TTC for 10+ months, part 4

[eurochick]

Time for a new thread as the other one is just about full.

Fingers crossed for lots of patiently-awaited BFPs on this one!

Hi All sounds like some very mixed weekends.
Starting to get christmassy here. Went and saw my cousins and their nearly 8 week old baby daughter yesterday. She is absolutely gorgeous, calm, sleeps well, eats well. All the time with her confirmed how much I want a baby of my own and as soon as humanly possible. The other thought was how it should be me and my dh as well as them.

Hope you get on ok with Clomid Pixie I think that is the route I shall be going down in the New Year.

pout Letrozole is similar to Clomid but apparently has fewer side effects so my consultant prefers it. I think Clomid is usually prescribed on the NHS though, as it is cheaper. My NHS consultant wouldn't consider Clomid - said it was pointless as my progesterone test shows I am ovulating. An ovulation drug was the first thing my private consultant suggested. So I am giving it a go before IVF. I am currently on my last unmedicated cycle (probably - if AF is late it would mean I need my scan to check I am not hyperstimulating right on Xmas day when the clinic is closed so if I am late we might need to wait another month).

Ladygee telling people has worked well for me too. Almost everyone has been very understanding and appropriate. And as you say, it stops the awkward questions!

I'm not feeling Christmassy at all this year. I really can't be @rsed. Unfortunately we have my parents and MiL coming here, so I can't just pretend it isn't happening. Meh.

Thanks for all of your good luck wishes ladies, surely a BFP must be around the corner with all of the positive vibes not to mention the drugs!

I hope Letrozole does the trick for you too Euro. So far I've felt pretty good really. I'm not sure whether the clomid has put me in quite an 'up' frame of mind, or whether starting the drugs has just made me feel like things might be moving in the right direction, it's good though whichever. Other than that I've been feeling a little bit flushed, though at this time of year it could well be the cold/central heating. It's not bad so far anyway.

Quiet on here today. Any sign of AF joycep? or irrational mood swings pixie?

I total meh-land today, contrarily coupled with a rising sense of panic. Went to bed last night realising that we'd need to start shagging again by Friday. However OH needs to do another SA. It needs to be between 3 and 7 days since last ejaculation, it's been more than 7 days since we last had sex so he can't go this week. Even if he took care of himself tonight we'd be into my fertile time by the end of the week. So another month goes by where we can't get referred. So I lay in bed with panic literally rising and choking me; and at the same time had an internal argument dialogue with him where I ranted patiently explained why this tiny thing he had to do was fuck all nothing compared to what I'd have to do even if I got a natural BFP, never mind fertility treatment. He also won't give up his once a night ciggie, a habit I hate anyway but he said his first SA was fine so why did it matter . The other day when I had my meltdown, he said "well do you need to go to the doctor and get checked?" which was an innocent comment but did sort of make me feel like he was pouting out I was a "fault". So I am feeling angry at him which is daft as it's not really who I'm angry with at all.

So in my panic I've spent half the day reading other threads on MN -conception, pregnancy, ante-natal clubs etc, as if the reason I'm not pregnant yet is because I haven't done enough research ; but also it feels a bit stalker-y, like I think we said on this thread before about hurrying down the baby aisle in Sainsbury's as if expecting a tannoy alert pointing out you have no business being there.

I'm on phone so aware this likely makes no sense and is a bit ranty! Hope everyone else is feeling more human than me

Big hugs sent your way Nelly. I hate being in that sort of mood, arguing with yourself over and over, but still not able to 'win' the argument and make your point clearly.

If your OH ejaculated tonight, he could maybe do the SA on Friday, and you can maybe still SWI on Friday night or Sat morning. It won't be perfect, but anything is better than nothing, and it sounds like the lack of referral is stressing you more than the chance at missing an early chance at SWI? When is your predicted ovulation?

If his SA was ok last time, then he should have enough sperm to do both jobs really. Someone on here (or somewhere on MN) was saying that the 'every other day' rule was for men with possible fertility issues, and that every day was fine for everyone else.

If the SA comes back on the low side for this sample, then you and he will both know you cut the timing a little close, and could perhaps suggest that might have happened to the doctor? If it came back fine then it would just be over and done with and you can move on for your referral.

Hope this helps. I'm going to force ask my DH to do his sample tomorrow morning, so we can get his SA results back. We've had the pot over a month now, but as I've already got my consultant appointment booked I know when my deadline is, and that we can still meet it.

I hope this helps a bit. I guess in summary you need to work out what's more important to you this month - a definite SA and referral, or a slightly better chance at a BFP (depending on your ov timing).

Nothing to report from me. I'm early on in the 2ww with no symptoms to report.

Wow stasi that was a fast and long response, guess you didn?t do that on your phone! Am now taking my own advice and trying a sneaky Word/copy/paste version!

The problem is my cycles are a bit erratic. I always thought of them as regular but they aren?t, and the last one was only about 23 or 24 days. Going by my average I?m due to OV next Thurs, so the Friday appointment would be fine, but if my cycle is as short as last time (if I even ovulated) it would be earlier, so I guess I don?t want to cut it too fine. I?m also aware that my next period (ie the best time to do this for him) is around Christmas/NY. As you say, we can?t get things referrals moving until this is done; and I am conscious that if I want any chance of IVF on the NHS that needs to be done before my birthday in August, so I need to get a move on. So perhaps I?ll send him in to the bathroom for a freshen up when we get home tonight and hope 2 and a half days rest is enough . On that point, different areas seem to have different rules, I?m sure plenty I?ve read about on here have said 2 days.

I have to say also, I get completely confused about sperm regeneration in general (god I really hope no-one walks up behind me and reads this!). Google tells me it takes 78 days for sperm to regenerate, so why does it make a difference how often you have sex? I?m trying to work it out in my head. Presumably it?s a constant regeneration so let?s say every day the process starts anew for (as an example) 1million sperm. That means 78 days from today, the new sperm will be ready for release into the wild, so to speak! So does that in turn mean there will only ever be 1million available per day (using my example) and hence you have to wait a couple of days to get the number to be high enough to give the odds a fighting chance? But is there not a maximum as well? So let?s say you haven?t had sex for 10 days, are there then 10*1million all ready and waiting, that get released at the same time? Or is there a limit, so say only 5 million get released and there are extras for tomorrow???? . Aware I have not articulated that well and also that the numbers are too low but they are for example only!

Phew, no wonder the advice is most often a simple ?just have sex regularly through your cycle? as I?m beginning to wonder if anyone knows what?s going on at all .

Also now that I?m on a roll is it just me or is the conception board full of particularly optimistic fertile bunnies at the moment? A BFP "announcement" thread, the pregnant even though sterilised thread, people who are only concerned about getting a certain sex of child as they have so many already. I?ve been reading a live birth thread and one of the ladies on there is having her 8th child .

Anyway I?m waffling and being weird today. Luckily it?s nearly time to go home so I can get stuck in to the mulled wine rest. Thanks for the helpful and kind words; although I fear today I may be beyond help .

Nelly when my DH had to do his SA it was brought forward to ensure the results came back before my first fertility appt and he was told that 2 days was fine (even though information said 3-5 days). My vote is get the referral process started. That definitely made me feel better.

Hi nelly. The whole SA thing is a right pain! My DH had to take days of work to do his, due to rubbish hospital opening times. I think Stasi is right about deciding what's most important at the moment and you should still be able to fit in some well timed shagging!

Af has got me today, boo. On the positive side, it is exactly on time and my terrible pmt will hopefully subside. Am gonna give up temping and peeing on sticks this month. Can't be arsed with it all. Bring on christmas and drinking my weekly booze limit in a day! ( how do you do those festive Santa hats on here?!)

Good luck to those of you starting on the drugs.

nelly the sperm is confusing and I bet that is why they say do it three times a week, because it is too mind boggling. dh left it three days last time, or just under. The count was lower than when he left it four but the morphology and motility was much better. In my mind, they start to age and wither if they hang around in the balls too long? id try and get it in so you can move on with the referral, it will be like you are moving forward. I hear you on the panic. But we will be ok in the end.

Today, at 11dpo the palest of spotting greeted me this morning. I feel super despondent. I'd had very promising symptoms this month too, very hot tummy, tinging nipples, lots of cm and a lovely hopeful feeling. I had been hoping for an ironic bfp before the lap. Now it will be well into January before we can try again. And I don't remotely want the stupid op, which I wouldn't even be having if they had booked me in for a day whe my cervix was open and not shut like a clam and not rushed me in and out. Rahhhh! Now I will not be pregnant aged 34 or in 2011. Sad face. And still two or three days to go before my period will even have the decency to appear. I'm having a fat glass of wine to comiserate. Shared af 'pah' with gin

kitty you feeling better?

I had a dream last night where we all met up on this thread only to disguise ourselves we transformed into sheep joycep you had black ears and were galloping around the field it was a very odd two week wait dream. I will probably regret sharing that!

joycep might you be gearing up for ovulation again?

pixie hurray for no clomid symptoms and euro hope the timings work out for you.

December waves to everyone else.

Hi lovelies

nelly really feel for you on the sperm stresses and sense of rising panic. From what you've said, it does sound like getting him to do the sample might be the way forward; it does help you to regain a sense of control once you get the referral side of things moving. Also totally hear you on the wildly optomistic 'bfp thread' thing, it actually drove me to look at the infertility forum again and reconfirmed to me that I wasn't ready for that yet. So maybe not such a bad thing, but made me feel a bit all the same. These new ttc-ers are in such a different place to us lot aren't they. I hope you feel better soon. And yes about the blaming thing. My DH, lovely though he is, is constantly implying that the reason we're not preggars is because I'm too tense about it; I haven't the heart to point out that the only problems we have uncovered have been on his side

gin sorry about af, and wine so sorry about spotting after a positive seeming month. I was really hoping you'd get a yantra-induced bfp and avoid your lap. Booo, and hugs to you. I love your dream would so love to meet all you guys, I reckon I could 'rustle' up a quick sheep outfit as camouflage (sorry).

Thanks for all your good wishes on the puking front. I'm lots better, and made it into work yesterday, and then had an unuttterably shite day at the office and wished I'd stayed under the duvet. I have had a couple of cocktails with a lovely old friend tonight, and it has cheered me up no end. Gotta love alcohol

Waves to everyone xxx

Hi ladies. Thanks again for the words of wisdom. After a small argument about it, OH is going to go to the hospital on Friday. It's such a logistical nightmare though, I agree gin. It's only open 8.30 to 9.30am, so in rush hour traffic that's over an hour away. That means he has to do the sample on site, meaning it takes even longer. OH is normally at his desk well before 8.30 (he left at 6.15 this morning!) so that's a big chunk out of his day. Then there is the timing of the 3-7 day abstinence. Throw into the mix a short cycle, work commitments and weekends etc, I can see why your OH had to take time off! Good to know about the 2 days citysnow, thanks.

Very sorry about the AF gin and I like the idea of a Fuck-It month even though I am a bit lax every month so I'll join you in that. As for the santa hats, just add an F in front of the normal code so [ smile ] becomes [ fsmile ] but without the extra spaces obviously!

Oh wine I'm sorry about the spotting. I am clearly obsessed with what it means (see last week's madness) so it's probably not helpful to say that it doesn't necessarily mean you are out. The other various symptoms are interesting, but I know only too well how this feels, so will offer only a shoulder to cry on at this stage. Your sheep dream did make me laugh though .

Glad you are also alarmed by the infertility board kitty. I feel like a petulant teenager stamping their feet "I won't go there I won't I won't ". Hooray for no more puking, boo for shitey work and hooray again for cocktails. I love cocktails. In fact I am out on Friday for Christmas works do and may well get shit-faced

Hurrah for cocktails and getting shitfaced nelly and kitty! Sometimes alcohol is the answer! I'm having a manic week at work so will be having a BIG drink on Friday, when it's all over.

wine love the sheep dream. Baaa.

Am watching the lovely George Clarke on tv. Wish he'd come and do up our house and I think I could find him a few other 'jobs' around the house...

Oh and

Haha gin me too, he's cute and I do love a man with a slegehammer fnar fnar .

Euro I hadn't heard of Letrozole. It makes me a bit annoyed that though it may be more suitable than Clomid for many women it isn't routinely prescribed whilst the cheaper Clomid is. I really hope that it does the trick for you.

Gin I'm sorry that you've got your AF. If there is a positive to the bitch rearing her head now it is that by Xmas you will be in the optimistic phase of your cycle

Joycep It's promising that your cycle seems to be getting longer. Any movement on that front?

wine I'm sorry that you feel fed up and have spotting. It's always worse when you have had a seemingly "promising" month. Hope you're okay and will refrain from saying that it isn't over until AF comes in full force
BTW I dress up as a sheep for no one...unless of course it would be guaranteed to get me upduffed then in which case I'd happily dress up as every character on Old MacDonalds farm and do the noises too

Nelly It's rubbish that you got panicked. I know that feeling too and am going through a phase where I'm laying in bed unable to breathe properly with everything swimming around my head. It stinks. I also find myself laying in the bath thinking everything over and having imaginary conversations with my as yet unknown new GP about getting a referral for a lap. It's almost feeling like I need to practice what I want to say so I get taken seriously.

Talking of the other threads and feeling like a fraud I don't read much of the other conception stuff anymore let alone venture onto the pregnancy board. Like you say Nelly it feels almost stalkerish and I just feel like they may as well be talking about alien abduction for all the relevance it has to me. I also find the normality of other peoples TTC journey too depressing.

The world of SA's is mind boggling. We weren't advised about timing or anything and I have no idea whether DP fasted, so to speak, or not.

Talking of men with sledgehammers I think my bald men theory may have some mileage. I'm on CD11 and was watching the Renovation Game on TEVO or whatever it's called and was having very inappropriate thoughts about the carpenter with the shaved head. He's only a young boy compared to me FGS - shameful

Sorry if I've missed anyone out. Waves.

Pout it is rubbish. My experiences so far of private and NHS care for fertility issues has been like chalk and cheese. I think it is incredibly unfair that you should have to pay to access better fertility treatment. I realise that we are very lucky to be in a position to be able to afford it (for now).

Gin sorry to hear of AF's arrival. I am 9dpo and sure mine is on the way. It would have been good to get a result on our last unmedicated cycle as I hate taking drugs, but at least we should be moving forward next month.

Nelly we had problems trying to fit in Mr euro's second SA too. He ended up just squeezing it in (fnar) so we got the results a couple of days before we were due back to see the consultant to discuss all the results. He had two and a half months but left it up to the wire!

Right ladies, I am going to brave the cold and pop out for a run. I am trying to get my fitness back on track during my week off!

Afternoon everyone. Just a quick post from me. We managed to get DH's SA done today. Now we just need to wait for the results, then Christmas, then consultant.

Things feel a bit more positive, though I think I'm a bit worried about what the results might be. I don't know if it would be worse to be told we have a problem, or that they can't find a problem. We're not getting there on our own, and I now want some help.

Nelly I've no idea how the old sperm factories work. I know they say it takes 3 months for vitamins etc to affect the sperm, as they need to grow fresh in the new environment. But that the every 2 days is optimal for number of sperm and quality. I think I read somewhere (wikipedia maybe) that quality is better if you do it every day, but quantity is low, and that by the 3rd day degeneration happens. So the best middle ground was every two days. I'm glad your OH agreed to do his SA, I think you'll feel better for it, and he can feel angelic for a while :)

Gin sorry AF got you. I hope you have a nice relaxed month and a wonderful Christmas full of booze merriment.

Wine I really hope it's not what you think it is. Could it be something like implantation? Have your other symptoms subsided? If I were you I'd prepare for the worst, and hope to be proven wrong. I do sincerely hope you are :)

Kitty glad you're feeling better. There's nothing worse than going into work then having a bad day and wishing you hadn't bothered.

Waves to everyone else. Do people all have their work parties this Friday? I've got two to go to, this week and next.

Nelly ? I feel your pain with organising SAs, silly opening times made it that much harder to persuade DH to get it sorted. Glad you?ve got your mr to agree to this Friday.

Gin ? booo to AF, that?s rubbish. But good that it frees you up for guilt-free festivities

Wine ? I hear you on the hopeful month ? things just felt different this month and I thought we were in with a shot for the first time in a long time. I?m sorry it?s not looking that way for you, but you never know?

This is probably too much info but I was hoping the HSG would have give me a nice clear left tube and that, coupled with acupuncture, a good lot of CM and generally feeling more positive would have yielded some results.

I?m on day 5 of spotting now, which should turn into fully blown AF tomorrow. I guess it will either arrive on time or I?ll be in line for a menkulling spectacular until it does show. Can?t even forget about it all with boozy blowout and endless goodies as we?re into IVF prep mode ? everything in moderation [grinch emoticon]

Re the other threads, I don?t venture far away from this luffly place ? didn?t even know there was a separate infertility board but I definitely wouldn?t want to be there yet and I get too wound up/depressed in equal measure by all the new ttcers and their boundless enthusiasm

Euro ? Private vs NHS makes you wonder what else gets glossed over because there are cheaper/quicker/easier options. I have to try very hard not to think about it too much.

I could do with some of that there motivation you have, though I fear I?d get blown away if I tried to run here today, very blustery indeed

Stasi ? good news on getting the SA sorted. Try not to worry too much about whether they will identify a problem or not ? I think we?ve talked a bit about that on here before and everyone thinks differently but sod?s law dictates that whatever turns up, you?ll wish for something different (apart from the obvious and that we all get instantly diffed). When I didn?t know what was wrong, I was hoping that we would get told there was a small issue that could be overcome but now we know what the problems are, I?m still getting my head around it and kind of wish they hadn?t been identified so quickly. That probably makes no sense whatsoever, sorry. Like you say, the most important thing is that you?re on track to getting help and hopefully it will be something and nothing and you can get it sorted quickly.

No Christmas work party for me. Well, I should be going to the office party in London (I?m in Yorkshire) but am not going as I won?t be able to get through the evening without copious amounts of alcohol! I could always host my own at home on my own, I guess

Monster post serious work avoidance

Hi to everyone else!

Hi ladies ? not only have they moved me at work, i?m now sharing my desk with someone. I feel like i?m sitting in a classroom as we are so close we are touching. Anyone he has popped out and so i?m about to do some nifty typing, cutting and pasting whilst reading on the phone.
Firstly nelly - i?m so sorry about the panic. I totally know what that feels like as by the sounds of it deos others. It?s a horrible horrible feeling. I mostly get it at night when my brain refuses to wind down. Sometimes i do get it during the day as well. Luckily it does pass though. In terms of sperm regeneration they do say the man shouldn?t go longer than 5 days without ejaculating. I believe sperm just go mouldy after a while. My dh had a bug in his prostrate a few months ago and my consultant said it was better to get an iui sample with 2-3 day sperm rather than 5 day one.
gin - sorry about af...i hope you?r e feeling ok.
wine - sorry about the spotting. It?s all so f?ing hard.
I?m on the longest cycle in my entire life. I?ll refrain from asking ?can you get pregnant without ovulating??...of course this has been crossing my mind. I thought AF was on her way this time last week but i?ve been in a filthy temper the last two days so she must be coming now. I received a text from smug mum friend and my first thoughts were ?what the hell does she want? . What a horrible witch i am at the moment. Everyone has been annoying me.
Waving at everyone else....pout, kitty , euro.

Evening. How is everyone? DH is out tonight and I am in bed with DVDs, the cat and drinks. So far have had a sloe gin, a gin and tonic (can you see a theme developing) and a large mug of winter Pimms. I decided today I am going to fully give into alcohol this month. I'm so weary of TTC at the moment, I'm going to get pissed for a month

joycep so sorry about your cycle going nutty. Just so, so frustrating. I hope that either you get a magic non ovulating BFP or AF hurries up so you can move on. You must be totally fed up - here have a

ladygee and wine still hoping the ERTD stays away for you. No office party for me either. My team is spread across the country and we're not getting together this year. So will mainly just be drinking at home in bed

stasi glad your DH got the SA done. Another step along the road to that BFP.

euro hope your run went well.

pout at dressing up as a sheep being the secret to a bfp. I read another one tonight - pomegranates. Apparently its a big thing in Japan with infertile women.

gin I google image'd George Clarke and he is v cute.

Ugh - earlier, by accident, i watched some of that TV programme which is basically just moaning about the UK. Can't remember what it's called, but what a load of shite.

Haha kitty I'm always up for getting shit-faced . Drinking in bed is my favourite way. No falling over, you're in the right place to pass out, and there's never a queue for the loo! Hmm Nigella has a recipe for a pomegranate martini I think - would that work?

joycep sorry for the weird cycle, and also that you too have felt the panic. It's a really horrid feeling isn't it. Like you it's usually lying in bed, when I'm over-tired. Luckily it doesn't happen often, but it knocks me for six. I think you should post the thread - chances are some cheery soul will come and tell you it's entirely possible . And also, eugh to mouldy sperm

Evening all.

kitty I am envious you are in bed! The horrendous rain woke me up at 4 and I didn't get back to sleep so I am zzzz. I am with you with the oh fuck it and the living in a limbo not drinking land and have had a fat glass of wine tonight and had one yesterday. And I'll have one tomorrow. With the exception of one night in January where not drinking isn't really an option, Mr Wine and I (Mr Beer really) have gravely sworn to have a dry January. So I'm getting them in while I can. Also, as AF loiters around outside (read - high temps but sore boobs and spotting) I have had a tea platter of:

brie
blue cheese
pate
salami
nuts

with a big salad! Take that banned pregnancy foods. I am so SICK of trying to conceive. Someone at work is actually planning her leave next year precisely according to when she has DECIDED her baby will be born, to the exact day. And naturally it will happen and it's so so so so so heartbreakingly annoying that some people do really choose when their baby will come, like ordering something off Amazon. How very dare they!!!

At the risk of outing myself to people who may recognise me, or the script writers of Corrie, at some point in the very very near future I will turn 35, the geriatric death knoll of uber fertility. One of my gifts will be my period. I can only hope that in the next few years I can laugh about it. Because it feels pretty pants right now.

joycep am I allowed to ask if you have considered taking a test? Did I tell you that my gp thinks temping is guff? And that according to his wife's preg chart there was no way she could have conceived? May you poke one in the eye to charting and 'taking charge of your fertility' which is the exact opposite of what I've done for an entire 13 months. What a joke of a title!! I also entirely blame that book for me thinking I am broken and barren. I might burn it.

ladygee spotting shared comiserations. Do you worry about it? I try not to, but it is annoying.

pout I too would dress up as a sheep if there was a promise of pregnancy! I actually worry about what I wouldn't do..if it was guaranteed...

euro one of us is entitled to an ironic bfp - fingers crossed for you.

This is a very pre-menstrual posting for which I am slightly sorry. But not sorry enough to not post it. I will go to bed and read instead now.

Cross post nelly

and bleugh at mouldy blow jobs. I often think I'm pregnant on my period. I might just order 50 cheapie tests and test myself silly at some point soon to get it out of my head.

Maybe after our Christmas drinking we will have a wave of bfps because we 'relaxed'

.

wine boo to you to turning 35, but shame on you about bringing up the effect that has on fertility, given I had that milestone 2 years ago! Though of course that would be reassuring to you if I'd actually got pregnant, so now we are both depressed .

Oh just remembered. At my Christmas party last year, I told one friend/colleague that we were starting TTC, as I was pissed (a theme perhaps?). Anyway don't chat to her often but we were talking about work today and I said something along the lines of it's all fine, albeit I'd rather not have to come in at all - just meaning a generic Oh I wish I'd win the lottery kind of thing. She replied "aw, you'll get there" which reminded me I'd told her last year about the TTC . So on a scale of 1-10, how likely is it that I'll a) cry on her shoulder whilst hammered on Friday and b) tell someone else too. Answers on a postcard!

I'm dreading the return to work post maternity leave of someone whose parting words to me were "you'll be next" and here I am 12 + months later... But someone else at work is now 20 weeks and aged 41 so very pleased for her. And pleased as that makes me think there is still plenty of time. Oh course she said it happened when she had basically given up - and surely we have all reached that point now!

I so hate taking charge of your fertility. What a fecking joke. wine I will happily join you in a ritual burning of that book which as far as I'm concerned should be titled 'you are faulty, why not give up right now'

wine I do hope you have a lovely birthday despite everything. Any plans?

nelly commiserations in advance for drunken ttc ramblings at colleagues. Let it out, I say, and bring on the pomegranate martinis. Also will you give your secret hobby animal friends a little drunken Christmas stroke from me [soppy about horses emoticon]