Rafah bombings (Edited by Mumsnet)

[TwilightSkies]

Where the hell are all the Palestinians meant to go now?
They were TOLD to go to Rafah, that Rafah was a safe place.
It’s just open extermination at this point.

When Rafah has been destroyed will this finally end? Or will it go on for years to achieve the poorly defined goal of defeating Hamas?

Well Netanyahu gave an interview the other day saying that the war could last 10 years.

Face it, it's not about destroying Hamas, its about giving the Israeli Government the excuse to enter Gaza an anytime and exert control. As a bonus the longer it lasts the longer Netanyahu doesn't face trial and the 2 state solution is left in limbo.

Current strategy of 'defeat and repeat' plus Netanyahu's refusal to discuss Israels plans for Gaza 'after the war' don't bode well for the conclusion to the conflict any time soon

A senior US diplomat is visiting Israel and Saudi in the next few days - not Blinken but can't find tweet with persons name - so extending ground incursion unlikely to happen before the weekend

Fierce fighting and airstrikes continue in eastern Rafah - with many IDF casualties/ Hamas deaths reported but not confirmed

Over half a million people have now left the city

Yes heard this on the news this morning. Biden's red line didn't mean much. I was pretty appalled by this decision.

Instead of criticizing the IDF and clogging up central London with noisy futile marches why don't people picket the Egyptian Embassy? They could complain to Egypt about imposing a siege on Gaza and stopping Gazan residents leaving via Egypt.

After all, as opposed to Israel, Hamas isn't threatening Egypt with anihilation.

@onegrumpyoldwoman do you think the IDF are innocent in all this? Do you think they've done nothing wrong?

When you have a government who have been arming Israel with military aid and are complicit in the war crimes being committed, it is necessary to have protests to speak against this and demand a ceasefire.

It's not the Egyptians that have closed the border. It's the idf encamped there.
The Idf are not allowing any movement if goods or people.
Why should Egypt be blamed for this war & the dreadful position the Palestinians are in?

The guilt or innocence of the IDF isn't relevant to the point I was making.

Egypt could save hundreds of lives of it's Muslim Brothers and Sisters by just opening up the Rafah Crossing.

They have enough space in Sinai for them to be temporarily housed, 23,500 square miles to be precise.
One can only speculate as to why they refuse to enact this humanitarian solution.

Who has closed the border is actually in dispute -

https://www.msn.com/he-il/news/other/update-1-israel-and-egypt-trade-blame-over-rafah-crossing-closure/ar-BB1mnKTb?ocid=BingNewsSerp

GB was not responsible for the rise of Nazism in Germany but we still took in about 40,000 Jewish refugees.

It's called 'having humanity'.

Uk could host them as well or Europe couldn’t they ?

would Israel allow Palestinians returning to their country after the war is over?

Having humanity. Indeed. Do you have the same expectation of Israel or are they exempt?

There was huge resistance about taking in Jewish refugees after the war, both here and America. That is one of the reasons Israel was given as a homeland for Jewish people.

My apologies, @ConnieCounter
I did not mean to quote you. I was just making a general point. I saw this on a programme about WW11 recently.

We are not really aware of, or like to admit, how true this was.

Lord Balfour of the Balfour agreement was a famous antisemite.
https://forward.com/opinion/386480/its-time-to-admit-that-arthur-balfour-was-a-white-supremacist-and-an-anti-s/
A lot of ships carrying refugees fleeing the Holocaust were also turned away from American ports and sent back to Europe.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/us-government-turned-away-thousands-jewish-refugees-fearing-they-were-nazi-spies-180957324/

Yes @BelleHathor I was so surprised to see how we generally just do not realise nowadays what happened at the time, even given the Holocaust.

I think some other more welcoming voices were eventually heard but it was by no means fulsome.

I was shocked to find out too that Kinder Transport specifically excluded parents, so it was only a case of some escapes being ‘better than nothing’.

I do not think that if Palestinians went into Egypt they would be easily be allowed back. But Egypt has not given their blessing as far as I know (unless for a very high fee? Is there escape trafficking going on?).

" I don't know."

Is my answer to both your questions.

Jordan wasn't responsible for the Syrian Civil War but has 2.3 million Palestinian refugees.

Lebanon wasn't responsible for the Syrian Civil War either but has 1.5 million Syrian refugees.

Syrian refugees also fled to North Africa, Iraq and Egypt.

So it seems all of Palestine's neighbours have "stepped up to the plate" bar Egypt.

🤔

We were discussing hosting refugees, which Israel isn't in a position to do.

Why not? On one of the recent occasions when an Israeli politician suggested Egypt take a million refugees from Gaza - El-Sisi the president of Egypt told them to use the Negev desert as a temporary place of safety - this was met with silence

Egypt already has many many refugees from Gaza from 40 years ago- it has also recently taken over a million refugees from the Sudan conflict

It's a poor country whose economy is already struggling despite large amounts of US aid and has experienced problems with Hamas insurgency in N Sinai in the recent past

I was talking about having humanity.

@Efacsen On one of the recent occasions when an Israeli politician suggested Egypt take a million refugees from Gaza - El-Sisi the president of Egypt told them to use the Negev desert as a temporary place of safety - this was met with silence.

According to the latest polls I have seen, 70% of Palestinians support Hamas, so, as Israel isn't in a position to identify the "harmless" 30%, it would be military suicide to agree to such a "Trojan Horse" scenario.

So why would Egypt want the 'trojan horse' turning up in N Sinai?

As I said there have been recent problems for Egypt with this already

What the heck has the Holocaust got to do with the Palestinians and Egypt.

This should not be discussed in the same point as it sounds there is conflation and comparison in a very veiled manner.

RTFT

It's a general discussion about the well known reluctance of different countries to take refugees of all stripes - nothing veiled about it

So it seems that the Palestinians aren't popular wherever they go?

That's not Israel's fault.

Maybe Palestinians should choose better bedfellows ?

Can't compare the two.