TTC 10 + months, part 14 (eek)

[GinSoaked]

A friendly, supportive thread for lovely ladies taking waaay longer than they ever expected to win their babies

MrsD I've not heard of that, I will ask. I don't get progesterone from the clinic just on the black market but instead I take a small dose ovitrelle 7 days after EC.

Art that was a great post. It is hard to know what's "right". I'm sure we are all bores about something in our lives but having kids does seem to create a special level all of its own. But some of my friends retain outside interests (hobbles for one!) and they are still fun to be around. Plus we have basically no child-less friends left so we have to hang out with them but I tell them to shut up when they talk about weaning or poonami's too often.

Hi ladies,

I haven't posted here in a while and, when I did, I didn't post that much so not sure if any of you remember me. Slight change of name from naokosan to naoko6 for reasons too stupid to mention.

I'm so pleased to see the recent success stories (sar, gin, art, doll et al) and it's good to see some positive vibes from those currently going through IVF and those going through their natural cycles in between (Mrs d, nelly, sea, lemons, rabbit).

Sorry if I've missed anyone. Hello also to any newbies!

I've been trying to avoid the internet at all costs recently - Facebook, Mumsnet, Dr google, the lot! But I have some worries I can't get out my head and you lovely ladies were my first thought of who to seek help from. A reminder of my situation - Husband and I have been TTC #1 for 18 months now (almost 19!) with no BFPs at all. We've had some preliminary tests and everything has come back fine so far except for one part of DH's semen analysis. He is quite a bit above average in all areas except morphology where he is only 2% normal. The doctor seemed to shrug this off and said it wasn't a problem as the other areas were higher than average and it should even itself out. He also said he sees this all the time and it's fairly normal. He mentioned something about the results being subjective as they only look at a small number of sperm and it coming down to human judgement etc

I just wondered if anyone has any experiences, thoughts or advice on that? I can't help but feel that 2% is really low, and everything I read online suggests that it's not a good sign at all. (Hence the Dr Google ban!)

Hope you are all well. I will go and look out that radio programme to listen to later. Since it's been a while and my post was a bit self indulgent, I will leave plent of wine (including alcohol-free for those who need it) and chocolate on the table on my way out.

Naoko - I do remember you. Welcome back. I think 2 or 3% is considered normal with the new WHO guidelines. What was your husband's count? I think the bigger the count, sometimes the worse the morph. I reckon it might be worth getting a second sperm analysis done because there can be huge changes between each one. Its so easy to get hung up on one number and the frustration is that it may be playing a part in sub fertility but it also maybe coupled with something else. Sorry this isn't helpful. Have you thought about IuI ?

I am loving the trend of cake and alcohol

I'm not the expert, others definitely know more. Your doc is partly right that 2% morphology with high volume and count and motility could still equal lots of very good sperm. (I am a saddo and i did the maths to convert my DHs results into actual good sperm!) I believe the scale of normal is pretty low though. So don't think 2% is comparing to a normal of say 50%, it's more like 5%. The scales are a bit confusing though. I think ladies on here have also had improved results through lifestyle changes and vitamins. Pine bark maybe? But I'm doing this from memory so don't take my word for it.

MrsD I might listen again to the programme if its worth it.

Naoko6
I don't have any personal experience with morphology issues. However, I have a very good friend who had similar results. It was not considered important by their 1st IVF doc but taken more seriously by others so I think it is subjective as your doc has said.
My friend did tell me that his morphology improved after seeing a Chinese doc and the herbs he helped. I know not everyone is into this (neither was he actually) but in the end it seemed to help in his case and for the last two IVFs they did. He had normal morphology.
Hope you get the issue resolved.
Staying away from Dr Google is good if difficult.

Sea - Ouch! Your bloodwork sounds like it was painful! I hope it doesn?t bruise too badly. If it isn?t too nosy of me, where are you headed up to in Canada? I can suggest a few nice places if you are interested. I have lived around Altlantic Canada as well as around Quebec/Ontario and visited a bit out west.

MrsD - That is fantastic news that both eggs fertilized! I think Arts advice was great.

Lemon - You made me laugh when you said you could steal the crib.

Gin - Sorry for the sickness. But your body seems to be making all the right hormones.

Sar - My clinic has a recommended sex schedule for people TTC. They suggest every other day in the weeks leading up to ovulation and then once a day from 2 days before O until O-day and then one insurance two days after O. Other clinics recommend ?saving? the sperm ? I think it?s hard to know. As for the no symptoms ? my mom never had any (with any of her 5 successful pregnancies) until her bump popped and she could feel the baby moving ? You might just be one of those lucky people who doesn?t get morning sickness.

Nelly - Yay for the insurance shag! I?m glad the trigger shot went well.

Noako - No idea about the SA results - sorry. My DH had some iffy morphology results last time and the MD asked him to get another analysis to be sure his wasn't thrown off by something like a mild cold or stress. So I would follow Joys advice and get a second test.

Welcome Ramona I really hope the clomid works for you.

To answer peoples question about the short cycle: I always hope that a shorter cycle will be good ? fresher lining, etc? but the last short cycle was followed by two anovulatory cycles. Which made me panic like a complete idiot yesterday .
If I look at the positive - AF will show up before meeting with the MD in May. He said that if I don't get an insta-duff after the HSG we will move forward. So until then I will have to get a grip and be patient.

PMT just forced me to gobble some of the chocolate Naoko left.

In return I will leave some ?Pouding Chômeur? (White cake baked within a maple syrup based sauce ? it's delicious even if it?s likely to give you diabetes).

So hello, waves, sugary treats and tea to everyone who is in their various stages of AC, limbo, pregnancy and lurking.

nao I don't think that morphology is necessarily a problem if the count is high. Although I'm sure I read somewhere that sometimes if there is a very high count and lots of dud sperm then they can cause a sort of blockage hindering the way for the good ones. Not that I'm in anyway suggesting this is your problem. I would also ask to get another sample done. It's so hard to read anything much into one.

nelly the programme didn't tell me anything new but the clinic came across really well, in particular the dr sounded lovely and if I was anywhere near there I'd be phoning to make an appointment. It was refreshing for ivf to be talked about by people who actually know something.

grouch lots of people do seem to get a BFP after a hsg. fingers crossed you're one of them.

Thanks ladies. My DH's count was 57million so not very, very high, just higher than average. I too have thought about the duff ones causing a blockage but not sure if that's actually the case. We're making a big effort to eat well and exercise regularly, although it might be a battle to get him to take vitamins (which probably rules out Chinese herbs also). Ill look into it some more. He's much better at taking the doctor's word on things than I am! I might ask for another test at my next appointment.

Oh dear, that "pounding chromeur" sounds like heaven!

TBH nao the various doctors we have spoken to have been fairly dismissive of things that are supposed to improve quality. The urologist did say that he should take a vitamin supplement with high does of zinc, vit C, folic acid. No smoking and limit alcohol. Some people say pine bark helps morphology but I think the jury's out.

DH is working late tonight, so I'm going to treat myself to my last cadbury creme egg.

Nice work on the creme egg MrsD. (Autocorrect wanted to change that to crime egg!).

I am still working as this is a busy week to have to take a day off for my pointless EC exercise. So I should probably get off MN again.

Just popping on to give a hand hold to den. I am sorry for this stressy day. Sometimes it seems that there is a slap accross the face at every turn. I think they may have triggeted you too soon, yes. But I promise you all is not lost. These 2 eggs stand a great chance as your problems are sperm meeting egg, now that can happen, there is no reason to think that these embryos cant become babies. Sending you the tightest tightest hugs.

Welcome to the new ladies.

Nao, our sa is similar, low morphology but very high counts. Fertilisation has never been an issue. My dh did do acupuncture which helped morphology levels but probably wasn't needed really.

Sea -ouch, the blood taking sounds quite something.

Loving the cake and wine. I have half a battenburg to offer around.

Sorry about the disappointment mrsd. But two embies are going back in tomorrow, so HURRAH and GOOD LUCK for them!

Keeping everything crossed for the other egglets growing and turning into babies all round!

Sorry about the painful blood tests sea. I really hope it works out for you!

Naoko I remember you, but I have no use. SB had some morphology issues and our first hospital worried about it, the new hossie was not worried as they threw all the rubbish ones away during IUI and then the rest was good enough. And of course, we did get a fertilisation once at least...

Welcome to more newbies - sorry I am struggling to keep up.

I went for a run just now emoticon, so I am scoffing all of the battenburg, leaving some crumbs and some decent wine for those who need it.

Hello all!

I've had a manic couple of days and I won't be around much for the next couple either. This is a pretty short trip and almost every minute of it seems to be filled.

I've caught up with all the cake, crub building and preggo symptoms, but don't have time to name check everyone now, but I will do my best to catch a few of you.

I had a lovely meet with critter on Sunday and met her OH (v nice and, if I may say so, pretty hot too. ).

Nelly - remember, IOTO.

Nice growing Madness

Good luck for ET mrsd.

ARGH, gotta dash again.

Thank you all for the lovely welcome and good wishes. I hope I can be of support to you ladies too. I'm learning loads already!

I am nodding in agreement with all of your posts, especially the ones about the contact with friends with children. I have drifted away from some really good friends who now have children, not intentionally by any means, but I suppose some of the friendships have just changed too much. Like lots of people, we are all sort of spread over the UK too, which doesn?t help, and everyone is so busy. It does make me a bit sad that we don't make more of an effort though. Having said that, some of my pals really are baby bores, so with them it's a case of liking one of the selection of baby pics on FB and feeling satisfied I've done my bit

MrsD ? I think it is utterly reasonable to expect a thank you for sending gifts ? it?s such an quick and easy thing to do, and it means a lot. My friends are usually pretty good, but I have to say I do notice (and moan about it to whoever's around) if someone forgets. I hope you are doing ok. Enjoy the creme/crime egg!
Joy ? they haven?t offered us IUI, just told us we had been added to the waiting list for IVF. Do you think it is something I should have asked for? MrR (bless his optimism) asked if the 18 months minimum was a worst case scenario, but nope, that is the current length of the waitlist. It seems like forever away, but we are lucky our GP referred us six months ago ? we were under a different hospital in the area that doesn?t offer IVF, and they were only going to refer us last week. Thanks for the welcome.
Artemis - your post rang lots of bells for me and I am also glad to know I'm not the only one finding work hard going at the moment... I hope all is going well with your pregnancy.
Gin - I read back and saw your good news - congratulations! Apologies for getting a song stuck in your head though!
Nelly - good work with the v impressive timing!
Sweet - good luck with the HSG - I hope it does the trick for you.

As for me, clomid so far seems to have inflated my already ample boobage to an almost comedic level. MrR thinks its hilarious to make honking noises in their direction, and they are even more sore than they usually are in pre-AF week. Other than that I have a bit of insomnia (probably caused by worrying about work) and hot flushes at night (PMT symptoms for me every month). I don't know if these are usual side effects - when I asked, the consultant didn't know either; 'let's hope it's a sign you're pregnant'... Well, erm, yes.

Good luck for ec nelly.

Good luck today MrsD and Nelly

Just running on to wave and wish nelly and Mrsd the best of luck today. you will both be grand xx

Thanks mad and ramona! I'm feeling chilled today, what will be will be. I'm already thinking of the next cycle though! I think we might be able to squeeze one in in August.

I've discovered a benefit to the progesterone, increased boobage. It's only been two days, at ths rate ill look like a p 3 model by the end.

Good luck Mrsd and nelly. Will be thinking of you both today and sending positive vibes your well.

V envious at therealramona and mrsd's p3 boobs.

Ramona - I think it could be worth asking for IUI. It can't hurt while you are waiting for your ivf go.

Just popping in quickly to wish nellie good luck for EC. May this be the golden egg!

And good luck mrsd for ET. Hang onto that chilled feeling - it's good for the 'bros!

I too am envious of increased boobage. I just seem to have bigger nips on the progesterone. They will soon be bigger than my non existent boobs

Waves and luffs to all.

Oooh bigger boobs! I look forward to that!

Thanks everyone. Working this morning then heading over late morning. I am starving and not allowed to eat or drink. This is making me very grumpy and not like a golden-egg laying goddess

Good luck MrsD!!

Completely unreasonable on the starving all morning situation. I still think of you as a golden-egg laying goddess though

The very best wishes to nelly and mrsden today.

Gin, hopefully pregnancy will increase your boobage Im pretty small to start although I did discover after reading the bra thread on here that I'm a d cup not the b I always thought I was.

Good luck to MrsD and Nelly!

Ample boobage you say? Hmmmm!

Very good luck today mrsd and nelly

Wanted to say to mrsd that your fertilisation rate was very impressive especially given the fact you did ICSI too.

at critter's hot hubby!

naoko MrP has borderline morphology issues too but a higher than average count. The first hospital weren't bothered but this hospital have been a bit more interested & we had to do ICSI at IVF. MrP has been taking vits for the last couple of years (nothing very fancy just bog standard men's vits) and it doesn't seem to have made an improvement.

Ramona Here's hoping that the flushes & insomnia are good signs. My only really noticeable Clomid side effects were ballooning to the size of a ruddy house and swinging between wanting to murder everyone (and then myself) and regularly sobbing like a loon. I think it was my lowest point TTC!

Ha at Progesterone boobage. Talking of which, did anyone else notice that their norkage has changed colour since IVF? I don't mean the actual nipples but the skin around them? I have noticed during my pre-AF ritual of madly scrutinizing boobage for any signs of updiffage a really whitened, inch wide ring of skin round both nipples