Bus 9 - Donkey Cart departing soon, all aboard with ivf, pcos, endo, sub/unexplained fertility jump on

[Marvellouslymadmum]

New thread 😊😊

Hey hope everyone is okay. @Marvellouslymadmum do you know when you will get to move?

@Lauralozzle sorry it didn’t go well for you, hope you are both okay

@MrsBiddy so you know when day 1 will be?

im part way through injection ovulation induction cycle 2, follicles are very slow to grow this cycle so I am getting very impatient and seem to be surrounded by pregnancy or baby announcements. This cycle going so slowly also means the week off my husband and I had planned in march will probably have to be cancelled to be around for appointments which is disappointing so just generally a bit crap at the moment!

@MrsBiddy that's good that your docs want to check your progesterone was taken in the right day, my nhs consultant just insisted that it was correct if it was on day21 no matter how long my cycle was! 🙄🤦🏼‍♀️

@Lauralozzle sorry it didn't go well for you, hopefully the docs will be able to adjust things for you so cycle 2 though costly may be successful

@Alexis7890 we will be moved around March 10-15th but maybe somewhere temporary for a while 😑

@Alexis7890 Thank you. We’re fine. It takes on average 3 cycles, that’s what we’re telling ourselves. We’ve mentally acknowledged that we’re going to have to take a loan out to cover the costs. We might take out a bit more than we need, have a bit of a holiday too, as we’ve not had one all last year because we were forever waiting to start.

I’m sorry ovulation induction is going slow, fingers crossed they speed up! I know how hard it is with baby announcements! I’ve seen a few on my social media lately. They just make this journey so much more difficult. Hopefully your week off won’t need to be cancelled though.

@Marvellouslymadmum Yes, fingers crossed they have ideas for tweaking the next round. I suppose I’ll find out on the 27th! Hope your move goes well.

@Alexis7890

No, because my cycles aren't always regular, it's hard to predict. As you can see my OvuSense chart this month is flat and the previous month was normalish.

Has anyone with pcos tried clomid or letrozole and it was successful? Or how many cycles did you do before turning to ivf?

Xxx

@MrsBiddy i have done 4 cycles of letrozole and now on cycle 2 of fsh injections with PCOS. Letrozole didn’t work consistently for me but then I very rarely ovulated naturally (maybe once or twice a year) so letrozole wasn’t expected to work for me, it did once hence trying it for a few cycles, and the plan was always probably going to be fsh injections before ivf to try to get 6 ovulatory cycles. My consultant wants us to try 6 ovulatory cycles before ivf as our only problem is no ovulation so in his view if they can get ovulation to happen then our odds of success in 6 cycles is quite high. But if after 6 there is no success then we will go to ivf. If you already ovulate naturally I’m not sure what they will suggest. I think if I really pushed I could get an ivf referral now but my husband wants to try with these injections a while longer to try to do everything as naturally as possible

I haven't been on in a while and not caught up but just saw your update @Lauralozzle. I know how that feels, it's totally shit and I agree, feels like you're going mad. I said exactly that to my therapist this week, I feel like a mad person. See if you can find out more about your partner's sperm sample on the day and if it's fine get a DNA fragmentation test to rule that side of things out. A lot of it is honestly luck imo.

All I can say is try to give yourself time. It's not an easy situation to come to terms with and there's no guarantees it will work. I've just committed to doing more for the time being but it doesn't get easier and I may decide to stop rather than continue if it gets too much.

@Alexis7890 it was the bloody NHS who lost it so we did it again, and then we did another privately. Super annoying when we are already out of time here.

@Misty84 was it your DP that had antisperm antibodies? Lister prepped a sample as if for IVF and said he likely has ASA. I'm feeling even more deflated, it's hurdle after hurdle.

@Marvellouslymadmum the move sounds like a likely stressor!

@MrsBiddy we tried three Letrozole cycles before moving to IVF. It was unlikely to work for us though with the severity of the male factor issues.

@Lauralozzle Sorry to hear about your cycle. I have a dud right ovary too! Have you thought about where you’ll go for private treatment?

@thislittlebird Yes we have ASA, it does feel hopeless, yet don’t forget we managed a natural conception! God knows how with all the stuff that’s wrong with us…!

Ramsay has advised us not to do any more IVF (which we knew anyway). Our plan is to keep seeing him and trying to improve sperm... then maybe donor eggs 😪 Not what I hoped for in life and not quite there yet mentally but if it’s between that and no baby then I’ll take it. Closest next option to being fully ours. No guarantee it would work of course!
We’ve decided we can’t face adoption.

I’m bored of it all to be honest!

@Misty84I’m also very bored of it all. I just don’t see it happening tbh. It’s one problem after another and now his own antibodies attack his sperm so I really don’t believe we have any chance of natural conception. His motility is a tiny number once you take out all the dead and damaged ones.

Has Ramsay suggested anything for the ASA? I’m kinda annoyed that we saw him in 2021 and either ASA wasn’t tested for or it wasn’t picked up. It just says “INVALID” on the report.

Just had my NK Cells test done. I’m sure it’ll come back high, my immune system is over the shop.

I’m also not in a place where I can consider donors and don’t know what we’ll do really. I guess it depends how the third cycle goes and we’ll see which of the first two cycles was a fluke. I think we’re too old now to be going down the adoption path, I’m tired as it is.

@Misty84 @thislittlebird that's crappy for you both, we're terrified about stuff being.missed and looking at going for some immunology consultation.

Has anyone has a variable fsh? mine was 4-5 at start of treatments, then since covid it was 12, then 8.4, then 9.7. With the 8.4 my follicle count was half my normal (about 18) and progesterone slightly raised. With the 9.7 I had a good follicle count of 27 and other bloods ok so ivf postponed again.

I am very confused about what this all means and they haven't explained much - I feel my pcos is now the most controlled it has been and my high oestrogen previously may have been artificially lowering my fsh as I had egg quality issues during previous 2 cycles.
I'm on every supllement going for egg quality and pcos it feels already 🤣

@thislittlebird Thank you. I’ve been reading about DNA Frag tests and I think I’m going to raise that at the review. The crap fertilisation is either my eggs or his sperm, it’s crap whichever way you look at it. I’ve also read about AOA or zymot chip. It does make me think the likelihood of natural conception is very unlikely, given shocking fertilisation rates with ICSI.

I think spending some time on me and my mental health is a good idea. We’re thinking of booking a holiday, which will be nice, and slot it between treatment. All of last year we were waiting on tests and appointments and we didn’t have any time away. I think we need the break, to be honest.

@Misty84 I think we’ll stay with the clinic. We only have 2 which are local, I’m not ready to spend a fortune on one cycle in London. The clinic we’re at do extra testing which the other one doesn’t to the same degree, which is partly why we picked it for our NHS round.

I think the worst thing about unexplained diagnosis is that it literally could be anything. But I can’t help but think that one dud ovary that is small, often missed on ultrasounds and doesn’t respond to drugs is part of the problem. My thyroid and prolactin issue (although medicated with Levothyroxine) compounds the issue. I think my TSH needs to be lower but my GP is crap and won’t increase the dose. Think I’ll ask the clinic for thyroid blood test to see if my levels have fluctuated again and just swallow the cost. With all that history and we’re still unexplained seems like madness.

Peeps that have done private....did you have to get a referral from GP or NHS consultant in order to even make a consultation?? Just thinking ahead if I need to pursue immunology fertility etc to contact clinics and see if they even do it as what's the point in paying for a consultation only for them to say no we don't do that?!?! If I did that with multiple clinics the waiting time and cost of multiple consultation appointments would get out of hand.....

@kerrym87 no, not at all. Just had to book an initial consultation with the clinic and doctor of your choice. Good thinking though, I know not all clinics are big on it

You’ve reminded me I need to request my immune results.

@Lauralozzle long story I posted pn another thread, but we’ve just found out dh has antisperm antibodies after years of being in this process and are now seeing a top andrologist for it who is testing everything. If you’re not sure what’s causing it definitely deep dive into the sperm, they’re quick to blame the woman, in my experience. We’re going to Portugal for a few nights for my birthday in May. It was so expensive for just 4 nights, but we’ll try to do something in the uk summer too.

@thislittlebird Portugal sounds lovely. What are the options with antisperm antibodies?

Had our review. Consultant advised I get my thyroid checked again prior to next cycle. I remembered I had a test in Dec, didn’t hear from GP so assumed all was good as last blood test was fine after starting Levothyroxine. Asked for a copy of the bloods this week, found out TSH was 7.69. Although paperwork says above range, classed as no further action. I’m not happy, I specifically said it needed to be below 2.5 for IVF so I would have thought that would have flagged something.That certainly couldn’t have helped things. I have an appointment in two weeks with GP and I’m going to print off a load of stuff about thyroid levels. I need a medication increase.

Consultant said not sure if sperm or egg issue. Nothing noted to suggest poor egg quality (consultant checked with embryologist) and sperm sample was good. I’ve been advised to start proxeed woman. DH will do a SOS sperm stress test. Plan is, if that comes back as positive, 3 months on proxeed for him and then use zymot chip.

We’ll use AOA next round too.

Protocol wise, I’ll move to short protocol. Slightly less meds, but two different types of stims. Gonal-f and menopor (I think) rather than just ovaleap. I stimmed for 9 days on 300 ovaleap- consultant said it might have been a bit much for one ovary. so slightly lower dose (225) total over both meds, hopefully for longer than 9 days. Dual trigger, if buserelin is back by then.

Progesterone will be doubled.

We have to wait 3 months before next round, so looking May/June time.

I won’t be eligible for refund package due to failed round and poor embryo quality so looking at 2 round multicycle.

We’re also planning on having a break before we start. Thinking Munich, maybe April time.

How's everyone getting on? I'm waiting for period to arrive to get baseline bloods and scan fir the 3rd month in a row to see if we can start. Just the preparing and build up then the cancelling each time is bloody awful, 3rd time lucky maybe....
@Lauralozzle did you decide on Munich? We love Germany 🇩🇪

@thislittlebird did you get your results? X

@kerrym87 how come they keep cancelling? Part way through my latest injection cycle so got some scans next week to see if there is a follicle growing. This is our last attempt at ovulation induction, if no success then we will go to ivf

**@Ale@Alexis7890
They want it perfect as it's my third but no idea what the exact parameters are....January my progesterone was rasied fsh 8.4 and my follicle count was half my normal. Feb my progesterone was ok, follicle scan great but fsh was 9.7- they said they wanted below 10 but 10 and above usually means less of a response 🤷‍♀️ I do have an egg quality issue and atypical pcos but if fsh the same again I'm going to push to do it as although it only 36 my egg quality ain't going to miraculously improve as i get older....

What drug are you on, is it clomid or letrozole? X

@kerrym87 Hopefully third times the charm!

We have decided on Munich. Just need to book it, which we’ll do next week. thinking end of this month/beginning of next.

@Alexis7890 Fingers crossed for your ovulation induction.

I’ve managed to get my thyroid meds sorted (increased now) and we have the stress test tomorrow. Hopefully we have results for that soon after.

@kerrym87 oh how frustrating for you! Yes be pushy with them!! Letrozole didn’t work for me (tried it 4 times) so moved to gonal f injections, this is the third and final go with them before ivf. They worked once, failed once so waiting to see what happens this time!

@Lauralozzle will be a great holiday!! I’m hoping we can plan one for may as if this cycle fails like I think it will then we will have 8-12 weeks before we can start ivf so hoping to have a holiday in there to enjoy ourselves in that gap

@Alexis7890 Holiday in May sounds perfect. We all really need it after all this rubbish!

I have an update. We did SOS oxidative stress test and it came back positive. Levels high enough to indicate DNA fragmentation but not severe. Glad I got DH on proxeed two weeks ago!

Advice is to cut back on caffeine (for him) and eat a better diet. He needs to be on the proxeed 3 months though so looking at cycle in June/July time.

I’ve not been on much lately, nothing happening for us, other than me getting grey hairs, and can’t say when we’ll try again. Oh, except my husband’s DNA fragmentation was “incredibly good” 🫠

The only upside is we booked two holidays because it’s my 40th and we’re childless. Going to Portugal for a few nights in May and the Lake District for a week in July. I felt bad about spending the money, but our next IVF cycle is basically paid for, bar meds.

@thislittlebird that's great about sperm! You need to look after yourselves as there's so much you'll have both and to do and not done which makes life less enjoyable throughout this. You're more likely to be relaxed and destressed which can only help x

@kerrym87 i hope so, it’s all such a miserable process when it doesn’t work. Are you guys going anywhere? What’s next for you?

We’re a bit confused because the sperm specialist doc has just told us nothing more to do, all the tests are good for DH. Except we’re stuck here with antisperm antibodies and apparently that’s fine, they don’t even suggest anything for it. It’s so frustrating. Back to ICSI we go, I guess.