Some might care little about foreign football fans. But this scandal is far more serious. It is about whether we can trust the police to do their vital work without fear or favour — and who holds the power in modern, multicultural Britain.
MPs will be able to judge today whether Guildford and his officers deserve that trust.

That article is from Rozenberg's substack, published this morning.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0y8kl8kxeo

WM police to be held to account for being economical with the truth. If the parliamentary committee does its job may be we can shed some light on how local MPs, councillors and community leaders simply wanted Jews out the city.

SharonEllis
Guildford was also questioned about a police intelligence report that referred to an entirely fictitious match between the Tel Aviv club and West Ham. Asked whether the report had been created using AI, he blamed the false reference on “social media scraping”.

Also of note from the first evidence session (I watched the original evidence session at the beginning of Dec - not the latest one yet) - West Midlands Police did not contact the Met Police to ask how policing of the 'fictitious' West Ham match went - despite claiming that the match took place in November 2023 - which was shortly after the 7th October attacks and during heightened tensions in London. Very sloppy police work all round from WMP.

I thought Lord Mann was an impressive witness during the first evidence session. As well as being the Government's Independent Adviser on Antisemitism, he is also the Chairman of Leeds United Supporters Club - therefore had a wealth of relevant expertise and knowledge regarding travelling football fans. Chief Constable Craig Guildford was smug throughout.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jan/08/jewish-communities-frustrated-maccabi-tel-aviv-ban-birmingham-west-midlands

So basically the police grossly exaggerated d evidence to justify the exclusion of Jewish fans for this game including using google. The police were pressured by the local community leaders and councillors to ban first seek reasons later. I

What is worrying in large cities like Birmingham is that openly anti Semitic councillors can sit at a high level and give advice to policing foeces. This is simply not right and those that hold such openly anti Semitic views should be held to account despite political office.

Police ‘lied and lied again’ over Maccabi fan ban

West Midlands Police “lied and lied again” to justify a ban on Israeli fans attending a Europa League football match at Aston Villa, an MP has said.

Nick Timothy said key intelligence was missing from the official reports of meetings where the decision was made.

It adds to the pressure on Craig Guildford, the force’s chief constable, to resign over the recommendation that Maccabi Tel Aviv fans should be banned from the match at Villa Park, in Birmingham, last November.

Kemi Badenoch, the Conservative leader, has claimed that the force capitulated to “Islamists” in the local community demanding a ban and then “collaborated with them to cover it up”.

Both Mrs Badenoch and Mr Timothy say Mr Guildford’s position is now untenable and he should be sacked.

West Midlands Police cited alleged violent behaviour by Maccabi fans during a Europa League fixture against Ajax in Amsterdam in 2024 as justification for the ban. However, the accuracy of the claims were disputed by Dutch police.

The Birmingham city council board that made the ultimate decision to ban the fans included two councillors who had called for the boycott of Maccabi Tel Aviv.

Documents released this week show that police had received “high confidence intelligence” on Sep 5 last year of “elements of the community in the West Midlands wanting to ‘arm’ themselves”.

Yet there is no mention of this in the minutes of a public safety committee, attended by the police and councillors.

In fact, police expressed a preference for a ban on away fans “in absence of intelligence” despite being in possession of the facts for a month by then.

The police had originally planned for a limited number of visiting fans to attend the Europa League game, and say they only decided to recommend a total ban after speaking to Dutch police about the Israeli fans’ behaviour at a previous match in Amsterdam. But the Dutch police have now disputed West Midlands Police’s claims, saying they are exaggerated.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/01/07/police-lied-maccabi-fan-ban-aston-villa-israel-muslim-armed/