TTC Super Ovulation part 3

[Arianrhod]

Hey ladies -

There are a few of us who are ttc after mc's, however there will be ladies out there who are also ttc for the first time or second or third without success. If anyone is on, considering or had success on a super ovulation programme then do join us. How long did it take ? Did you try IUI with it.. ? Did you have PCOS?

Kicking this off and hoping some of you will join....

part 1 here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/conception/1385998-TTC-Super-Ovulation

Part 2 here:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/conception/1475108-TTC-Super-Ovulation-part-2?pg=1

Thanks, gratefully received. But Ari, you may be nearly 45, but you are obviously very fertile for your age, and while that is the case, there is as much hope as for anyone else having the treatment. Your rate of conception is like that of a much younger woman. And you know what your problem is, with the DQas.
But yes, I would certainly really go for it, with steroids too, if I knew there was a finite period that I'd have to do it for. And if I knew too, that it was just an immune problem, not anatomical, or age-related, or anything else ...
Does anyone know whether it's worthwhile having a repeat NK test while on hydroxy? Does it alter levels like steroids do? Or just alter their behaviour? I haven't had a test since I was first pregnant 4 years ago and I think if I knew my levels had increased dramatically I would start doing what you're doing, Ari, with the 10mg of pred. I may ask Louise.

Oh dear I feel like I have put everyone on a downer and send you all a hug. The whole FB thing must be difficult, having to see all the photos and what amazing things the baby is doing etc you all have my sympathies. I am not on FB (knew there was a reason not to be!) but couple of people at work just had babies and have go be happy for them and look at thier photos. If only people knew what we were all going through!!

Brown I am glad you said that about some people's pregnancies affecting you more than others as thought I was a bit strange like that! One of my good friends had a little girl about 18mths ago through ivf and because she lives round the corner I see her all the time. Her little girl is lovely and because she knows me and my dh so well she puts her arms up for us to pick her up. I was completely fine with her pregnancy but a girl at work who is generally really nice was about four months pregnant when I miscarried and I have had to really avoid her as it really upset me! It doesn't help that she comes into work with the baby all the time, I just make myself look really busy as she just passes the baby around.

We need some good news and positive tests on this thread soon..,

No, Pebbles, it wasn't you that put us on a downer, just life!
Emailed Louise yesterday about whether it was worthwhile doing a repeat NK cells test, and at first she said if I was happy with the management it was an expense I could avoid. Then I went on to say that I hadn't conceived since having my DH nearly 4 years ago, and that I'd be interested to know whether they had increased. She said to book an appointment as they have a new test for people who haven't conceived in a long time. Sounds intriguing. anyone had this/know what it's testing? Not sure if that's in addition to the NK one but I may have to dig into my ISA once again.

Brown stag I'm seeing mr s on Monday and Louise mentioned this to me so hopefully ill find out more then ;)
Pebbles it's not you that's putting downers it's our situations and the fact that it can be so easy for some and so unfair for others xx

Thanks Mel, I'd be very interested.

Oh, I also meant to say, for anyone who's planning on an AMH test, I found a cheap one online, with Duo Fertility, for £45. I've got an appointment on Thursday at my GP's to take the blood. It says it can be used any time of the month, but it doesn't mention fertility treatments. I used Clomid at the beginning of the month and it will be day 23 by then. Anyone know if that's okay?

Brown she was probably talking about the tnf-alpha blood test which I am having done if I don't conceive this month. You have that and a tb blood test and if it is high you have humira which is an injection two weeks apart and then another tnf-alpha blood test to see if it had worked. I think the blood test was around £250 and the two shots of humira if needed are £450 so not cheap! Thank god or credit cards! He said he us seeing done good sucsess with this and a couple of ladies had it while waiting for ivf and got pregnant naturally including one who had never been pregnant before.

Yikes I wish hubby wasn't coming with me now!! Still cheaper than ivf I keep telling him....

Tell me about it Mel as no doubt we will have to pay for ivf on top of these tests, think we will be on debt forever!! Have you had your follie scan yet this month or are you going soon?

How are you doing Duggsyou have been very quiet, must be all that swi!

Hey girls! I'm here.dr s seems to be wheeling this "new" test out to us all. He didn't seem impressed that I'd had it done back in may elsewhere. Well I hope it helps some of us on here that don't seem to be able to get anywhere. Any testers this week?

Thanks Pebbles. Has anyone had Humira? It sounds a bit scary, from what I've read!
How does this relate to DQ-alpha? In no way at all? Would I be right in thinking that Humira is the mother of all immune suppressants? Does it therefore cover all and any immune problems? Are the two injections all you need? So many questions!

Morning ladies - Just invading briefly on the Humira query...

I had it a couple of months ago. Definitely get a medic/nurse to do it for you - its £800 ish for two injections and you can only get it from central home care (unless that's changed since) so way too much money to risk messing up the injection if you aren't confident in what you're doing. In my case the first pen injection the nurse tried was faulty and exploded everywhere too and I'm not the only patient that's happened to...

I was allergic to it and wasn't allowed the second jab - I came up in a prickly itchy rash after about 5 days and Mr S put me on 25mg Pred to sort that out! Plus piriton and aqueous cream! He hadn't seen that bad a reaction but if you go online it seems slight rashes are not uncommon. But that's not a concern that would've stopped me trying it. It's all risk/reward at the end of the day.

I'd always say go for it but keep an eye out for the usual signs of allergic reactions.

Afaik DQ-alpha is a separate thing btw. Humira is to reduce TNF alpha which is causative/related to conditions like rheumatoid arthritics, Crohn's disease etc. it causes swelling somewhere. Sorry cant remember the details now but there's lots of info if you google. :)

Thanks Choccypud. That sounds quite a dramatic reaction. So presumably you don't know what effect having only the one injection has had on your TNF alpha levels? Does Mr S think you should just carry on with pred?
If the treatment works, does it result in a permanent change?
Duggs, what was the result of your TNF alpha test?

DQ-alpha is a genetic thing, humira has no effect on that. I was just going to say you should ask choccy for her humira experience, and there she was :)

Waves to ari - I'm still lurking every now and then! ;)

My levels did drop quite a bit. Anything over ?32 is high. I was at ?45 and dropped to 33/34 I think just with the one jab. However he'll tell you that the number isn't necessarily definitive in itself. So don't get despondent if your levels don't fall/don't fall by much. It stays in your system for a few months.

Mmmm, reading Dr Beer, it seems they are interconnected.
In the part about DQA combinations he says of a couple that share the 0501 genotype: 'Her NK cells may treat the rapidly dividing embryonic 'altered self' cells like a form of cancer and secrete TNF-alpha to destroy them'.
And he says that when a couple's tissue type is too closely matched (i.e. the DQ-alpha issue, category 1), it can start a chain reaction of problems in categories 2, 3, 4 and 5, namely blood clotting problems, an immune reaction to the baby, both partners having antiboides to sperm and white cells running riot.
Bloomin' complicated stuff! But I think this is the way to go for me. When I have some money ...

It's all very complicated stuff!

I wonder why the price I was given was so much different to yours Choccy? Great that just the one injection made a difference for you, will you have to take it again or is that it?

pebbles - you sure it wasn't £450 each, per shot? just a thought ..

Hi All, have been lurking for weeks but keeping my head down and massively sympathising with all the fb chat - so painful. Was really hoping to have some good news to share with you this pm, but sadly it is mc no.6 for us. I was too terrified to tell you about my bfp in Sept as only had last mc in July and not sure I was mentally prepared. Also I felt guilty that we conceived on 1st SO cycle which I realise is/was so lucky compared with what you ladies are going through. Sadly it was not to be and despite trying really hard with the pma I just am now devoid of all belief that I can carry a baby. We threw everything at it that we could: 25mg Pred, hydroxy, clomid, 800mg cyclogest, aspirin, folic acid, not to mention fish oil and vits etc. I can't have intralipids due to a soya allergy. We got 3 days further to 6w4days but should have measured 7w1day. But most importantly no heartbeat. It's the first time we have ever seen anything resembling a baby, which makes it all the more heartbreaking. We now have to decide what to do. Really don't think I can face another erpc (5th).
I have a high tnf alpha too 36.3 but Mr S says there is only evidence that it can impact conceiving through IVF and none that it plays a role in rmc. What do you all think? I can't face having the humira personally because I am so hideously allergic to everything. Pebbles are you due to test soon? Keeping my fingers crossed for you. Sorry to be all about me, was so hoping to provide inspiration rather than spread more gloom.

Sorry meant clexane not clomid.

ok catching up on here.
Firstly bellyd so sorry to hear this news. Have you considered perhaps looking into Dr Gorgy as he is much more closely aligned to Dr Beer's books and if this is going to be your one last time then you know you have done all you can. It might take a few months for you to decide.
Is kind of related to all the TNF alpha and humira talk as Dr S is only just "rolling it out" to all his patients but I can't help but think the pick and chose process with us all seems a bit half hearted at times. Doesn't it make sense that all is related? I guess if the treatment is similar then not so much to worry about ?
My result for TNF alpha was 27.9 anything under 30 is ok apparently.
The injection is £700 according to Louise and Dr S last monday... humira I mean.. for both.
ARGC have been using humira for a while now.

BellyD, I'm so so sorry. But I wouldn't give up hope of ever carrying a baby. Although my current situation is not much of an inspiration to anyone, my DS is a pred baby, after 4 miscarriages, and before having him I really believed that it would and could never happen. I just think that pregnancy was different somehow. I had to wait a few days for an appointment with Mr S once I had found I was pregnant with him, and so didn't take the steroids immediately, but my previous two pregnancies wouldn't even have lasted that long. Even though I know I needed the steroids, I also think the pregnancy was stronger in some sense in the first place. And your next one may be.
But only you can know what you're prepared to go through.
How long ago did Mr S say that about Humira not helping with rmc? Maybe he's changed his mind. After all, I once found an interview with him denouncing steroids in pregnancy!

bellyD just wanted to say how sorry I am for you. We are going to Mr G after we have had the investigations done by the NHS recurrent miscarriage clinic in January. It may be something to consider, especially since Mr S seems to be coming round to Mr G way of thinking. I hope you are taking care of yourself. I know that there is nothing that I can really say to make it better. So I will tell you a fact from the miscarriage book I am reading. 70% of women with 3 or more miscarriages will go on to have a successful pregnancy. To be honest that has been giving me hope this week so I thought I would share.

A very unmumsnet hug. Thinking of you.

What is that book lemon I like that stat!
Sounds like one I'd like to read. .

It is called "Coming to term: uncovering the truth about miscarriage" by Jon cohen