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Conflict in the Middle East

Trump gives update on possible Gaza ceasefire

56 replies

Twiglets1 · 28/06/2025 10:51

Donald Trump says that a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas in Gaza is “close” and could be reached “within the next week”.

  • He made the comments late on Friday, indicating he had spoken with individuals involved in the ongoing negotiations.
  • The US administration has been working on a deal following Israel's strikes in April, which shattered a previous two-month truce.
  • Hamas has expressed willingness to release remaining hostages under a deal to end the war, while Israel insists on Hamas being disarmed and dismantled.
  • Israeli Minister for Strategic Affairs Ron Dermer is scheduled to visit Washington for talks with Trump administration officials regarding Gaza, Iran, and a potential visit by Benjamin Netanyahu.

https://www.independent.co.uk/bulletin/news/gaza-ceasefire-israel-hamas-trump-b2778708.html

Trump gives major update on possible Gaza ceasefire

https://www.independent.co.uk/bulletin/news/gaza-ceasefire-israel-hamas-trump-b2778708.html

OP posts:
BreakingBroken · 28/06/2025 15:21

I would be nice wouldn’t it.
Frustratingly he is a continent away, head of a different country, prone to media ops and attention seeking.
Eventually it will happen with or without US involvement and honestly for lasting peace it really needed to be a local solution.

Twiglets1 · 29/06/2025 11:43

Once again, Trump has called today for a peace deal on fighting in Gaza.

The alternative if Hamas don't agree soon to a ceasefire on Israel's terms could be awful for their civilians.

Sky News reporting this morning that Israel has issued an evacuation warning to Palestinians in Gaza City and Jabalia.

The warning was shared on social media by Avichay Adraee, the Israeli Defence Force (IDF) spokesperson for Arab media.
People were told to leave the named areas and move south.
Adraee said that the IDF was "operating with extreme force" and warned "these military operations will escalate, intensify and extend westward to the city centre to destroy the capabilities of terrorist organisations."
The areas listed as needing to be evacuated were: The Gaza City and Jabalia areas, and the neighbourhoods of al Zaytoun East, Old Town, Turkmen, Ajdida, al Tuffah, al Daraj, al Sabra, Jabalia Town, Jabalia Nazla, Jabalia Camp, al Rawda, al Nahda, al Zuhur, al Nur, al Salam, and Tal al Zaatar.
The majority of the population in Gaza has been displaced since the 7 October attacks.
Israel has often issued such warnings, and tends to follow them up with strikes it says are aimed at Hamas fighters.

https://news.sky.com/story/middle-east-live-make-the-deal-in-gaza-trump-posts-as-dozens-killed-in-israeli-strike-on-tehran-prison-13389979

Middle East live: 'MAKE THE DEAL IN GAZA,' Trump posts - as 11 killed in Israeli strikes

Donald Trump posts: "MAKE THE DEAL IN GAZA! GET THE HOSTAGES BACK!!!" But it remains unclear how close a ceasefire is. It comes as Israeli strikes overnight killed at least 11 people, according to medics. Listen to Trump 100 as you scroll.

https://news.sky.com/story/middle-east-live-make-the-deal-in-gaza-trump-posts-as-dozens-killed-in-israeli-strike-on-tehran-prison-13389979

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 30/06/2025 08:42

Netanyahu says ‘opportunities have opened up’ to free hostages, as Trump demands Gaza ‘deal’

Speaking at a Shin Bet security agency facility in southern Israel on Sunday, Netanyahu said, “As you probably know, many opportunities have opened up now following this victory. Firstly, to rescue the hostages. Of course, we will also need to solve the Gaza issue, defeat Hamas, but I believe we will accomplish both missions.”

Netanyahu’s comments mark one of the first times he has clearly prioritized the return of the hostages over the defeat of Hamas - seemingly downplaying the latter.

For months, Netanyahu has prioritized the defeat of Hamas in Gaza and talked about a “total victory.” At the beginning of May, he called defeating Hamas the “supreme objective,” not freeing the hostages.

His comments Sunday mark a potentially significant change in how he has talked about Israel’s goals in the war.

edition.cnn.com/2025/06/29/middleeast/netanyahu-hostages-opportunity-iran-intl-latam

OP posts:
ChubbyMorticia · 30/06/2025 08:43

If Trump said the sky was blue I’d double check.

quantumbutterfly · 30/06/2025 10:22

ChubbyMorticia · 30/06/2025 08:43

If Trump said the sky was blue I’d double check.

Funny, because I tend to double check the people that target him, he seems like low hanging fruit and an easy distraction. A good way to bury bad news, as someone in Blair's government might have said.
We all knew Biden was gaga but the gaslighting was marvellous.

A watching brief seems more sensible.

EasternStandard · 30/06/2025 10:28

Hamas being disarmed and dismantled sounds like the hard part. If they do hopefully return the poor hostages.

Dangermoo · 30/06/2025 11:09

quantumbutterfly · 30/06/2025 10:22

Funny, because I tend to double check the people that target him, he seems like low hanging fruit and an easy distraction. A good way to bury bad news, as someone in Blair's government might have said.
We all knew Biden was gaga but the gaslighting was marvellous.

A watching brief seems more sensible.

👏 👏

Twiglets1 · 30/06/2025 13:30

ChubbyMorticia · 30/06/2025 08:43

If Trump said the sky was blue I’d double check.

We all know he has a casual relationship with the truth.

But still, we also know that Netanyahu relies on him and listens to him.

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 02/07/2025 06:36

Trump claims Israel has agreed to 60-day ceasefire in Gaza

US president Donald Trump claimed Israel had agreed to a 60-day ceasefire in Gaza and urged Hamas to accept the deal, warning that conditions “will not get better”.

Fresh from helping broker a truce between Israel and Iran after 12 days of fighting, Mr Trump is reportedly pushing for a breakthrough in Gaza where Israel’s air and ground assault is about to complete 21 months.

The ceasefire deal, apparently months in the making, will represent a major diplomatic milestone if it comes through. But there is no sign that Hamas is ready to agree to the terms laid down by the US and Israel.

Mr Trump made the announcement days before hosting Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu for talks at the White House.

The president has reportedly been ramping up pressure on both Israel and Hamas to finalise a ceasefire and hostage deal.

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/trump-israel-gaza-ceasefire-60-days-b2780832.html

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 02/07/2025 14:22

Hamas 'ready and serious' for ceasefire as Trump says Israel has agreed deal

Hamas has indicated it would be ready to accept a ceasefire agreement with Israel, but stopped short of agreeing to a US-backed offer proposed by US President Donald Trump.

Trump said on Tuesday that Israel had agreed to terms for a 60-day ceasefire in Gaza, during which the US and other parties would work towards an end to the war.

On Wednesday Hamas official Taher al-Nunu said the militant group was "ready and serious regarding reaching an agreement."

However, he reasserted that any deal with Israel must bring an end to the war in Gaza. He said Hamas was "ready to accept any initiative that clearly leads to the complete end to the war."

Trump had earlier pushed Hamas to accept the deal in a social media post.
“I hope, for the good of the Middle East, that Hamas takes this Deal, because it will not get better — IT WILL ONLY GET WORSE,” Trump said.

https://www.itv.com/news/2025-07-02/trump-says-israel-agrees-to-60-day-ceasefire-in-gaza-and-urges-hamas-to-accept

OP posts:
ForgesOfEmpires · 02/07/2025 21:12

I am of Arab decent myself. An atheist though. I have lived in the middle east for half my life. Trump (as much as I despise him) seems to have a pretty good handle on this conflict compared with most western leaders. The truth nobody wants to hear is this:

For the sake of this I will refer to Israelis as Jews and Palestinians as Arabs sometimes, for the sake of simplicity.

Both Jews and Arabs have a legitimate claim to the area that was briefly known as "British Mandate Palestine".

Both have long ranging historical ties to the land, but there is no denying that Jews were there first. Not that who was there first truly matters, they are both connected.

However, it is simply a fact that Jews were made second class citizens in their own homelands by invaders. Not just Arabs, but multiple invaders. They were ethnically cleansed, exiled, and treated appallingly. Up until the day Britain took control of the land, Jews were legal dhimmi - second class under law to Muslims.

The fact they had a minority population by 1917 is evidence of the abuse they'd endured for generations - including it being illegal for them to buy land in their own homeland or hold jobs in government in order that they might have any hope of improving their lot.

People can't live like that enduringly, simple as.

So when the land was divided by the British, was it fair on everyone? No, it was not. Lot of land was divided in the past and it was absolutely never fair on everyone. In1916 life wasn't fair on most people actually.

The answer to the problem is simple acceptance.

The nakba was very sad.

The Jews being expelled similarly from their homes around the middle east and north africa was equally sad.

I am sure both felt the same sense of deep loss and injustice.

But one side decided to move forward and rebuild, and the other side devoted themselves ideologically to the destruction of the other.

Most people who lost a home in 1948 are now dead.

What is much more sad is that people are now fighting and dying and losing their homes NOW over a right which never belonged to them to begin with.

Many things play into the fact that these people, and only these people uniquely on earth refuse to accept things and move forward. One is that our institutions and well meaning westerners play into these revolutionary ideas that in practice just hurt people.

This idea that destroying Israel is some metaphor for capitalism or some other such nonsense has no relationship to reality. The very much capitalist terrorists have been thieving your tax money for decades and are abusing their citizens whilst flying around on private jets.

Religious zealots who believe once conquered Muslim land must always remain Muslim land even if millions of people die in the process do not help either.

And for obvious reasons, the terrorist leaders, who, like every oppressive regime have become very rich off the blood of their people are not in any hurry for the conflict to end!

Those westerners who think there should be one equal rights state are (I am sorry) very uneducated on the middle east.

One equal rights state requires shared values. Jews do not want to live in an Islamic state, and Palestinians do not want to live in a liberal democracy.

The Western idea of "equal rights" exists in your mind as the ideal, but you cannot transfer this to different cultures you know nothing about.

If the citizens of the Palestinian territories wanted gay rights, women's rights, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, the right to fair and public trials, democracy or any of the things that factor into your fantasy of equality then absolutely nobody has been stopping them for decades now.

Their concept of human rights is different to yours. In fact, on the Arab Declaration of human rights one of the first things on it states that all people have a right of self determination. The item directly under this excludes Jews and only Jews from that definition!

My family in some oppressed societies where being gay is considered an abomination and women have to wear hijabs are happy to do that. Do I agree with it? No, I hate that for centuries religion has been used as a tool of bigotry and oppression of women. But that's their choice. Do I think it's justice if that choice is foisted on others? No.

Portraying Israel as the bogeyman, much as people to America, is easy to do, but at the end of the day it's a country like any other. It has had good leaders, bad leaders and some very bad leaders. But they are ultimately no worse than whatever country you live in, and certainly I would not stand for people calling for your destruction any more than I stand for people calling for theirs.

I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

I feel quite shattered thinking of the innocent lives caught up in all this. Those kids living in tents with gunfire everywhere, taught to hate and believe this is the best life has for them. The orphans, the injured, the disabled - it must be horrific. I also feel shattered when I think of the victims of 7 Oct and all their families have endured, as well as the hostages still in Gaza.

What a terrible mess, and really all for absolutely nothing.

I really, really hope those people here who walk around in their keffiyehs are really able to thing about what "Free Palestine" really means. For me it means Hamas and all similar groups are gone and Palestinians are giving normal, happy, safe lives where their reasons for being isn't martyrdom nor murder.

As an Arab person, I strongly feel that Jewish people are my cousins, and that we have so much in common. I hope those calling for violence at music concerts or those harassing Jews around the world realise soon that they are part of the problem.

Any ceasefire will begin when people around the globe truly call out for peace, truly FUND peace and truly help work for peace. And peace cannot exist on the terms many of you demand.

And in the words of Donald: Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Twiglets1 · 03/07/2025 06:40

What an amazing post @ForgesOfEmpires

Thank you so much for taking the time to write such a thoughtful and knowledgeable response.

I agree so much with what you write. I am an atheist too and have no time for religious zealots of any religion. I totally agree with your simple (yet complex) statement that the answer to the problem is simple acceptance.

This paragraph particularly resonated I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 03/07/2025 07:41

The Saudi news outlet Asharq is reporting that Hamas is satisfied with the guarantees to end the Gaza war included in the ceasefire proposal it received.

According to the report, the proposal contains assurances from the mediators that both sides will not resume fighting as long as negotiations are ongoing.

Additionally, it says US President Donald Trump is expected to announce the agreement once both parties have approved it and will serve as the clear sponsor for its implementation.

However, another source close to Hamas tells the outlet that the new proposal presented to the group does not contain any substantial changes from the one submitted by US mediator Steve Witkoff, only includes minor modifications.

According to Asharq, Hamas is expected to deliver its response to the proposed framework on Friday.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog-july-03-2025/

OP posts:
Whatsinanamehey · 03/07/2025 07:56

Its the first time in a very long time that I'm feeling a glimmer of hope that this time the war will really end.

Twiglets1 · 03/07/2025 08:13

Whatsinanamehey · 03/07/2025 07:56

Its the first time in a very long time that I'm feeling a glimmer of hope that this time the war will really end.

I know what you mean ... I feel a little hopeful myself.

OP posts:
User37482 · 03/07/2025 08:20

@ForgesOfEmpires

Excellent post, hands down best I’ve seen on this subject. A really valuable and thoughtful contribution.

Twiglets1 · 03/07/2025 08:29

As part of the hostage release and Gaza ceasefire deal being negotiated, Hamas will not hold public ceremonies while freeing captives, an Israeli defence official and Palestinian source close to the terror group tell the New York Times.

The report notes the proposal being discussed would see the return of 10 living hostages and the remains of 18 captives to Israel, with Hamas releasing them on five separate occasions over the 60-day truce.

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 03/07/2025 08:32

Report: Hamas officials abroad told to hand over weapons as symbolic nod to Israeli demand for disarmament

Senior Hamas officials abroad have been told to hand in their personal weapons amid negotiations for a ceasefire in the Gaza Strip and the release of the remaining Israeli hostages, the Times newspaper reports.

The directive came from Qatari mediators, the Times reports, and is largely a symbolic initiative and a nod to Israel’s demand for Hamas’s disarmament, which the terror group has thus far rejected.

It says that among the senior Hamas officials instructed to hand over their weapons are lead negotiator and senior politburo official Khalil al-Hayya; the Istanbul-based leader of Hamas in the West Bank, Zaher Jabarin; and the chair of Hamas’s Shura Council, Muhammad Ismail Darwish.

www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog-july-03-2025/

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 05/07/2025 06:55

Hamas says it responds to Gaza ceasefire proposal in 'a positive spirit'

Hamas said it had responded on Friday in "a positive spirit" to a U.S.-brokered Gaza ceasefire proposal and was prepared to enter into talks on implementing the deal, which envisages a release of hostages and negotiations on ending the conflict.

In a sign of potential challenges still facing the sides, a Palestinian official of a militant group allied with Hamas said concerns remained over humanitarian aid, passage through the Rafah crossing to Egypt and clarity over a timetable of Israeli troop withdrawals.

Trump expressed optimism late on Friday to reporters aboard Air Force One, who asked about Hamas' response.

"They said they gave me a positive response? Well, that's good," Trump said, adding that he had not yet been briefed. "There could be a Gaza deal next week."

www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-military-kills-15-gaza-trump-waits-hamas-response-ceasefire-proposal-2025-07-04/

OP posts:
SharonEllis · 05/07/2025 07:16

ForgesOfEmpires · 02/07/2025 21:12

I am of Arab decent myself. An atheist though. I have lived in the middle east for half my life. Trump (as much as I despise him) seems to have a pretty good handle on this conflict compared with most western leaders. The truth nobody wants to hear is this:

For the sake of this I will refer to Israelis as Jews and Palestinians as Arabs sometimes, for the sake of simplicity.

Both Jews and Arabs have a legitimate claim to the area that was briefly known as "British Mandate Palestine".

Both have long ranging historical ties to the land, but there is no denying that Jews were there first. Not that who was there first truly matters, they are both connected.

However, it is simply a fact that Jews were made second class citizens in their own homelands by invaders. Not just Arabs, but multiple invaders. They were ethnically cleansed, exiled, and treated appallingly. Up until the day Britain took control of the land, Jews were legal dhimmi - second class under law to Muslims.

The fact they had a minority population by 1917 is evidence of the abuse they'd endured for generations - including it being illegal for them to buy land in their own homeland or hold jobs in government in order that they might have any hope of improving their lot.

People can't live like that enduringly, simple as.

So when the land was divided by the British, was it fair on everyone? No, it was not. Lot of land was divided in the past and it was absolutely never fair on everyone. In1916 life wasn't fair on most people actually.

The answer to the problem is simple acceptance.

The nakba was very sad.

The Jews being expelled similarly from their homes around the middle east and north africa was equally sad.

I am sure both felt the same sense of deep loss and injustice.

But one side decided to move forward and rebuild, and the other side devoted themselves ideologically to the destruction of the other.

Most people who lost a home in 1948 are now dead.

What is much more sad is that people are now fighting and dying and losing their homes NOW over a right which never belonged to them to begin with.

Many things play into the fact that these people, and only these people uniquely on earth refuse to accept things and move forward. One is that our institutions and well meaning westerners play into these revolutionary ideas that in practice just hurt people.

This idea that destroying Israel is some metaphor for capitalism or some other such nonsense has no relationship to reality. The very much capitalist terrorists have been thieving your tax money for decades and are abusing their citizens whilst flying around on private jets.

Religious zealots who believe once conquered Muslim land must always remain Muslim land even if millions of people die in the process do not help either.

And for obvious reasons, the terrorist leaders, who, like every oppressive regime have become very rich off the blood of their people are not in any hurry for the conflict to end!

Those westerners who think there should be one equal rights state are (I am sorry) very uneducated on the middle east.

One equal rights state requires shared values. Jews do not want to live in an Islamic state, and Palestinians do not want to live in a liberal democracy.

The Western idea of "equal rights" exists in your mind as the ideal, but you cannot transfer this to different cultures you know nothing about.

If the citizens of the Palestinian territories wanted gay rights, women's rights, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, the right to fair and public trials, democracy or any of the things that factor into your fantasy of equality then absolutely nobody has been stopping them for decades now.

Their concept of human rights is different to yours. In fact, on the Arab Declaration of human rights one of the first things on it states that all people have a right of self determination. The item directly under this excludes Jews and only Jews from that definition!

My family in some oppressed societies where being gay is considered an abomination and women have to wear hijabs are happy to do that. Do I agree with it? No, I hate that for centuries religion has been used as a tool of bigotry and oppression of women. But that's their choice. Do I think it's justice if that choice is foisted on others? No.

Portraying Israel as the bogeyman, much as people to America, is easy to do, but at the end of the day it's a country like any other. It has had good leaders, bad leaders and some very bad leaders. But they are ultimately no worse than whatever country you live in, and certainly I would not stand for people calling for your destruction any more than I stand for people calling for theirs.

I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

I feel quite shattered thinking of the innocent lives caught up in all this. Those kids living in tents with gunfire everywhere, taught to hate and believe this is the best life has for them. The orphans, the injured, the disabled - it must be horrific. I also feel shattered when I think of the victims of 7 Oct and all their families have endured, as well as the hostages still in Gaza.

What a terrible mess, and really all for absolutely nothing.

I really, really hope those people here who walk around in their keffiyehs are really able to thing about what "Free Palestine" really means. For me it means Hamas and all similar groups are gone and Palestinians are giving normal, happy, safe lives where their reasons for being isn't martyrdom nor murder.

As an Arab person, I strongly feel that Jewish people are my cousins, and that we have so much in common. I hope those calling for violence at music concerts or those harassing Jews around the world realise soon that they are part of the problem.

Any ceasefire will begin when people around the globe truly call out for peace, truly FUND peace and truly help work for peace. And peace cannot exist on the terms many of you demand.

And in the words of Donald: Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Brilliant post, thank you.

EasternStandard · 05/07/2025 07:23

@ForgesOfEmpiresincredible post, you write very well

stonecutter · 06/07/2025 17:46

ForgesOfEmpires · 02/07/2025 21:12

I am of Arab decent myself. An atheist though. I have lived in the middle east for half my life. Trump (as much as I despise him) seems to have a pretty good handle on this conflict compared with most western leaders. The truth nobody wants to hear is this:

For the sake of this I will refer to Israelis as Jews and Palestinians as Arabs sometimes, for the sake of simplicity.

Both Jews and Arabs have a legitimate claim to the area that was briefly known as "British Mandate Palestine".

Both have long ranging historical ties to the land, but there is no denying that Jews were there first. Not that who was there first truly matters, they are both connected.

However, it is simply a fact that Jews were made second class citizens in their own homelands by invaders. Not just Arabs, but multiple invaders. They were ethnically cleansed, exiled, and treated appallingly. Up until the day Britain took control of the land, Jews were legal dhimmi - second class under law to Muslims.

The fact they had a minority population by 1917 is evidence of the abuse they'd endured for generations - including it being illegal for them to buy land in their own homeland or hold jobs in government in order that they might have any hope of improving their lot.

People can't live like that enduringly, simple as.

So when the land was divided by the British, was it fair on everyone? No, it was not. Lot of land was divided in the past and it was absolutely never fair on everyone. In1916 life wasn't fair on most people actually.

The answer to the problem is simple acceptance.

The nakba was very sad.

The Jews being expelled similarly from their homes around the middle east and north africa was equally sad.

I am sure both felt the same sense of deep loss and injustice.

But one side decided to move forward and rebuild, and the other side devoted themselves ideologically to the destruction of the other.

Most people who lost a home in 1948 are now dead.

What is much more sad is that people are now fighting and dying and losing their homes NOW over a right which never belonged to them to begin with.

Many things play into the fact that these people, and only these people uniquely on earth refuse to accept things and move forward. One is that our institutions and well meaning westerners play into these revolutionary ideas that in practice just hurt people.

This idea that destroying Israel is some metaphor for capitalism or some other such nonsense has no relationship to reality. The very much capitalist terrorists have been thieving your tax money for decades and are abusing their citizens whilst flying around on private jets.

Religious zealots who believe once conquered Muslim land must always remain Muslim land even if millions of people die in the process do not help either.

And for obvious reasons, the terrorist leaders, who, like every oppressive regime have become very rich off the blood of their people are not in any hurry for the conflict to end!

Those westerners who think there should be one equal rights state are (I am sorry) very uneducated on the middle east.

One equal rights state requires shared values. Jews do not want to live in an Islamic state, and Palestinians do not want to live in a liberal democracy.

The Western idea of "equal rights" exists in your mind as the ideal, but you cannot transfer this to different cultures you know nothing about.

If the citizens of the Palestinian territories wanted gay rights, women's rights, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, the right to fair and public trials, democracy or any of the things that factor into your fantasy of equality then absolutely nobody has been stopping them for decades now.

Their concept of human rights is different to yours. In fact, on the Arab Declaration of human rights one of the first things on it states that all people have a right of self determination. The item directly under this excludes Jews and only Jews from that definition!

My family in some oppressed societies where being gay is considered an abomination and women have to wear hijabs are happy to do that. Do I agree with it? No, I hate that for centuries religion has been used as a tool of bigotry and oppression of women. But that's their choice. Do I think it's justice if that choice is foisted on others? No.

Portraying Israel as the bogeyman, much as people to America, is easy to do, but at the end of the day it's a country like any other. It has had good leaders, bad leaders and some very bad leaders. But they are ultimately no worse than whatever country you live in, and certainly I would not stand for people calling for your destruction any more than I stand for people calling for theirs.

I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

I feel quite shattered thinking of the innocent lives caught up in all this. Those kids living in tents with gunfire everywhere, taught to hate and believe this is the best life has for them. The orphans, the injured, the disabled - it must be horrific. I also feel shattered when I think of the victims of 7 Oct and all their families have endured, as well as the hostages still in Gaza.

What a terrible mess, and really all for absolutely nothing.

I really, really hope those people here who walk around in their keffiyehs are really able to thing about what "Free Palestine" really means. For me it means Hamas and all similar groups are gone and Palestinians are giving normal, happy, safe lives where their reasons for being isn't martyrdom nor murder.

As an Arab person, I strongly feel that Jewish people are my cousins, and that we have so much in common. I hope those calling for violence at music concerts or those harassing Jews around the world realise soon that they are part of the problem.

Any ceasefire will begin when people around the globe truly call out for peace, truly FUND peace and truly help work for peace. And peace cannot exist on the terms many of you demand.

And in the words of Donald: Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Absolutely fantastic post. Thank you for writing this.

Stripes56 · 06/07/2025 18:20

ForgesOfEmpires · 02/07/2025 21:12

I am of Arab decent myself. An atheist though. I have lived in the middle east for half my life. Trump (as much as I despise him) seems to have a pretty good handle on this conflict compared with most western leaders. The truth nobody wants to hear is this:

For the sake of this I will refer to Israelis as Jews and Palestinians as Arabs sometimes, for the sake of simplicity.

Both Jews and Arabs have a legitimate claim to the area that was briefly known as "British Mandate Palestine".

Both have long ranging historical ties to the land, but there is no denying that Jews were there first. Not that who was there first truly matters, they are both connected.

However, it is simply a fact that Jews were made second class citizens in their own homelands by invaders. Not just Arabs, but multiple invaders. They were ethnically cleansed, exiled, and treated appallingly. Up until the day Britain took control of the land, Jews were legal dhimmi - second class under law to Muslims.

The fact they had a minority population by 1917 is evidence of the abuse they'd endured for generations - including it being illegal for them to buy land in their own homeland or hold jobs in government in order that they might have any hope of improving their lot.

People can't live like that enduringly, simple as.

So when the land was divided by the British, was it fair on everyone? No, it was not. Lot of land was divided in the past and it was absolutely never fair on everyone. In1916 life wasn't fair on most people actually.

The answer to the problem is simple acceptance.

The nakba was very sad.

The Jews being expelled similarly from their homes around the middle east and north africa was equally sad.

I am sure both felt the same sense of deep loss and injustice.

But one side decided to move forward and rebuild, and the other side devoted themselves ideologically to the destruction of the other.

Most people who lost a home in 1948 are now dead.

What is much more sad is that people are now fighting and dying and losing their homes NOW over a right which never belonged to them to begin with.

Many things play into the fact that these people, and only these people uniquely on earth refuse to accept things and move forward. One is that our institutions and well meaning westerners play into these revolutionary ideas that in practice just hurt people.

This idea that destroying Israel is some metaphor for capitalism or some other such nonsense has no relationship to reality. The very much capitalist terrorists have been thieving your tax money for decades and are abusing their citizens whilst flying around on private jets.

Religious zealots who believe once conquered Muslim land must always remain Muslim land even if millions of people die in the process do not help either.

And for obvious reasons, the terrorist leaders, who, like every oppressive regime have become very rich off the blood of their people are not in any hurry for the conflict to end!

Those westerners who think there should be one equal rights state are (I am sorry) very uneducated on the middle east.

One equal rights state requires shared values. Jews do not want to live in an Islamic state, and Palestinians do not want to live in a liberal democracy.

The Western idea of "equal rights" exists in your mind as the ideal, but you cannot transfer this to different cultures you know nothing about.

If the citizens of the Palestinian territories wanted gay rights, women's rights, freedom of press, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly, the right to fair and public trials, democracy or any of the things that factor into your fantasy of equality then absolutely nobody has been stopping them for decades now.

Their concept of human rights is different to yours. In fact, on the Arab Declaration of human rights one of the first things on it states that all people have a right of self determination. The item directly under this excludes Jews and only Jews from that definition!

My family in some oppressed societies where being gay is considered an abomination and women have to wear hijabs are happy to do that. Do I agree with it? No, I hate that for centuries religion has been used as a tool of bigotry and oppression of women. But that's their choice. Do I think it's justice if that choice is foisted on others? No.

Portraying Israel as the bogeyman, much as people to America, is easy to do, but at the end of the day it's a country like any other. It has had good leaders, bad leaders and some very bad leaders. But they are ultimately no worse than whatever country you live in, and certainly I would not stand for people calling for your destruction any more than I stand for people calling for theirs.

I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

I feel quite shattered thinking of the innocent lives caught up in all this. Those kids living in tents with gunfire everywhere, taught to hate and believe this is the best life has for them. The orphans, the injured, the disabled - it must be horrific. I also feel shattered when I think of the victims of 7 Oct and all their families have endured, as well as the hostages still in Gaza.

What a terrible mess, and really all for absolutely nothing.

I really, really hope those people here who walk around in their keffiyehs are really able to thing about what "Free Palestine" really means. For me it means Hamas and all similar groups are gone and Palestinians are giving normal, happy, safe lives where their reasons for being isn't martyrdom nor murder.

As an Arab person, I strongly feel that Jewish people are my cousins, and that we have so much in common. I hope those calling for violence at music concerts or those harassing Jews around the world realise soon that they are part of the problem.

Any ceasefire will begin when people around the globe truly call out for peace, truly FUND peace and truly help work for peace. And peace cannot exist on the terms many of you demand.

And in the words of Donald: Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Thanks for you post @ForgesOfEmpires

I would like to ask you about this further:

I believe, with all my years of knowledge and experience in this conflict and the parties involved that peace in the middle east will happen when there is acceptance from both sides that the other has as much right to be there as they do, and they make a positive decision not to try and annihilate anyone or kidnap anyone or start wars.

I have to completely agree with you here. There are reasons why a one state solution won’t work.

I don’t think either side have been honest brokers towards a two state solution, but this has to be the way ahead then?

Can you see Israel making concessions towards this? And I am not talking about right of return of descendants of refugees. Even agreeing to stop settlements would be a start and then thinking what land the Palestinians do need for their state.

mids2019 · 07/07/2025 05:20

Any state requires borders and I think there lies the problem with a two state solution, where are those borders? If we concede probably reasonably that Israel will not concede land it currently owns/governs then we could have two states with the current borders but and it's a big but you will continue to have Palestinian grievance that will erupt in future violence....Palestine free from the river to the sea is very much different to let's have a two state solution with the Gaza strip and the currently held West Bank. It would good to get comment on this but can a Palestine exist as an economically viable state in any meaningful sense and not one that is dependent on economic aid on a large scale?

Images with Israelis not being racist but we cannot ignore the fact that Palestinains are steeped in hatred on Jews from an early age and this hatred all so horribly manifested itself in October 7th.

Stripes56 · 07/07/2025 18:14

mids2019 · 07/07/2025 05:20

Any state requires borders and I think there lies the problem with a two state solution, where are those borders? If we concede probably reasonably that Israel will not concede land it currently owns/governs then we could have two states with the current borders but and it's a big but you will continue to have Palestinian grievance that will erupt in future violence....Palestine free from the river to the sea is very much different to let's have a two state solution with the Gaza strip and the currently held West Bank. It would good to get comment on this but can a Palestine exist as an economically viable state in any meaningful sense and not one that is dependent on economic aid on a large scale?

Images with Israelis not being racist but we cannot ignore the fact that Palestinains are steeped in hatred on Jews from an early age and this hatred all so horribly manifested itself in October 7th.

So what do you think should be the solution? What should Israel do to seek peace with Palestinians?