IDF statement on Aid Convoy Stampede

[Yellowducksandrakes]

What’s happened: Following the death of dozens of Palestinians after a stampede broke out around an aid convoy west of Gaza City, the US has blocked an Algerian-sponsored statement at the United Nations Security Council which sought to blame Israel.

• While reports conflict, it appears that:
• Before dawn yesterday morning, approximately 30 trucks containing aid entered the Gaza Strip to deliver food to the Rimal neighbourhood of Gaza City.
• At approximately 4.40 AM, thousands of Gazans swarmed the trucks. Drone footage of the event shows some of the trucks attempting to drive through the crowds, presumably in an effort to extract themselves and deliver the aid they were carrying.
• After a number of trucks were able to continue north, armed men opened fire on what remained of the convoy.
• While the IDF has admitted that its troops did open fire, it says that this was only “when they encountered danger, when the mob moved toward it in a manner that endangered the force”.
• The IDF also says that it “did not fire toward individuals seeking aid and we did not fire toward the humanitarian convoy from the ground nor from the air.”
• It is being reported that at least 112 Gazans were killed in this incident, with approximately 760 being injured. However, as these figures originate from within the Hamas-run Palestinian Ministry of Health, their veracity is questionable.
• The IDF’s initial inquiry into the incident has concluded its troops’ fire killed only 7 or 8 people and that the majority were killed in the chaos, not by shooting.
• “The tanks were there to provide security for the trucks. Our aircraft gave the troops on the ground a full picture from above,” the IDF said.
• “When the hundreds turned into thousands, the IDF complied with international law… Israel did not limit the quantity of humanitarian aid entering Gaza. We recognize the suffering of the Gaza residents.”
• In the aftermath of this event, much of the international community has reiterated calls for an immediate ceasefire and increased aid being allowed into the Gaza Strip.
• At the United Nations Security Council, Algeria sought to issue a statement which explicitly blamed Israel for this deadly incident. While supported by 14 out of 15 council members, it was blocked by the US.
• When asked why the US had not supported this statement, Deputy Ambassador to the United Nations Robert Wood said: “We don’t have all the facts on the ground – that’s the problem.”
• He also said that in the face of contradictory reports, the US was trying to establish facts, including regarding the “circumstances around how people died”.
• President Biden has also discussed this incident with Qatari Emir Sheikh Tamim bin Hamad Al-Thani and Egyptian President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi. According to a White House statement, they agreed that it “underscored the urgency of bringing negotiations to a close as soon as possible”.
• The White House has also called for this event to be “thoroughly investigated”.

Context: Israel will conduct a thorough investigation into an incident which further highlights the complexity of distributing aid to the Gazan people and the urgent necessity of forming a civilian infrastructure to prevent further incidents of this kind.

I think if you make claims and another poster asks you to show where you found that information it's reasonable. The poster claiming something usually says where they at least saw the information they are claiming?

I've popped the latest information I can find which doesn't confirm your claim

Israel leadership didn’t ask for a list for the last round of hostage releases. Was it unreasonable to not have needed one then?

Israel, btw, has not agreed to a ceasefire.

They have agreed ‘in principle’ to a six week pause for hostage release with the understanding they will go into Rafah and keep on fighting the war afterwards.

Recall please. The series of renewable four week pauses that would lead after a four and a half months to a ceasefire that Hamas proposed and Israel rejected as “delusional” on 7 Feb 2024 saying they would push on until “total victory”.

I'm answering the question from another poster about whether Israel will agree to a ceasefire. The BBC story of 17 hours ago states "Israel-Gaza war: Israel demands names of hostages still alive for deal on new ceasefire".

The fact that they may or may not have asked for a list of names on previous ceasefires is irrelevant really. They probably want to know which hostages are still alive from oct 7th. I can understand why.

The story suggests that they are ready to negotiate when they have a list of surviving hostages. That's all I can comment on, not on someone else's opinion.

I listened to the BBC radio 4 news and they stated clearly that Netanyahu refuses for his people to attend the talks. Hamas representatives are attending.
The reason being that Hamas cannot provide a list of the hostages. Why not, do you ask? Well according to one of the interviewee, they are still trying to find out who is holding whom, who has been killed by the bombing and by everything else the IDF is doing in Gaza. I believe him as much as I believe Netanyahu as both parties have agendas.
Meanwhile the horrors carry on.

I agree that is Israel’s position.

I think this new requirement of a live hostage list before ending your boycott of negotiations is a bit odd.

Hourly, the hostages are at risk of dying by bullet, bomb, starvation or disease. So the list you get before even agreeing to show up to negotiations is going to quickly be obsolete long before any proposed deal is ready to be put forward to Nethanyu or Hamas by the mediators.

The question is why do they want it? It’s not necessary to agree on a pause and hostage release or a full ceasefire and hostage release. It wasn’t asked for last time. So what do they want it for? Public relations? Hannibal sacrifice?

Netanyahu has repeatedly stated that he wants total victory ( whatever that means) so he isn't going to stop his genocidal campaign when the ceasefire ends.
I also fear that what is happening now in Gaza is the perfect excuse for other terrorist organisations to attack Israel and that Israel is less safe that it was before 07/10.
Violence begets violence as the saying goes.

I'm not going to guess on why they might want the list of hostages that are still alive. Why won't Hamas provide the list, game playing, or genuinely don't know where hostages are or if alive? If that's the case though how will they release them as oart if a deal. The BBC story says hamas want something in return for a list. Meanwhile people are dying. It's a mess.

This is my concern. You have a ceasefire, and then what
The ceasefire is the beginning not the end. Ceasefires gives everyone a breather, saves countless lives and brings people round the table to try and find a peaceful solution. What would you prefer? Continue the bombardments and starvation until every civilian is dead?

Exactly.

This has been happening for years.

It's what the Israelis cynically call 'mowing the lawn'.

All this talk of ceasefire to me has become a distraction. Ceasefire or not Israel needs to stop starving the Palestinian population and start getting humanitarian aid in, they also need to stop murdering children these are war crimes and should not be happening regardless of any ceasefire. Equating the two means the current Israeli war crimes are being legitimised.

@Yellowducksandrakes It's what the Israelis cynically call 'mowing the lawn'.
Pretty sick comment to make about people's lives, not surprised though, just another term to dehumanise people

You truly believe Hamas want to come 'round the table'?

Hamas won't give up any hostages alive or dead, because as soon as they do that they lose their 'bargaining chips'.

While a ceasefire and hostage release deal remains possible, its likelihood is diminishing given Hamas’s intransigence and refusal to provide Israel with a list of living hostages.
• 130 hostages remain unaccounted for, with Israel saying that at least 29 were dead on 13th February. Three hostages have been rescued by Israel’s security forces, 105 were released during a ceasefire in November, and four prior to that. Securing all hostages is Israel’s joint primary stated war aim along with destroying Hamas in the Gaza Strip.
• Fellow members of Israel’s war cabinet are said to have criticised Prime Minister Netanyahu for insisting on the names of surviving hostages as a precondition of negotiations. They argue that the list of hostages could have been discussed toward the end of the negotiations, as was the case in the previous deal.
• Senior Egyptian sources claim that both Egypt and Qatar are putting strong pressure on Hamas to provide the names of hostages to be released in a first round of releases.
• Egypt is also said to have made clear to Khalil al-Hayya, who is heading Hamas’s delegation, that it is difficult to hold talks and make progress when Hamas is split between its political leadership overseas and its leadership in Gaza.
• Egyptian, Qatari, and Israeli officials have suggested that Hamas’s Gazan leader Yahya Sinwar is wilfully delaying a deal in the hope that an Israeli action in Rafah, Hamas’s last Gazan stronghold, would lead to a flare-up in the West Bank and among Israeli Arabs. A senior Israeli official said that, "Sinwar prefers to escalate tensions in the Middle East, causing chaos and bloodshed on Ramadan, over the alternative of a six-week cease-fire and humanitarian aid that would significantly alleviate the suffering of Gaza's local population".
• Qatar is a longstanding supporter of Hamas, yet has also maintained an unofficial but productive relationship with Israel since at least 1996. Doha has frequently acted as an intermediary between Israel and Hamas, and played a critical role in mediating and brokering more recent negotiations along with Egypt.

@Yellowducksandrakes Realistically, why would Hamas give up the remaining Hostages?
Israel's stated aim is to destroy Hamas, that means kill them all, now that may well be what they deserve but it also means that Hamas, on the ground, have no incentive to hand them over or obey their masters in Qatar.

Israel would need to step back from this, they wont of course but that leaves negotiations stalled.

Exactly.

We have a stalemate.

@Yellowducksandrakes not really sure what other option there is? Finding a peaceful solution does not necessarily include Hamas. I am not a peace negotiator there are a lot of people that are, one thing is certain this is not going to be resolved through a military campaign dialogue is the only way through. Hamas aren't likely to release the hostages without something in return, Israel have to decide what that can be

Well people get cynical when they have to live with a next-door-neighbour, that has been infiltrated by a genocidal terrorist group, who likes to fire rockets at them and uses their people as human shields.

We've witnessed how "cynical" people get, happy to deny children food is pretty cynical, happy to discuss the murder of people, stealing their homes and occupying their territory is pretty cynical...no excuse for these depraved acts in my opinion

A situation in which the civilians in Palestine continue to be bombed, denied food and clean drinking water, medical care, and adequate shelter. There is no excuse for this indiscriminate approach and withholding of aid. Ceasefire or no ceasefire it never needed to be like this. It was not necessary, it was an offensive encouraged by power hungry men and blood thirsty right wing extremists. There is absolutely no excuse for systematically withholding food, water and aid from innocent people.

Personally and sadly, I believe the rest of the hostages are dead and Hamas is just 'playing for time'.

Eventually I think Israel will loose patience and go into Rafah to get the Hamas leaders.
It won't be pretty.

If the Hamas leadership don't know the information, then they'll need time and opportunity to get it. And then what happens if it's wrong? If, for example, they say they think someone is alive but then that person dies, eg in the bombings or due to malnutrition or illness? Does that negate any agreed 'pause'?

But, if the Israeli government is demanding this list, that suggests they don't currently know who is alive and where. So how are they going to reassure people's families that they aren't currently bombing places where there are hostages? That implies something about the value assigned to those people's lives in the eyes of the Israeli government.

The Hamas leaders (almost all of the ones whose whereabouts are known) aren't in Rafah, or even in Gaza.

When the IDF go into Rafah, it won't be 'not pretty', it will be the massacre of innocent civilians, primarily for vengeance, land and the culmination of years of wanting to do so.

I remember Rafah. I remember what happened when the Israeli bulldozers came. This will be worse. Worse than things that still haunt my dreams all these years later.

Thought the Hamas leaders were in Qatar 🤔

Maybe the IDF strategists didn't do geography at school...

World will turn against Israel if they do that, could well mean the USA will stop or limit backing them.

The death toll and famine disease would be on another level, "would not be pretty" is the understatement of this war.