Assisted conception (and the bits in between!) - part 4 - all welcome

[mummycat1]

Starting new thread with massive congratulations to Nanoo I reckon the old man can wait till he gets home! But of course - it's up to you really xxx

DuelingFanjo - good luck for the injections. Thanks for everyone who has asked how I'm getting on with them, well, I'm getting on fine with the actual injections, have tried tummy and both thighs, I'm just not very good at getting the stuff out of the vial and into the syringe without any air bubbles. The nurse who showed me how to do it said you could just flick it a couple of times and the air bubbles would all go to the top and you could squeeze them out, but I'm sure I'm always left with some. Maybe I'm too much of a perfectionist but I end up spending ages sucking the liquid up (or down) into the syringe, flicking it and then back up into the vial and back down into the syringe etc. - I would never make a nurse! I haven't had any side effects yet, although I'm only coming up to a week so maybe I shouldn't speak too soon.

Thanks to the people with links to ICSI info, I found it really useful and will show it to my other half as well (who hasn't said much about it but usually likes to have all the info about what is going on)

Anyway, after a completely self-indulgent post I afraid I'm going to have to make dinner as DH has just got home. Have a nice evening everyone

Hi again everyone

Ouch BB! That is a lot of wonga to pay over in one go, but all in a good cause. Fingers crossed you hit the jackpot eh. When you say you are going to get a book, do you mean generally or an IVF relevant one?! I could suggest lots of novels but suspect you are staying on-topic so I have read "The complete guide to IVF" by Kate Brian, which I thought was pretty good. Quite conversational, answered all the questions I had at the time and written from the viewpoint of a patient rather than a doctor.

Bumpless I think it is encouraging that you feel different this time round with three on board (love the names!) Difficult not to over-analyse every flutter and so on, but take it easy and keep on visualising them burrowing in and getting comfy in there - I'm sure that can make a difference.

Well Idream it's great to have had a nice easy-going last throw of the dice before embarking on IVF and you never do know. I conceived just as we were going to start - so it can and does happen (and usually has a better outcome too). Would be lovely to avoid all the jabbing and poking but if nothing else you have the road ahead all mapped out if it comes to it.

Italian that must have been a bit of a panic for you, not knowing what was going on and fearing another cycle being lost. I'm so glad the nurse was able to identify what was up and reassure you. Hope the news from the donor is good. You made me laugh spelling out that you had not in fact peed on your bathroom window. I think we should all be precision pee-ers by now with the practice we have all had!

Bumpless, Italian, thanks for suggesting that I should call the GP - I took your advice. He was very kind and said it would be a good idea to set a deadline by which I will book myself in for an ERPC if the natural process hasn't completed. I will make that day Monday, when I have the appointment at the surgery, and then if I need to I can get them to refer me. Feels a bit better to have a game plan.

He also surprised me by being very receptive to the idea that I should have some investigations. I only asked because I thought I may as well, but didn't expect a positive answer as I thought the NHS had a fairly strict 3 m/c rule. But he said he would be willing to refer me - so I can ask about this too on Monday (though not sure if I am seeing him or a different doctor who might think differently). If we can, it might save us some money, although if the wait is going to be very long I daresay we would proceed privately as we have the appointment on Friday at Zita West anyway.

So that was really good advice, thanks! Thanks also to everyone who has been so kind over the last couple of weeks (I meant to say that yesterday but forgot my manners).

Oh, and Bumpless I am following more of your good advice and having a massage on Friday! Decided to take the day off and will treat myself, which I think will be a good idea.

Right, the rollcall:

Idreaminchocolate TTC #1 since Oct ?07. Due to start 1st ICSI cycle April ?10.
Italiangreyhound TTC #2 since Aug 05, 1 MMC in Jan 2006, due for donor egg IVF end of March.
Cerubina TTC no1 since Oct 07. MMC in Feb 09 (10 weeks), MMC in Feb 10 (7 weeks). Currently awaiting investigations and looking to re-start IVF process in next couple of months.

Does anyone know what happened to Lorelei who posted on here when her doctor told her to take the trigger shot when her follies were still quite small? Hope all turned out well but haven't seen an update.

I think we are missing a few others too - come out and show yourselves if anyone's lurking!

Idreaminchocolate TTC #1 since Oct ?07. Due to start 1st ICSI cycle April ?10.

Italiangreyhound TTC #2 since Aug 05, 1 MMC in Jan 2006, due for donor egg IVF end of March.

Cerubina TTC no1 since Oct 07. MMC in Feb 09 (10 weeks), MMC in Feb 10 (7 weeks). Currently awaiting investigations and looking to re-start IVF process in next couple of months.

Horton TTC #2 since Sept 06. MMC in Dec 09 (12 weeks). Have appointment for starting the IVF rollercoaster booked on April 1st.

I meant to say, Bumpless, tons of sticky vibes for those little specks of loveliness.

Isle I admit to not really understanding the implications of keeping or getting rid of your tube, but completely get your wanting to explore whether something low-intervention can help before surgery. Haven?t we all had just about enough messing about with our bits!

Italian sounds like you?re dealing with the down-reg horrors really well. I would have murdered someone if I?d had to live without hormones as long as you are! No wonder your emotions and body are starting to kick back. Why not take a leaf out of Cerubina?s book and get some pampering treats lined up for the next couple of weeks to ease you through it all?

Dueling ooooohhhhh here you go! How was the first injection? Everything crossed for this cycle!

BabyBarrister nice of your clinic to show you what they do with your hard-earned cash ? wouldn?t like them to waste it on, I dunno, medical equipment or anything, now would you Here?s my booklist: Zita West?s Guide to Getting Pregnant and also her Plan to Get Pregnant ? both are about getting pregnant in general and what you can do to improve your chances, but both have chapters on assisted conception. She goes through the facts about it and also spends quite a lot of time on mental and physical preparation, and coping with the emotions. The first is more dense than the second, which has less material in it but it?s more digestably presented.

Riggly glad to hear it?s all going well. Any scans yet?

Cerubina well done for taking matters into your own hands with the GP! So much better not to be at everyone else?s convenience, especially now when you really need people to jump to it and help. Very good news that they might do some investigations ? I think it?s cruel to leave you not knowing. And definitely great that you?re giving yourself some love and pampering too.

Thanks Horton - and fab date for the start of your cycle!

Look away now if you don?t want to read the latest instalment of my 2WW symptom obsession! My tummy tingle is still there, really quite distracting actually! Now wondering whether I sprained my bladder by having it so full for the ET and then it being pressed down on for the scan ? is that possible?! We had to wait an hour before the ET, and then the clinic had me lie still for 30 mins after ET ? I was bursting! Eventually gave in to the novel and disturbing experience of using a bedpan (boy do you have to concentrate ? it?s fundamentally wrong to pee in bed!) but now wondering if I?m feeling the after-effects! No achey , but very revved up, feel like I?m on a permanent caffeine high. I know, I know, probably all drugs?

riggly Have done my first injections and I have to agree with you. The actual injection, ie putting it in to my skin, is really easy but the stuff beforehand is so fiddly and complicated I almost had a break-down! I also think the Notes my clinic prepared are a but wrong so I got into a bit of a tizz and in the end my DH had to draw up the stuff from the vials for me. Plus I managed to cut my finger snapping the top off the water ampoule! To be fair so did the nurse who showed me how to do it!

But.. first ones are over and it wasn't as scary as I thought.

riggly I guess you must have a scan coming up to check your progress? hope it goes well

Cerubina great news about your fab doctor and the referral.

Good evening all.

Was away for a few days on a work thing and amazed how much has happened!

Bumpless so glad to hear that things went well in Greece! I am sending you lots of sticky vibes!

DuelingFanjo and riggly well done with your injections. It only gets easier...

Italian I'm happy that everything turned out OK and panic was averted!

Cerubina its good you've got a plan and great news on the referral.

BB, Horton and Idream how exciting that you're almost ready to start the whole exciting process!

Apologies as I'm sure I've forgotten someone, but big wave to all!

I'm hanging in there - still surprised how much the MC has knocked me over emotionally. Had an awful moment in the pub last night with work colleagues. I was having a soft drink (wasn't feeling particularly well) and two male colleagues started saying that if I wasn't drinking, I must be pregnant. Tried to laugh it off since they were only joking, but it wasn't easy.

Anyway, time to add to the roll call:

Idreaminchocolate TTC #1 since Oct Â?07. Due to start 1st ICSI cycle April Â?10.

Italiangreyhound TTC #2 since Aug 05, 1 MMC in Jan 2006, due for donor egg IVF end of March.

Cerubina TTC no1 since Oct 07. MMC in Feb 09 (10 weeks), MMC in Feb 10 (7 weeks). Currently awaiting investigations and looking to re-start IVF process in next couple of months.

Horton TTC #2 since Sept 06. MMC in Dec 09 (12 weeks). Have appointment for starting the IVF rollercoaster booked on April 1st.

Mercenarymom TTC #2. MMC in Feb 10. Looking to restart IVF process in the next few months.

MercenaryMom Sorry to hear about your pub situation, I often think that people are quite insensitive and have no idea what is happening on others lives. Glad you managed to hold it together because, as you say, they are only joking.

DuelingFanjo Good luck with the injecting. Can't believe you cut your finger. You sound like my hubby who once cut himself of a tin can and also on my toe nail, but not at the same time! I always get hubby to do the injecting, it's easier!

babybarrister hopefully all that team building in Le Touquet will ensure they get everything right when they come to do your treatment. Why are you paying for condoms? Or was that a joke!!

Cerubina Thanks for your concern and well done on having a game plan. I certainly like to be ready and know what is happening. I keep thinking if it will best for egg collection to be on one day or another and Hubby says don't worry it will be when it is, type of thing! But I am always planning, planning, even when it is out of my hands!! Really glad you are getting some help.
Horton Like your date, first of April, let' hope the consultant doesn't shout surprise April fool at you!

Bumpless Like the massage idea, actually two of my colleagues have started doing massages for the female staff (they are female too in case you think ei ei!) and are doing it for charity. I am booked in for some massage a week on Friday! I am not sure you can sprain your bladder but maybe you sprained your brain on all this excitement! Sure it will all be well again soon.
riggly what stage are you at now? All the best.

Idreaminchocolate I am yet to watch One born every minute, will tell you what I think when I do. I am imagining you in your fancy dress watching TV!

My news, we have a date for starting Progenova, about a week away, a scan date - about two weeks away, then we are on for end of March/start of April, at last!
Starting to feel excited at last!

Italiangreyhound YAY for a date!

Am excited for you.

Thanks DuelingFanjo they still can?t cmit to the final date but that is OK. I have just kept thing sopen at work about when I will start my Easter holiday.

I?ve just found out how to unhide the threads I had accidently hidden!! It was the customise area!

I might have to stop watching One born every minute, it is too much pain and screaming and is putting me off! Wow, a 17 year old dad who was actually helpful, letting the mum bite on his thumb! I realised watching that that I can not possibly fin dout the sex if I get pregnant again, i want it to be a surprise! Both these young mums knew what they were expecting and I just thought what a shock if they had got it wrong!! Still exciting stuff!

just a quick hug to MM - it's been so awful for you. (((MM)))And to your colleagues! I know they were just joking, but it's so hard to take and then you're the one that feels bad if you let the hurt show too.

And WAHOOO Italian !!! You can finally get going! You'll feel so much better once you can start the progynova. I'll have everything crossed for you!

Bumpless How?s it going?

Idreaminchocolate I am spreading the word about chocolate covered rice cakes, got some for a friend today.

I have ordered the Zita West CD for assisted conception.

All OK but we are running out of fertility drugs! AAAGGGHH!!

My hormones are going mad. I am having a period and the pmt!!

Had a mini meltdown today with DH on phone, nurse at GP's surgery (where I was getting weighed and checking my asthma, yes, still got it!) then when my friend popped round for a quick coffee before school pick up. So that is three! It is the magic number!

How is everyone doing?

Cerubina any news. I do hope you get to see someone to help if you need it, both in terms of the physical side of things and a counsellor if that would help, MM and anyone else too. Whatever stage you guys are at I hope you are being super nice to yourselves and everyone else is too.

I mean I hope everyone else is being super nice to you Cerubina, MM etc.

Amberc how is the healthy regime?

Pumpkin How is it going, are you feeling OK?

Kiwi how are you feeling? How was work? Has the detective spotted what you are up to yet!?

riggly how are the injections going? Hopefully not stabbed your hand at all! Just be careful.

Eeeeeek BB - I'm surprised your other half can get in the mood wearing one of those!!

Hello all - the thread sounds much more positive at the moment which is good news. I am being very healthy and have joined weight watchers. It's not very exciting and is getting on my nerves and I am only on day 4!. I have a thyroid prblem so I'm not sure how much weight I will actually lose but we'll see. As much as DP and I are still going to make the effort to baby make without help I have no idea at all what my body is doing after all those drugs. Anyone got any ideas? (i'm afraid that we are not at it like rabbits so don't want to 'waste' a shag at the wrong time if you get my drift!)

Hi all-Hows it all going??! Am miffed as I had to miss my counselling appt on monday as had to stay late at work and there was no escaping. I am not impressed either with the private hospital as I had to leave an answerphone message and left my work number but no-one called me to say they received message. Anyway, we have appointment to see Nurse Specialists on 19/3 to see what our next step can be-most probably IUI with Clomid-have now decided to hold off for IVF on NHS which was also offered, and now they have said could be as little as 6 months wait.

I was questioning why I cannot have/not eligible for just clomid on its own without IUI (I do ovulate allegedly) I wondered why I would be prescribed it with IUI and they said its because it makes the eggs fatter-In which case do you think I could be prescribed it by my G.P. and try with BDing?? Would save £600! If anyone has experience of this would be interested.

Italian Hope you're feeling okay? Any dates yet?

Amberc Your "wasted shag" comment made me smile! I am still obsessed with still BDing at ovulation time and then not that bothered for the rest of time! That sounds so awful-We used to be at it all the time! Did OPK for last 2 cycles and was wanting to do it for extra day but DH was knackered-Will wait and see.....

Take care xx

I think you should be abe to try Clomid on it's own without IUI to be honest - I think it depends on your DH's sperm quality. IUI just monitors your cycle tomake sure they inseminate you at the right time and they 'wash' the sperm so only the good ones go in. I think you could even have a cycle monitored and clomid but no insemination if you wanted but if you know when you are ovulating that would be a waste of time.

Ha ha I know what you mean about not being arsed to shag at any other time than ovulation. Trying for a baby and not having any success makes sex into more of a production line than anything else as most of us have been trying so long that you forget that you used to do it for fun! I wonder how long it takes after you have given up trying to go back to normal again?

How's this for frustrating: I've just been at a conference at London Zoo and had no time to go round and see the animals!

Amber LoL to the wasted shag! I don't think it's doing DH and I any good to have the whole of that side of our lives relegated to a test tube. Banned from shagging for 7 days after ET and I'm kind of hoping he hasn't realised that ends today...

But if you're trying naturally and don't know when you ovulate - and even if you do, actually - the received wisdom is that you should be BDing every 2 days. Get those fancy undies out girlfriend!

Pumpkin I was given clomid on its own by the doc for 3 months. No dice. But that was before DHs sperm was given an MOT and the count shot up, so who knows whether it would have worked!

Italian you're posting your usual positive posts, but are you OK? What about all these meltdowns? You definitely deserve them, you've been downregging forever, but I hope your DH is looking after you and you're taking it as easy as you can. The beeding is the final straw, isn't it. I had the worlds longest AF when I downregged - it basically just didn't stop till I started on the oestrogen. Apparently it's because rising oestrogen levels in the first part of the cycle are the signal to start thickening up the womb lining, but since your oestrogen is switched off, your body doesn't know to stop bleeding and start building up.

Anyone heard from *OnlyAPhase lately, by the way?

KiwiKat how's it going? I'm starting to worry! Did you have your ET on Monday?

Hugs and waves

babybarrister your condoms sound pretty vile but if they do the job, let's hope you and DH find them really sexy!

Amberc no wasted shags! Every two days, that is what everyone seems to say and what I have always been told! I did Weight Watchers and did pretty well. You are even inspiring me to go BACK!

pumpkinjoy regarding IUI with or without Clomed or clomed with IUI, I guess it depends what the problem is that is making fertility difficult for you. I think you should ask the clinic these questions and see why they are suggesting one route. The drugs (and you can have IUI with different drugs) make you ovulate more but the IUI also circumvents (hope that is the right word) any problems that the sperm might have getting to its goal! So it does really depend what the problem is. We got pregnant with IUI and paid about £300, (second time). So £600 does not sound too bad (as this was over 6 years ago). I think you are right to wait for NHS IVF if it is offered in 6 months and do all you can in next 6 months so you don't need it! That way you will save your own cash for the future and if the NHS treatment doesn't work then you can fund your own IVF if you need to. But let's hope you do not.

Dates are still vague will not know until FOUR or maybe even TWO days before! Par for the course I'm afraid!

Bumpless A conference at London Zoo....are you a vet? Sounds exciting.

Kiwikat any news?

Penguin, Isle and Rosie how's it going?

Bumpless and all yes DH is being nice to me, he ordered my Zita West relaxation tape and he has been positive and lovely to me. We might even have some s*x tonight as bleeding has stopped! Must get back to Weight Watchers! Yes, I am relaxing.

pumpkinjoy that was not too clear!

Sorry.

If I were you, I would try IUI with whatever drugs are recommended. I think £600 in assisted conception terms is not a lot (sorry if it is a lot for you but comparatively not too much).

I would also try a course of Clomed if docs recommend it, depending on what is wrong.

All the time I would be on the waiting list for NHS IVF.

The would have NHS IVF.

Then if you still need help you could go for private IVF.

This is what I would do.

You may end up doing some of this or all of it or in stages if you end up wanting one or two or three kids or whatever! We got our one but wanted one more!

I sincerely hope you do not need to go to all this trouble but this is roughly what we did (without the NHS option as I am too old) and we have beautiful DD and are hoping for another!

BUT ask docs what is best shot for you and because you are young you may not need to go to the lengths we have gone to (I was 38 when first started looking into all this and I am now 45!!! And you are younger).

Hope that makes sense. All best wishes, .

Hi LevrieroItaliano (google it!), so sorry to hear you?ve been going through it ? how long have you been keeping this in? You poor thing ? big hug and a hairstroke followed by a nice cup of tea and a box of Hotel Chocolates for you.

I watched OBEM on Tuesday as well ? found it a bit annoying that these 17 year olds get knocked up when they don?t even want to be. Still keep watchin? though!!

What does ?Progenova? do? There are so many different drugs out there!

I?ve got that Zita West CD ? it?s really good. I love the way she says ?umbilicus?!!!!

Sorry if I?m being dim, but I didn?t understand your comment from the other day: Radio play from the other couple due this week.

Amused myself with visions of you peeing on the bathroom window (I was thinking ?how on earth did she anage that? Impressive?!!!) - was it Bumpless who pee?d on the cat??

Talking of whom, sorry if you weren?t trying to be funny, and I?m not making light of how you?re feeling Bumpless, but I did also have a little chuckle to myself re: wondering if it is possible to sprain one?s bladder!! Actually, seriously, I think it might be possible to do so, or something similar ? a couple of months ago I was on a long car journey and was absolutely desperate by the time we found a loo (it was in a petrol station, blocked and totally disgusting and I still used it - that?s how desperate I was) I could barely walk ? my bladder felt weird for a week. Anyway, how?d the sympton spotting going ? hope you are managing to stay sane! Permission to wrestle the choccies off Italiano!! A conference at London Zoo sounds good ? although not quite the same if you didn?t get to see the animals. I got to work in Harrogate yesterday, which was noce ? and I did get to see the shops!!!

BabyBarrister, there you are! Glad to hear that irrational DHs are the norm rather than the exception, although I think he has a point regarding £25 for condoms (?These aren?t just any condoms, these are organic, sheep intestine, designer condoms??.). I?ve read the Zita West? guide to getting preganant, but she?s just brought out a new one specifically for assisted conception. I?ve also read ?Getting Pregnant ? Faster? by Marylin Grenville, which basically says the same stuff as the Zita West book. On the more emotianl side of things I?ve read ?Nurturing Yourself Through IVF: Improve Your Experience, Maximize Your Odds of Success? by Lynn Daley which is pretty good.

Riggles how?s the vial flicking going? Have you had any scans yet?

Cerubina - enjoy your massage and pampering tomorrow!

MercenaryMom hope yu?re feeling okay after your colleagues insensitive comments ? that was just what you needed (not). Sounds like you need to join Cerubina on her spa day.

Sorry AmberC - got no tips on the sex subject ? our sex life wasn?t exactly sizzling beforehand and as you can imagine hasn?t exactly improved over the last couple of years!!!

I got my period yesterday, so definietly on for the IVF. I started taking the Mycrogynon (no side effects yet, but I took a pill a few years ago that made me feel really ill and I have a sneakky suspicion that it it was this one, but we?ll). I had to call the clinic to arrange my day 21 appointment ? and was told that all the nurses were on an away day. I suspect they we?re living it up with BabyBarrister?s nurses in Le Touquet, or maybe in the local Wetherspoon?s?.. It would have been nice to get pregnant for free (and I don?t just mean financially), but hey ho ? onwards and upwards?.

Well it happened again yesterday ? I was working in a completely different office and guess what? More baby dangling. Seriously ladies ? it?s an office, not a creche. (Of course I will be dangling my chocolate button when he/she finally gets here, but that?s ^s not the point.)

Has anyone else run out of emotions? It?s not that I?m dealing with tings better particularly, but more like I don?t have the energy to get upset about things anymore ? like getting my period or the whole baby dangling thing. I?m just like ?That?s a bit a bit pants ? whatever?. Am I making sense?

I was watching Masterchef earlier and made myself (but not so much DH) laugh: ?Tonight?s contestants are going to make themselves a baby out of the mystery ingredients ? a sperm, an egg, a petri dish and an aubergine.? ?Baby-making doesn?t get harder than this?. Ha ha!!

Hello to everyone else, hope you?re all doing okay xxxx

Sorry I've been AWOL, have been working late, going to bed early, and limited access to internet.

One of our embies was a grade 1, one wasn't, in fact no idea what it was, but they're both on board, giving it their best shot. Other than tender boobs and being quite farty (which could be either the progesterone, or the lovely organic figs I've been eating) I feel pretty normal. And occasionally a litte crampy around the ovaries, but I guess that's natural, since there's been a fair amount of activity there over the past week. Trying not to think too much about it. Evil boss is being nice to me, and while of course I'm being nice back, I'm not letting my guard down.

A couple of things made me smile, as I read back through all the posts I've missed over the last 5 days (IDreamInChocolate, I think we have the same sense of humour - loved your 'these aren't just any condoms' crack) -

Italian - you had me wondering exactly how, when you said you'd peed on the window ...

Bumpless, I can SO relate to that feeling of needing to pee before and during ET. I asked them whether anyone had peed on the bed before, and told them that perhaps today would be the first time. Didn't disgrace myself, though. And hooray re the wee three onboard! Splendid news.

Pumpkinjoy and Amber, sex has turned into babymaking for me as well. If DH is up for it and it's not a fertile time, I really can't be bothered - I mean, what's the point? Poor chap - I wonder if I'll ever think of it as just a recreational activity again?

Bumpless, we're banned from shagging for 16 days following ET, which is ok with me! Interesting how the advice we've been given is different - following my ET there was no lying down for 30 minutes, it was 'ok, you can have a pee now, get dressed, and head off'.

Dueling, I cut my finger on the ampoule too, and it bled like anything.

A big wave to everyone - so good to be back chatting to you all!

Idreaminchocolate always good to hear from you. I love Piccolo Levriero Italiano, especially Piccolo Levriero Italiano.

Progenova builds up the lining of the womb ready for the embies! I hope.

Radio play ? someone, was it kiwikat said it was really nice my getting an update from the clinic and said it was like a soap opera. I said it was more like a brief radio play. We got our update radio play today; we are so close now, just three weeks to go!

I like the sound of ?Nurturing Yourself Through IVF: Improve Your Experience, Maximize Your Odds of Success? by Lynn Daley which is pretty good. Where did you get it I could not see it on Amazon.

Kiwi keep that guard up. Go embies, go

It all sounds great, they sound lovely, grade 1 and grade whatever but hang on in there.

Hi Italian, you have reminded me that I'm not the only one who's been trying to get diffed for a long time. I hope you kick ass and give names this time! (that's my very best offer of encouragement!)

I'm still in the dark pit of yuck... things in my mind seem rather doomed to unsolvable puzzle stage. Happy Happy, Joy Joy!

Love to all

Raises hand for Idream yes, run out of emotions is just about sums it up for me.