Israel committing genocide in Gaza, world’s top scholars on the crime say

[Everexpanding]

An overwhelming majority of members of the world’s leading genocide scholars’ association have backed a resolution stating that Israel’s actions in Gaza meet the legal definition of the crime.
Eighty-six per cent of those who voted in the 500-member International Association of Genocide Scholars (IAGS) supported the motion. The resolution states that “Israel’s policies and actions in Gaza meet the legal definition of genocide in article II of the United Nations convention for the prevention and punishment of the crime of genocide (1948).”

www.theguardian.com/world/2025/sep/01/israel-committing-genocide-in-gaza-worlds-top-scholars-on-the-say

Gosh, what a weak response.

Actually, what’s happening in Gaza is not comparable to “private discussions” in WWII or Rwanda. We are seeing public statements from multiple senior Israeli officials- Smotrich, Ben-Gvir, Gallant, Amichay Eliyahu, Vaturi- openly talking about starving 2 million people, erasing Gaza, bombing food and aid depots, and suggesting that there are “no uninvolved civilians.” These are not private musings; they’re published and reported. One can only imagine what they say behind closed doors!

Meanwhile, the West Bank looks different because Israel has not implemented the same level of siege, starvation, and mass destruction there: yet. Annexation plans are being floated, but right now Gaza is experiencing complete blockade, destruction of neighborhoods, hospitals, schools, and daily civilian deaths.

Intent to commit genocide doesn’t only exist on paper or in “minutes of meetings.” It can be inferred from the repeated, systematic, publicly stated targeting of a civilian population, coupled with actions that make survival impossible. Waiting to see if the West Bank suffers the same fate doesn’t negate what’s happening now. This isn’t speculation- it’s documented public intent combined with the ongoing mass killing and starvation of civilians.

Gaza's 2025 population is now estimated at 823,407. In 1950, the population of Gaza was 63,444. Gaza has grown by 22,771 in the last year, which represents a 2.84% annual change.These population estimates and projections come from the latest revision of the UN World Urbanization Prospects. These estimates represent the Urban agglomeration of Gaza, which typically includes Gaza's population in addition to adjacent suburban areas.

Shhh. We just ignore those ones, those ones are brushed off as unimportant. So what if the minister for defence says genocidal things, hes just the minister for defence he doesn't actually count or something like that. So what if their Prime minister babbles on about the Amalek before displacing pretty much every Palestinian and then starving them he's just kidding around. What we should really be concerned about are people on boats trying to bring aid into Gaza and football matches displaying signs saying 'Stop killing children', they are the bad guys here.

Gosh, what a weak response.

Lol.

Actually, what’s happening in Gaza is not comparable to “private discussions” in WWII or Rwanda.

Again, these discussions weren’t “private”; they were your typical Government meetings discussing Government policy I.e. the extermination of the Jewish people or the Tutsi’s.

We are seeing public statements from multiple senior Israeli officials- Smotrich, Ben-Gvir, Gallant, Amichay Eliyahu, Vaturi- openly talking about starving 2 million people, erasing Gaza, bombing food and aid depots, and suggesting that there are “no uninvolved civilians.” These are not private musings; they’re published and reported. One can only imagine what they say behind closed doors!

This doesn’t meet the criteria for proving intent.

These are simply comments made by ministers who are not involved in the decision making process of the war. These comments don’t reflect Government policy that is being discussed and implemented.

It only matters what they are saying in public or behind closed doors, if these conversations are informing Goverment policy.

Meanwhile, the West Bank looks different because Israel has not implemented the same level of siege, starvation, and mass destruction there: yet. Annexation plans are being floated, but right now Gaza is experiencing complete blockade, destruction of neighborhoods, hospitals, schools, and daily civilian deaths.

The West Bank looks different because it did not carry out the 7/10 attack, and therefore Israel has no reason to go to war with the West Bank in the way it has with Gaza. Sure, Israel does have to deal with terrorism from the West Bank, but not on the scale of 7/10. No country has seen a terrorist attack on that scale before. It was rather unprecedented.

Intent to commit genocide doesn’t only exist on paper or in “minutes of meetings.” It can be inferred from the repeated, systematic, publicly stated targeting of a civilian population, coupled with actions that make survival impossible.

Inferring intent, rather than having actual evidence of intent, is an extremely high threshold to meet especially given the way Hamas have chosen to conduct the war with regards to their civilian population. Having actual evidence of intent, I.e. minutes of Government meetings, direct orders given etc would be essential.

Waiting to see if the West Bank suffers the same fate doesn’t negate what’s happening now. This isn’t speculation- it’s documented public intent combined with the ongoing mass killing and starvation of civilians.

If Israel intended to commit genocide of the Palestinian people, the West Bank wouldn’t be spared the same fate as Gaza.

Yet, it has.

direct orders given to IDF troops etc. That is intent.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-06-27/ty-article-magazine/.premium/idf-soldiers-ordered-to-shoot-deliberately-at-unarmed-gazans-waiting-for-humanitarian-aid/00000197-ad8e-de01-a39f-ffbe33780000

Do you have a link with actual access to the article, not just the headline?

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/7/2/death-or-food-the-palestinians-killed-by-israel-at-gazas-aid-centres

https://www.hrw.org/news/2025/08/01/gaza-israeli-killings-of-palestinians-seeking-food-are-war-crimes

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-military-orders-war-crime-probe-into-gaza-shootings-paper-says-2025-06-27

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BA2N9UAsp88

https://www.genocidewatch.com/single-post/israeli-soldiers-killed-at-least-410-people-at-food-aid-sites-in-gaza-this-month

https://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/latest/us-backed-aid-distribution-points-gaza-are-sites-orchestrated-killing

That might be a war crime. Its not genocide. Armies are given orders to shoot at civilians in lots of wars. Doesn't make it right but not proof of genocide.

Public statements by multiple senior Israeli ministers advocating starvation, bombing hospitals and aid, and claiming “no uninvolved civilians,” combined with the systematic destruction of Gaza neighbourhoods and daily civilian deaths, is exactly how intent can be inferred under international law. Waiting for the West Bank to ‘suffer the same fate’ before recognising intent is moving the goalposts. What’s happening in Gaza- repeated, targeted attacks on civilians making survival impossible- is evidence enough.

Absolutely a war crime.

And when senior officials publicly call for starving, eradicating, and bombing an entire civilian population, that’s exactly the kind of deliberate targeting that can indicate genocidal intent.

I can’t even read the article to check, but it would 100% be a war crime.

When I said “direct orders given”, I knew the first thing people would do was google to see what they could find to “prove” that this has happened.

Incidents like this, quite clearly do not meet the criteria.

Orders given to conduct the rounding up and mass shootings of Jewish people during WW2, the direct orders given to kill Tutsi’s and repeated over radio broadcasts etc, would meet the criteria.

The deliberate refusal to understand the difference is incredibly frustrating.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-07-21/ty-article/report-idf-shot-at-gazans-holding-white-flags-near-aid-site-reservist-says/00000198-2c2b-d19d-abbe-ae2f5eb60000

I’d actually be harder pressed to find what the IDF haven’t done: bombing “safe zones,” hospitals, schools, aid convoys, systematically blocking food, water, and medical supplies- and, as if that weren’t enough, IDF soldiers themselves have testified they were ordered to fire on unarmed crowds at distribution points, even when no threat existed.

So wait, where did your earlier 2m figure come from? I thought you said it was 2m in 2023? And now it’s 823k?

Israeli soldiers had shot toward Palestinians holding white flags outside an officially approved route near an aid distribution center in Gaza in mid-June, the Wall Street Journal reported Sunday, citing an IDF combat reservist.

The Gazans had approached the soldiers despite calls to stay back. "We have an unwritten rule that if you are worried and they get too close and you see that it could be something that puts you and your team at risk, you don't take that risk."

So if Israel were saying similar in government meetings, that would show intent? But we will only know what was said in these meetings in the years to come (if ever). Again - we know so much about the despicable acts of the Nazis after the fact (and because they lost). Unless you are privy to Israeli cabinet meetings and can confirm that nothing with genocidal intent has been communicated by any of the ministers in the cabinet, then we are in the same position as before. Unsure what the Israeli motive is. Which is why we then need to listen to what the Israeli government is communicating in public.

You say these politicians have no power: so the PM, President, Defence/Finance Minister and National Security minister have no say in policy/the war? Who on earth is making decisions then?! I’d be thrilled if it wasn’t these people but I’m not sure how you can argue that these are powerless MPs who happen to make genocidal comments but can do no real harm. Perhaps you believe they say all this in public and then spend actual cabinet meetings discussing how to fix the aid disaster they created. You do not, as far as I know, have access to cabinet meeting minutes so your defence is very weak.

I am not claiming they are committing genocide in the West Bank at this time, but the Israeli government actively supports terrorism through settler violence there and they appear to be using the awful shooting this week as a reason to annex the whole place. The same ‘powerless’ ministers above have pushed though a huge settlement development effectively splitting the WB and have said they want to destroy the idea of a Palestinian state. For context, I think the average settler violence attacks in WB is 4 a day. It is encouraged by the government and supervised by the IDF/Israeli police. Palestinians are arrested for fighting for their homes. Children are arrested and tried as adults in military court proceedings. Anyone who thinks the WB isn’t set for the same cycle of violence as Gaza is naive - it’s already happening.

I think I’ve explained myself clearly enough - but I’ll try again.

The Nazi’s held Government meetings over a long period of time, in which they discussed and implemented the final solution as Government policy. That is evidence of intent of genocide.

It doesn’t matter what the ministers you have quoted have said, unless their comments are being discussed and implemented as Government policy. If so, that is evidence of intent of genocide.

So if Israel were saying similar in government meetings, that would show intent?

If these comments were informing Goverment policy, then yes. On their own as the comments currently stand, no.

You do not, as far as I know, have access to cabinet meeting minutes so your defence is very weak.

This is not MY defence, this is what evidence of intent looks like. Sorry.

Unless you are privy to Israeli cabinet meetings and can confirm that nothing with genocidal intent has been communicated by any of the ministers in the cabinet, then we are in the same position as before. Unsure what the Israeli motive is. Which is why we then need to listen to what the Israeli government is communicating in public.

You don’t think that the horror of what happened on 7/10 is enough of a motive?

It would be enough motive for any other country to go to war, why is it not enough motive for Israel?

The Israeli Government could be holding meetings over a long period of time, in which they discussed and implemented the genocide in Gaza as Government policy. Why would their rhetoric in public be the opposite of their meeting points/policy? Not to mention the fact that what ministers have said has actually happened - “no food in Gaza” “Gaza will be entirely destroyed” - matches up, doesn’t it? They say, they do it, they get criticised. Like I’ve said before, this isn’t confined to be a legal genocide but you cannot blame people for being concerned by this rhetoric and the scale of destruction and the humanitarian crisis in Gaza. The ICJ case is ongoing. I am not saying there is definitely a genocide - that’s not my place - but claiming that these aren’t powerful people and then claiming their words not matter makes no sense. I would never say that Hamas have spoken about destroying Israel and then committed horrendous acts on 7/10 but we can’t be sure whether their words and actions are linked.

Apologies - I didn’t mean to suggest there could only be one motive. 7/10 justified retaliation towards Hamas. It didn’t justify collective punishment. Israel is very capable of waging war against Hamas and destroying Gaza at the same time.

Israel is very capable of waging war against Hamas and destroying Gaza at the same time.

For me, the thing is that in waging war against Hamas they must demolish an entire mycelium of tunnels beneath Gaza. It is hard to imagine how they could do that without causing utter devastation above ground. That they have somehow managed to do this without a much, much higher death rate does not match up with the genocidal threats voiced by some of the loonies in Israeli government.

You too can become a "top scholar" of genocide for 125 dollars a year. https://genocidescholars.org/join/
Top scholars my a..e - literally anyone can become a member.

Interesting - what about agricultural areas being flattened? Or even just saving hospitals because they can’t evacuate them fully? I get that some buildings are being used by Hamas but I feel that the hospitals in question have been, first and foremost, hospitals looking after sick and injured people. And I understand destroying buildings to access the tunnels but do you have to flatten everything then go in and destroy tunnels? Or, as I said, destroy agricultural areas where there are no tunnel entrances?

And the death rate question is tbc - no accurate figures available yet. I find it interesting that Israel say Hamas numbers are wrong but don’t provide any of their own information to try and balance out the propaganda. Either, they don’t know how much harm they are doing with all this destruction or they know and don’t want to share the figures.

I understand destroying buildings to access the tunnels but do you have to flatten everything then go in and destroy tunnels? Or, as I said, destroy agricultural areas where there are no tunnel entrances?
"No tunnel entrances" does not mean "no tunnels." The system extends way beyond the city limits. Reuters has a very interesting illustrated article (linked below) about the "Gaza metro" that helps to explain what Israel is up against: one tunnel, which had a "passageway, wide enough to drive a car through, emerged in a sand dune at the northern edge of the Gaza Strip, just 100 meters south of Israel’s Erez military checkpoint, which controls all pedestrian access from Israel into Gaza." The tunnels are, of course, deep and reinforced with concrete and iron -- Hamas had plenty of Qatar wealth to invest in them. So again, you need very high impact to do any damage to them. Hamas have being planning all this for many years.

I find it interesting that Israel say Hamas numbers are wrong but don’t provide any of their own information to try and balance out the propaganda.
How are Israel to "balance out the propaganda" by providing more accurate figures about how many Hamas vs civilians have been killed, when no one can tell them apart? Hamas, of course, describes everyone as a civilian. If Israel describes anyone as a terrorist, such as a "journalist" kissing Sinwar, no one believes them anyway, it's all Hasbara apparently.

The death rates are available online from various sources, including an Al-Jazeera live tracker. The latter, obviously, doesn't estimate % of population because Hamas likes to give the impression that 99.9% of Gazan civilians have been "murdered" by Israel. Their propaganda is very powerful and certainly seems to be working in the West.

Either, they don’t know how much harm they are doing with all this destruction or they know and don’t want to share the figures.
So basically they're either stupid or evil, or both?

Based on the evidence, my view is that Israel is clearly focusing on (1) destroying Hamas infrastructure (the tunnels) and (2) killing Hamas leaders -- including most recently in Qatar, at great risk to themselves since their allies will naturally distance themselves from that for their own safety.

Given the widespread support for Hamas in Gaza, and the participation of "civilian" mobs in the atrocities of 7/10, I think Israel could be forgiven for a more knee-jerk reaction than the very targeted response they have carried out over the past 2 years. It's all very well reading the rule book to condemn their every move, but fighting hidden terrorists presents some rather special conditions and history is being rewritten with this particular conflict. I have a feeling that when their mistakes and crimes are picked over and punished, they will also be commended for a military strategy that minimised harm to the Gazan population in general. As well as ingenious solutions such as the pagers.

There is a lot to learn from this situation and I hope we never face it ourselves.

www.reuters.com/graphics/ISRAEL-PALESTINIANS/GAZA-TUNNELS/gkvldmzorvb/

The tunnels are, of course, deep and reinforced with concrete and iron -- Hamas had plenty of Qatar wealth to invest in them. So again, you need very high impact to do any damage to them.

I shared that very article on here a few weeks ago - it’s very interesting. Either that or another article (which I can find) explains how you can’t destroy the tunnels from the surface - as you say, they’re very well made. If they could bomb them from ground level, their approach would actually make much more sense to me. But the destruction above ground is not to actively destroy the tunnels. So you have to go into the tunnels to achieve that military aim. So Israel is destroying everything above ground, clearing it away, then going into the tunnels and checking and destroying them. My question is whether the scale of the above ground destruction is necessary when they still need to go into each tunnel to check it. They do this because of the hostage, by the way. I believe they discussed just flooding the tunnels but the hostages obviously need to be thought about.

And yes, Israel (under BN in his last term) allowed Qatar to give money to Hamas. No one is innocent here sadly.

I’m pretty sure plenty of people would believe figures provided by Israel. I’m sure governments would put a lot of weight on them. But saying “it’s not that many” and providing no alternative figure is not a very convincing argument. Any other source is Hamas linked so why not at least try and share the ‘truth’ with us?

Based on the evidence, my view is that Israel is clearly focusing on (1) destroying Hamas infrastructure (the tunnels) and (2) killing Hamas leaders -- including most recently in Qatar, at great risk to themselves since their allies will naturally distance themselves from that for their own safety.

As discussed, they are destroying pretty much all infrastructure in Gaza (not just the tunnels) displacing millions of people. And putting more Israeli lives at risk by escalating the conflict by involving Qatar.

Where does withholding aid fit into the two part plan above? Or militarising aid? Or allowing very little aid in? Or denying starvation? Or building huge settlements in the WB? Or discussing annexing the WB? Or calling Gazans humane animals? Or saying they want to destroy the idea of a Palestinian state?

fighting hidden terrorists presents some rather special conditions and history is being rewritten with this particular conflict
I agreed that the rules are being rewritten and I think it is a dangerous precedent to set. What do you think Putin makes of all of this? It’s all done when one of our own (liberal democracy) is doing this but what if everyone decides to follow suit? Do you want people bombed in London because they have enemies abroad? Do you want collective punishment to be acceptable? Or for aid to be militarised when you need it? If you are accepting or even supporting Israel’s approach to this war, then you are accepting that you’d be okay to be at the receiving end of all this ingenuity. Because you cannot limit these actions to the ‘good guys’. Israel doing it without consequence means anyone can do it. The issue with Western democracies is we never think it’ll be us. But one day, it could be and then we’ll realise what we’ve done

@PinkBobby I see what you mean (and sorry about re-sharing "your" article!). And I take your points about setting a precedent. But re Qatar, it's a tricky one because you can't kill an octopus by just cutting off its tentacles.

I'm obviously no more a military strategist than I am a law specialist 😖, but I wouldn't fancy going into one of those tunnels via a building that may be booby-trapped and is likely to be closely guarded.

Also, personally, if people in London had orchestrated attacks like 7/10 and promised plenty more where that came from, I would absolutely accept the consequences if the victims retaliated.

@Beachtastic do you think Northern Ireland should have been bombed by the Uk government in the 1980s?
would we have peace now if it had been?