TTC 10 plus months, part 6

[mrsden]

A friendly, supportive thread for those of us who are taking a bloody long little longer time than average to conceive.

wine sore boobs was my first sign, when will you test

gin you've been an absolute champ at dealing with this crappy situation and as others have said, a good cry is well-deserved and probably cathartic!

joyce that is extremely, extremely annoying about your appointment. I hope you can change at least one of them, and explain to them what's happened. It's bloody sod's law - what are the odds?! I suppose at least the appointments have rolled around - the hardest thing about this is the constant waiting. Thanks for your kind words about homesickness and the positive thinking on the ovulation front. DH is American, so it's supposedly a permanent move for us, a concept I sometimes struggle with. We met in the US eight years ago - it was a bit of a holiday romance that extended when we realised how much we liked each other - and then we spent five years back in the UK before getting married and moving back to the US. I do like it here, a lot - I just miss my family.

nelly - a Caribbean island! Ooh, that sounds amazing! I bet you have some great memories of that .

princess thanks for the recipe, I love experimenting in the kitchen - my pride and joy is my yellow stand mixer - so I will definitely have a shot at that cake, sounds delicious! I might even share some with DH .

lisa it's funny where life takes you - and how much of our planning hangs on things we have no control over, like updiffedness. Sorry that you're feeling rotten today, I hope that the pain goes away.

frannie I am going to give the saintly eating a good shot. Can't hurt, I suppose, although I did eye the chocolates in my office kitchen today wistfully. I don't know about average fertility rates in the US, but I have heard that apparently the average age of women having their first baby at one very swish DC hospital is 38 - although that's probably more to do with the type of super high-powered jobs a lot of people in this city tend to have.

I've made an appointment with my OBGYN for next week to try to get a referral to a fertility specialist, as it looks like Clomid hasn't worked. I'm on CD24 but my temps look totally random - up and down with no clear pattern - and I feel nothing, no symptoms or cramps or anything. Oh well. We truck on, we truck on!

x-post - wine the sore boobs sound very promising indeed!

critter sorry that your temps are all over the place, does it vary much ?? Glad you've been able to get an appointment and hopefully things will start moving. Well the longer it takes the more holidays I get

Lisa they vary from 98.1 to 97.4, so it's less the variation than the fact that there's no clear biphasic pattern iyswim. Just up and down and up and down. Gah. Thanks for the sympathy and I totally agree, lovely holidays are one of the few bright spots to not having an ankle biter yet!

Morning ladies

I've missed loads... been away for a few days doing tourist stuff with my brother & his family who have been visiting from overseas. I have been lurking though. Huge commiserations to gin, I am really sorry this cycle didn't work out. It sounds like you're dealing with it really positively but you still need to give yourself permission to feel crap... hope you have some treats planned for when DH is out tonight. Hugs.

Lemons fingers crossed for successful outsourcing. Euro surely not long to wait now?

Joycep hope you're doing OK without your DH and that he's back soon. Your friend's comment was pretty insensitive, and untrue as many people have said.

Purple I too marvel at the mysteries of EWCM as mine is also absent without leave. I'm blaming clomid, but even before I took that the fertile CM occurred randomly if at all. Probably because in fertility terms I am a geriatric. We have tried using preseed (which I don't much like) but I don't see how that's going to do any good when surely the swimmers need a boost up beyond your cervix? Who knows what the hell is going on up there. I have visions of barbed wire, searchlights and massive 'keep out' signs, if not actual sperm-slaying monsters...

Gentle fish slap for Wine, though I've got my other hand behind my back with fingers crossed for you...

I'm impressed with all the super-healthy diets. Princess your DH's cake sounds amazing. I tried giving up dairy a few months back but we're veggie and being vegan by default was a step too far. I hated all the dairy substitute stuff and eating out was virtually impossible. I have wondered whether eating fish/meat would make a difference but my DP reckons I am clutching at straws and he's probably right. We have veggie/vegan friends with kids and all the coke-swilling McDonalds eaters out there seem to have no trouble in replicating themselves. Critter I too like the idea of being ripped for summer, I'm not bad at going to the gym but tend to use it as an excuse to have wine and chocolate at the weekends so my six pack is a way off yet

Nelly I am embarrassed at how long I've taken to figure out your secret hobbling. At first I thought you were a lion tamer or something. Then I wondered if you were one of those ladies who does circus tricks on the back of ponies in a spangly leotard with feathers sticking out of her bum. Now I reckon the reality is somewhere in between

It's all a bit crap here. Evil spotting started yesterday at 11dpo and my temp has plummeted today so it looks like AF is imminent. I was trying not to hold out hope for this cycle but had clearly hidden some away as I feel crap. I am just sick of this now. It's time it was my turn. Had another preg announcement yesterday from a colleague. She is a lovely woman but I can't feel happy for her, just jealous as hell. The only place I want to see preg announcements is on this thread.

Been trying to get through to the clinic since mid last week to see if i can bring my next appt forward from end May, so I don't waste yet another month after my last clomid cycle, but can't even get past the answerphone. I also want to query a statement in a letter to my GP in which the gynae has described me as "a case of secondary infertility". I've only seen that term used to describe women who have already had children. Neither my DP nor I have any kids so I'd like to know if that's an error, or if it's not what that term actually means. Anybody know? It wouldn't fill me with confidence if they can't even get the basic facts right.

Meh. Sorry for me me me. It's just crap, isn't it? I know what you all mean about ttc being completely divorced from pregnancy. I can't imagine being pregnant or having a baby. DP remains sanguine and keeps saying it'll work out for us but I just feel time running out now and I don't really see how it can. We had a great time hanging out with our nieces, Becks I felt the same as you, my DP would make a terrific dad. I will be so gutted if he doesn't get that chance because of me. or does a Rod Stewart and pisses off to impregnate someone half his age

Off to self medicate with a big bucket of coffee and am already eyeing up the wine for tonight.

Waves to all

becks It's nice that you enjoyed playing mum. I totally avoid any of that stuff because I just get too down.

lisa are you feeling less sore today?

frannie I too was told that Clomid was a no, no in cases where ovulation occurs naturally. Another example of random & non uniform NHS treatment plans methinks. I did get the impression though that Clomid is the treatment the consultants are itching to prescribe and always felt that they were almost disappointed when my bloods showed ovulation.

nelly Lordy, straight from AF into shagging mode. Mind you going straight into the 2ww isn't a bad thing I suppose!
Nothing much happened on my first consultant appointment. I just got talked at a bit, made to feel like a tool and got given a load of paperwork for the HSG, SA and bloods.

joycep Oh for goodness sake, what bad luck about your appointments. You really couldn't make it up! Is there any way you can make both or would it be too much of a risk of missing one?
I totally get you on the weird ideas about conceiving. I did chuckle at you taking your engagement ring off Having said that I have charity shopped alot of my childhood stuff this week because I have got the idea that since I have picked this stuff up from my mum's house we have had nothing but bad luck I seem to be obsessed about being born "unlucky" at the moment.

critter all the stuff about hormones and chemicals in food is interesting. I must admit that I have this bullish resistance to anything organic and deliberately go out of my way not to buy it. I do the same over reduced fat stuff & low calorie too (except milk but that's a taste preference thing). Sometimes I think I just like to act like a bell end! That said I do believe that if there was a problem with chemicals in food then there would be a more widespread fertility issue.

mrshy1 Wow at your impressive egg production

euro So hoping that PMS signs are a good sign for you. It amazes me why preggo symptoms have to be so bloody similar to AF signs. It is all some conspiracy to drive us silently round the bend.

princess I like the sound of your cake and also am envious that you have a DH who makes you cakes. DH rarely does anything in the house cooks and the few times he does without fail I will find his hair in my food [boak smiley] Am thinking of investing in a hair net for him.

lemons how are you feeling today? Hope that all is less sore and that you are keeping yourself distracted!

gin I'm sorry that all the emotions of the last couple of weeks have caught up with you. It isn't surprising. I hope you feel a bit better after letting some of it out. Sorry that your DH is going out I too would have been miffed if it was my DH I advocate a girly TV night, PJs and a tub of icecream.

wine What the dickens are manu laps??????? Very scared now! I don't even have pierced ears so there's no way I can get my belly button pierced to cover up these hideous rolls of scarred flesh I am imagining manu flap thing.
Also have a fishy slap but really ohhhhhhhhhhhh and mmmmmmmmmm......

artemis and purple my cm is also very random lately. Odd.
artemis I am with you on the not believing anymore. I used to be able to picture having a baby but that seems to have faded and I find myself dwelling more on what we are going to do with no baby in our lives. I think I have already decided that depending on what the consultant says in May (ie whether IUI or IVF is an option) if I'm not upduffed by the end of this year then I think I will draw a line under it all.
I thought that Secondary Infertility was in cases where a woman has either previously had a baby or at least been pregnant. Odd that they could make such a mistake in a letter. Maybe I am mistaken in my understanding of the term. Good luck with trying to get through on the phone and definitely query it because you don't want incorrect info on your medical notes.

Quick wave to critter, artemis, pout and the others. Feeling much better, wrote a job application adn will send it in a minute. Then muchos work to do, as I produced the letter while "working from home". Still mopy, but we're off for a few weeks to sunnier climes soon :)

Just quickly and waving to all, wishing well.

Artemis thats really not good at all. Secondary is what is says, after the birth of one or more without assisted reproductive tech or meds. I feel for you, horrid when the most obvious things go wrong. I had an HSG years ago (private in the states) the results were lost. I was told at the time that I was fine, just clearly not having enough sex, but no one bothered to send the results to my doc. This one of many issues that totally put me off dealing well the whole issue. Give them hell.

Sorry have to run.

Thanks euro and yes ? the progesterone definitely isn?t helping. I seem to be alternating between constipation and diarrhoea at the moment ? nice. Hope the PMS turns out to be preggy symptoms for you.

Princess your cake sounds awesome! Glad you?re feeling good on the no-dairy plan. No I don?t think we have spoken before but glad I was able to raise a smile with my poo story! I?m afraid I?m very much a ?sharer? ? in RL as well!

Hello lemons ? thanks. I am indeed she of frittata fame, although I?d like to make it clear to any new readers that I did NOT attempt the sitting on loo/spermy egg/mooncup trick myself. Bleurgh.

Hi critterpants and thank you ? I feel much better today although last night/early this morning was a bit hairy. I?m afraid I?m rather like you on the organic front ? I buy it when I see it/it suits me but otherwise I don?t bother, and we eat out so much that I can?t possibly check what I?m eating all the time. But do I honestly think I?d be updiffed now if I was better at it? To be honest, nope.

Hi joycep! Do you remember the short luteal phase thread we were both on? What ever happened to that. I still don?t know if that is what was preventing a pregnancy for me. I now think it could be a combo of that, late ovulation, and DH?s not very motile all the time swimmers. Who knows. PS, if it helps, I managed to move my first NHS consultation appt with fairly little bother ? hopefully things will be the same for you.

Gin ? sorry to hear about the wobbly night but am pleased that you got a good night?s sleep afterwards ? you need to rest and relax as much as you possibly can. My DH is also playing silly buggers ? he told me last night (as I was trying to drink water, hold a hot water bottle to my massive abdomen and take painkillers all at the same time ? lying down because if I got up I felt sick) that he is going out to some company?s birthday party tonight. Woopdy doo for him. He keeps telling me I?m ?milking it? too!!

Lisacn ? nice to meet you! Good luck with the tamoxifen ? I don?t know anyone who has used it for fertility but I hear it is quite common these days. Sorry you are feeling rubbish with it though ? good luck with the scan.

Hi frannie! Did they also test your testosterone? I used to have full blown PCOS but 5 years of metformin later I still have the cysty ovaries but none of the other symptoms ? and my bloods are all now normal.

Wine ? fingers crossed for the sore boobies! That sounds positive if it?s out of the ordinary for you.

Artemis I?m sorry to hear about the spotting and I completely understand you desire to move things forward. And yes, secondary infertility means that you?ve had a child/children and are struggling to conceive another so that?s completely wrong of them to use that terminology in the letter. Please don?t give up hope though ? although in the meantime the self-medication sounds like a winner.

Hi to pout! Yes ? I feel a bit like a battery hen. In some ways, even though I?ve advocated not giving up hope in my post to Artemis above, I do think that moving towards some kind of acceptance and seeing a line in the sand could be healthy. We?ve already decided that if this first cycle doesn?t work (which it probably won?t, statistically) then we?re going to wait at least three months before trying again ? it was all plain sailing until egg collection but since Monday I?ve felt pretty rotten and things are likely to get worse before they get better. It just takes it out of you and there are other things in life to focus our energies on, even though it doesn?t feel like it sometimes. And maximum of three cycles ? then it?ll either be acceptance of being child-free or adoption.

As for me, still feeling quite grim today and I don?t think it?s all poo related! Still gulping the water and hoping that the unit will call me today and tell me they?re waiting for a blasto transfer on Saturday rather than a 3 day transfer today ? I seriously doubt I can get myself to the hospital/they?ll be happy to do the transfer when they see the size of my midriff. ☹ x

Thanks ladies. I need to test tomorrow morning to see if I can stop the steroids for this month, but I don't feel at all hopeful. I will be glad to drop the steroids and get a decent night's sleep anyway.

I've also decided that after the best part of 3 months not drinking, I am going back to moderate drinking for the next (IUI) cycle, before kicking it again for IVF. In part this is because I need to feel like me again and I love my wine, and in part because we have a long weekend at the inlaws' place in France coming up and I just can't contemplate that without some of the local rosé featuring! Wine has always been a big part of our previous trips there. And luckily the trip will fall pre-ov so there will be no possibility of me being pregnant, meaning that nearly mooing meat and unpasturised cheeses will be featuring too!

pout I am also starting to consider for the first timereally what life will be like if this doesn't happen for us. I think one of the reasons I am so scared of IVF is that there is nowhere to go after that (except more IVF). It's just a big step nearer the end of the road.

joycep how annoying about the appointments. I hope you can sort it out. I would have thought the private one should be the easier of the two to move.

Artemis as far as I know, secondary infertility does mean an inability to conceive after you already have one or more children, so it sounds like they have got it wrong. It doesn't really instill confidence does it?

The diet thing is interesting. There was a similar debate yesterday on the Pred thread about vegetarianism. There are quite a few veggies on there. I am an ex-veggie (or reformed veggie, as I prefer to call myself). Obviously eating meat hasn't turned things around for me, but it does seem like an unusual number of veggies are having problems. I wonder if there is something in it. Maybe more protein helps or something. But then, some of the veggies on the Pred thread are now pregnant and of course loads of veggies must get pregnant without problems.

Morning ladies
Gin don't worry about being emotional as you say you've been given a cocktail of hormones and it's a very difficult thing. It's ok to be sad. I think it helps you to move on and that bottling things up makes it all the worse. I would be very upset if DH was going out and I was feeling so rubbish and then I would feel guilty for stopping him and then I would be sad again. All this is pretty pants. So as pout says, sofa, pjs, ice-cream and a girly night is just the ticket. Hope you are feeling better soon. I think you sound incredibly brave and positive :)

Artemis Hope you had an nice time with your family. Sorry that you feel AF is looming. I too have had the if I can't give you babies then you will want to procreate with a more fertile being. DH responded with, "I don't see you as a breeding machine I see you as a person and I just hope that you are healthy". It still worries me tho. I had a look on the NHS website for you because I'm sure I read about secondary infertility the other day. Their official line is:primary infertility, where someone who has never conceived a child in the past has difficulty conceiving secondary infertility, where a person has had one or more babies in the past, but is having difficulty conceiving again. (It can also apply to people like me who've MCd). Surely this line is clear as a bell and your consultant is completely wrong?!?! Maybe you should refer him to the NHS website. Oh really, it's pathetic. I'm sorry it's so rubbish for you and I hope all goes well with your GP. Oh and you said wine !!!! Hope you have a good day today.

Artemis, Purple and Lisa I don't think I've had proper EWCM since I was a teenager, when I remember thinking that I had boggies coming out of my lady bits. Still let's wait and see it could be panda month this month. If I eventually have a daughter I will be teaching her about all this stuff super early and not actively discourage teenage pregnancy!!!!

Pout at hairnet. I imagine your OH to have massive, flowing rock god locks now .

Lemons hope you are feeling much better and positive today.

Wine sore boobs and metallic taste. Could this be........ Fingers crossed lady!

Critter at your yellow stand mixer, is it the holy grail of mixers.... the artisan KitchenAid? I so want. DH was going to buy for my 30th then I got a bit stroppy and said that I didn't want a household appliance for my 30th!! Sorry to hear your temps are all over the place.

Sorry if I've missed anyone. I've got a heap of work on today and have to leave early to see the nutritionist this afternoon, followed by heavy lifting at the renovation site we call our new home. Feeling anxious today as I'm seeing the GP tomorrow morning and appointments always correlate with huge slumps or huge highs followed by huge slumps. I kinda think it's either the crushing reality of the situation illuminated by cheapo NHS strip lighting or the false hope followed by the crushing reality. I feel like a huge failure at the moment. None of my family have had difficulty with babies - Nan (3), other Nan (8), Mum (3), Aunties (2 each). These pregnancies happened v.easily and without a sniff of a thermometer or brown diet. Still feel weird about the bobbly ovaries, lack of CM, double periods and cynical about the brown diet. But what else is there to do? Keep eating brown things, keep shagging, keep tidying the flat for viewings, keep moving rocks from the kitchen floor, keep faking happy at social gatherings and just keep on doing this thing we called life. Big sigh. Damn the anxiety. Tail feathers on strike. Waves to all. xxxx

The letter is sent (and I am back here, oops!)

Fingers crossed euro and I whole-heartedly subscribe to the a little bit of everything you enjoy diet (and a lot of cake and wine at certain points in the cycle). I am drinking moderately post-iui and like my meat raw . I am going cold turkey the moment a pg materialises and possible through IVF but not before. And France without wine is just WRONG. So enjoy it. Although I really hope you get a surprise result tomorrow!

Sorry mrsfritatta I remember you never did it, but am still grateful for the distraction and entertainment you seem to provide when you come on the thread. Fingers crossed for beautiful growy embryos that will be put in over the weekend. Just keep drinking and relaxing, OHSS is not to be trifled with.

GRRR at artemis' notes, they are clearly WRONG and at the loosing of private results purple. This all would be hard enough without this sort of incompetence. Re: notes though, I was grateful when we picked up our notes from the previous hospital that there was no mention of my crazy crying before they came near me in the HSG (a case of over-googling). It was all formal. My DH and I both learned everything by heart and googled loads. But that only confirmed our unexplainedness.

X-post with princess and sorry that you are feeling low, patting the tail feathers gently. Fingers crossed for a productive appointment. And I like you DH's response to the "will you leave me for some more fertile being" question. Well done him. Maybe plan some stuff you do enjoy properly, rather than just putting your head down and continuing). (Brown) dinner out? A walk with your DH? SSI (sans intent)? Pubbage? Proper night/day out?

purple It's not good when your confidence in the system has been rocked. I wonder how many mistakes happen that we simply don't know about.

lemons good luck with the job application.

mrsHy It sounds a bit grim at your end. Not nice that you are so uncomfortable. Hope it passes soon

I agree euro about having a break from the virtuous lifestyle for a bit probably won't be a bad thing. Definitely just enjoy your holiday away in France guilt free.

princess Life is all about plodding along when you have TTC crap hanging over our heads isn't it. Sorry that you feel a bit down. Maybe you will feel uplifted and spurred into optimism after your nutritionist appointment.

Following the chat about DHs AWOL on work dos and jollies I am mightily and probably unreasonably hacked off with DH. He telephoned from work to "run past" me a work trip abroad (incidently he doesn't have to do it, think his boss thought it might be nice for him to do a more exciting job in the sun). Anyway the trip is VERY abroad (a days travelling either side of the work part) and is sometime in May, details sketchy. I'm not keen for him to go so far away so close to having the lap and then there is the consultants appointment mid May. I also am a little bit aware that we don't know what type of news we might get after the lap. I told him as much and got the silent "you gave the wrong response" reaction but he said he will tell his boss that I don't want him to go!!!!! Also am pissed off that he thinks this is a minute worthy conversation for the middle of the day & that he hadn't considered the hospital stuff at all. I probably am being a bit me, me, me.....my operation, my operation, my operation and a selfish, pathetic moo to boot but I really just want to get the op over with without the worry of him going away so soon after.

Sorry me, me post.

How close is it to the op, pout? I think I said on here before that I had mine on a thursday or friday and was back at yooni 150miles away on Sunday night with no family or anyone to support me and I was fine. Can he at least pin the boss down on dates so you know what he is asking of you with regards to dates? The dog walking is an extra consideration for you that I didn't have.

princess I had loads of EWCM (only for one day a month, but strings of it) until a few month into ttc. It disappeared around the time I started taking agnus castus, but I am not sure if that is just coincidence - it's not a typical side effect.

That's the problem euro the dates are sketchy. I think that I am annoyed because I don't think he should consider committing to the trip when he doesn't know how it might fit in with our appointment later in May but all he seems interested in is a few days in the sun and sod the hospital.

Maybe I am just a bit more apprehensive about the lap than I thought hence the over reaction. I think in my mind I am just trying to focus on getting it over with and don't need the aggravation of working around this trip. All tinged with my annoyance over the fact that DH seems to see the lap as on a par with going to the dentist. GRRRR

I think it would be quite reasonable for him to say (and for you to expect him to say) "my wife is to have an operation in May. Obviously I will need to be around for that. I would love to go on the work trip though, so if you can wait for a firm answer until you have the dates, hopefully I will be able to confirm then" or words to that effect.

Mr Pout does need to realise that alhough it is a minor op, they are cutting into you(!) and you will be having a GA! And there can be post-op complications (e.g. my allergic reaction and the problems whatmess had) And given the difficulties of scheduling these things, work will have to fall in around it!

Thanks euro good measured advice as usual! Only wish that I had delivered your response rather than my own version that may have involved a smattering of FFSs

I think the FFSs are entirely understandable in the circumstances!

Ok i shall blame the pressures of ttc for my overreaction at the double booking last night. I don?t seem to be able to cope with tiny little issues these days. Just walked in to the clinic and they are going to send me a new date for July. I don?t feel ready to start monitoring cycles etc in the next few weeks and secretly hoping the nhs will come up trumps and say ?ah yes that?s why it is not happening. Take this pill and you will get pregnant?. Yeah right, who am i kidding

Oh wine - kipper slap from me but oooh at metallic mouth and sore boobs...it would be the most uplifting and inspiring story if this was your month. Come on wine!

critter - i can imagine it?s very difficult being away from family and i expect ttc issues just makes everything worse. When you get pregnant , i bet the homesickness goes away. Well done on getting the obygn appointment ? i hope they can help you out.

artemis - i am sorry you are going through a crap time at the moment with spotting, preg announcements. Life just loves throwing it all at once doesn?t it? And for what it?s worth, i never feel happy about other people?s pregnancies unless they have struggled or they are on our lovely group. It does sound like they have got your secondary infertility in a muddle though...what the hell is wrong with people.

pout - it?s strange , you do start to look around you and wonder what is causing the bad luck. I must say whenever i have good luck , it does quickly run out so i keep going through phases of thinking i am unlucky. Sometimes i just need to get grip and realise that actually i am lucky but again ttc distorts everything. Oh dear I am sorry about MrPout. Does it sound like it?s going to be a long trip? I think he should be around especially if his job doesn?t depend on it. When you are pregnant and have a baby, then our dh?s can go away all they like but i would be getting a bit upset if it was my dh. I have had to tell mrjoy not to go away on several occasions but i guess these were long stints abroad but having him away at the moment has made me realise I couldnt? have him away at critical periods like after an operation. I second Euro?s ? my wife is having an op? advice and he needs to be around.

mrshy - i remember our short lp thread well! That was over a year ago now and i don?t feel i?m much further on. I suspect my short LP was a red herring ? there is no way that can be the only reason for my body not baking a bun. IVF is sounding like it has been fairly brutal for you and i thought it wasn?t suppose to be physically demanding. Poor you and I?m sorry you are feeling so grim. I think having a plan of what you will do if it doesn?t work is very healthy but of course i hope to goodness you don?t need your backup plan. Best of luck with the transfer ? what is the difference between a blastocyst and a day 3 transfer? Clearly i need to learn a lot.

euro - your words about ivf really rang true. That is why i?m so scared of ivf ? that really it is the last chance saloon and if that doesn?t work then that is basically that. Anyway it?s probably best to put those thoughts at the back of my minds. Best of luck with testing tomorrow.

princess - none of my family had problems conceiving either which my mother kindly pointed out. I have about 36 cousins because all my first cousins had buckets of kids. I put it down to me being in the 1 in 6. It was bound to happen. . darn. I try to tell myself that what doesn?t kill me, makes me stronger although not sure this is making me stronger.

pout I meant many not Manu a manuka lap sounds not so bad though! Naughty mr pout! Not the best timing at all. You will need help with the dogs. I was still fairly tired a week after mine, we went to a farmers market for an hour and I came home and slept for two. Ops take it out of you, even if they are fairly small. I think whatever they find is good actually because then you know and can move forward. But if you suspect endo and they find it and laser bits off, it might be a bit more bruisy feeling. I was convinced I had endo because of odd bleeding and pain. Got a bit more than I gambled for!

joycep ivf is scary in that way, I often feel that. Like if that doesnt work then what the fuck else could I do? I will think of that news lady who had four goes, bought a dog and then got updiffed by herself. We must keep doing the tail feather dance!

hy sorry you feel rotten. Good luck with the next bits.

Artemis I'm ruffling your feathers for you. Sorry about the spotting, I really hate that part of my cycles the most. It feels like game over but with a hint of teasing, very hard. I had two cycles post lap where it just started and it was much better. In fact I only like cd8-14! no period, no possibility of being pregnant. Maybe I should just go back on the pill for sanity! But seriously, can't ever imagine a trip to the family planning clinic again. princess someone at my school actually did get pregnant from 'heavy petting'!!! Well, that's what she told everyone...

Lisa I can't remember what testing feels like, spotting always gets there first. 11dpo here in last chance land. And no spotting. Boobs still hurty and metal taste but I suspect that is an ulcer . I've had no mood this month. But spotting WILL come today or tomorrow. I had a period cramp last night, fleeting, but it was there. On cycle 16 and a right angle bulgy womble, I think best to be realistic and stock up on Tampax and paracetamol.

Wave everyone. How sick I am of this rain. You have the right plan lemon oh and yay euro to drinking! My non drinking was rudely ruined by an ice cold glass of Cloudy Bay or three this week, baths just aren't the same without wine.

Hi princess, what does angus castus do?

Who else takes a multi vitamin? Which ones are the best?

Should I be taking any other supplements?

I'm feeling good today not sure why but it feels good!

Waves to everyone

Hurray for feeling good becks I currently take vitamin d, folic acid and vitex (agnus castus) in liquid form. Vitex has made me less grumpy and have a lot lot more ewcm, unless that's just by chance. I have spent a lot of money on supplements but I'm not at the moment. Zita West do a good set if you fancy posh mega bucks ones in a pretty bottle. But mostly I took the pregnacare ones. Unfortunately, the iron in multivits disagrees with my ibs. Oh and I'm addict to rescue remedy, mr wine thinks it because it's alcoholic.

Thanks wine... He he to the alcoholic rescue remedy. Can I get the vitex in a health food shop or online? Is it expensive?